Do LDS openly acknowledge that their religion teaches the belief of multiple gods?

[Kdesiel]

RebeccaJ,
The original question brought up the Bible. Your comment talked about “Christian understanding”, which I have to assume you mean is founded in Biblical understanding.

If you or Twopekinguys want to discuss the specific verses in the Bible that form the basis of your assertions about my beliefs versus your beliefs, then I am more than happy to do that in a respectful way.

A person who disparages another person’s beliefs and does so inferring that their own beliefs are based on the Bible, had best have become a “Bible scholar” before they do that or they might as well spend their time becoming one–that would be time better spent.

Very defensive and arrogant. Are these the characteristics you extrapolate from the Bible through your studies?

The Savior, taught humility, he also taught understanding. His example was a humble one especially when faced with the so called “Scholars” of his day. I see no where in your communication here with T.P. or Rebecca where you utilized those traits in your own attempt to teach or enlighten.

 

[dianaiad]

Mormons Believe in
God the Father
God the Son
God the Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit.
God the Father and God the Son - Jesus Christ BOTH have distinct and individual physical bodies.
Mormons teach and believe that “As God is now, man may become, as man is now God once was.” Think about the meaning in the words just stated. Man has the potential to become God, to create his own works, his own worlds without number. Mormons believe this is part of Eternal progression. After this life they we believe we will continue to learn and serve God allowing us to prgress to “Exaltation” meaning Godhood. In this exalted state we then can create our own worlds without end, our own race of mankind drawn from the spirit children we create with our wife/wives.
If Mormons believe that God was once man, and they do, they believe he had to progress through a first and second estate like the rest of us, then who was the God that he worshipped at the time? Who was the Savior to that Plan of Salvation? If the concept of eternal progression holds true then there are many who have become Gods, who are in the process of becoming Gods and so on and so on.
Mormons are encouraged not to think of this, the fact that there are multiple Gods and focus their faith on the God which created us. In Fact because of their individual and distinct differences Mormons worship 3 Gods, God the Father, His Son Jesus Christ, and the Holy Ghost. They Comprise the Mormon Godhead. Three Personages with one purpose, “To Bring to pass the immortality and exaltation of man.”

This is not anti-Mormon rhetoric, nor is it meant to shade the LDS religion in a Bad light; these are simply the teachings of the church, well documented in LDS Scripture such as the Book of Abraham within the Pearl of Great Price as well as various discourses given by many LDS Prophets. Any LDS member who takes umbrage with what I have presented does not “Know their Religion.” Older members should remember that class…Good times.

Hope this information is helpful.

In fact, you are right in most things you have written here. The difference, I think, would be in this: Truly monotheistic religions (like Judaism and Islam) say the same thing about Christianity; all of us worship three Gods. Orthodox Christianity hates this idea, and tries to reconcile it with the idea of the Trinity…some go all the way to modalism. However, as I mentioned, to a TRUE monotheistic religion even this doesn’t fly.

Mormons believe that there are Three in the Godhead; they are absolutely one in purpose and thought (I keep wanting to put another word in there just to keep the rhetoric pleasing and to keep the ‘three’ going, but ‘intent’ is the same thing as ‘purpose’) And then there is that "thing’ nobody can quite describe–a power of the priesthood…something, anyway, that makes them all three God. Something that none of the rest of us have.

And yes, we do ACKNOWLEDGE that there may be other gods…but if there are, they have their own universes and we neither know who, or how many there are, but we have absolutely no dealings with them. Therefore they are not important to our salvations, or even to our doctrines–IF they exist. God the Father, His Son Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghost created the universe…everything around us; all space, all time; anything we can possibly encounter was created by Him through His Son.

As to that, there is this other small but important aspect of our worship. We do not pray to Jesus. I can’t think of a single prayer we say, scripted or un–that addresses Jesus. We pray to His Father THROUGH Jesus. We recognize the role Jesus plays in our salvation; we honor that HE 'bought us with a price…" and so everything we do must be through Him…but we do not pray TO, but THROUGH, Him.

So…in one way you could call us polytheist–or rather, ‘henotheist,’ but in another, we are more monotheistic than those who pray to God AND Jesus, or even who pray to others for intercession WITH them.

More importantly, though, than all the titles and classifications one might assign to us is this:

we’re right.

 

[RebeccaJ]

Christianity is monotheist. That people of other beliefs cannot believe in the One Triune God does not mean they understand correctly the belief of the Trinity. Mormonism also rejects the One Triune God, in favor of a multiplicity of gods.

The God a person worships is the very basis of their “religion”. It defines who they are. Christians do not worship a God of many gods. We worship The God, The ONLY God. There are no others. There is no “IF”.

 

[Kdesiel]

In fact, you are right in most things you have written here. The difference, I think, would be in this: Truly monotheistic religions (like Judaism and Islam) say the same thing about Christianity; all of us worship three Gods. Orthodox Christianity hates this idea, and tries to reconcile it with the idea of the Trinity…some go all the way to modalism. However, as I mentioned, to a TRUE monotheistic religion even this doesn’t fly.

Mormons believe that there are Three in the Godhead; they are absolutely one in purpose and thought (I keep wanting to put another word in there just to keep the rhetoric pleasing and to keep the ‘three’ going, but ‘intent’ is the same thing as ‘purpose’) And then there is that "thing’ nobody can quite describe–a power of the priesthood…something, anyway, that makes them all three God. Something that none of the rest of us have.

And yes, we do ACKNOWLEDGE that there may be other gods…but if there are, they have their own universes and we neither know who, or how many there are, but we have absolutely no dealings with them. Therefore they are not important to our salvations, or even to our doctrines–IF they exist. God the Father, His Son Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghost created the universe…everything around us; all space, all time; anything we can possibly encounter was created by Him through His Son.

As to that, there is this other small but important aspect of our worship. We do not pray to Jesus. I can’t think of a single prayer we say, scripted or un–that addresses Jesus. We pray to His Father THROUGH Jesus. We recognize the role Jesus plays in our salvation; we honor that HE 'bought us with a price…" and so everything we do must be through Him…but we do not pray TO, but THROUGH, Him.

So…in one way you could call us polytheist–or rather, ‘henotheist,’ but in another, we are more monotheistic than those who pray to God AND Jesus, or even who pray to others for intercession WITH them.

More importantly, though, than all the titles and classifications one might assign to us is this:

we’re right.

Mostly right? No it’s all right. It is all solid Mormon teaching without even a tinge of anti aspects.

As to how you closed your post, enough said about you. Arrogance is never a becoming quality, in fact it is a hindrance to gaining understanding which judging by your posts, for the most part explains a lot.

 

[RebeccaJ]

A person who disparages another person’s beliefs and does so inferring that their own beliefs are based on the Bible, had best have become a “Bible scholar” before they do that or they might as well spend their time becoming one–that would be time better spent.

While you’re at it, explain to me how telling people what Mormons believe is disparaging your beliefs?

Also, thank you for your concern regarding my time. You should understand though Parker, it is discussions like this that sent me to studying the Bible to begin with, so I do both. I discuss and study at the same time. Since you have such a concern for my Bible study habits, I also read and pray regularly. As you will recall, I gave you the lectio divina. Do I have the knowledge of an adult who has studied the Bible their entire lives, no, I do not. But Parker, I do have the knowledge God has given me, and I do have good comprehension skills, and I do get annoyed at people who read the Bible with an end in mind. Like Mormons do.

I may have been an atheist, but my atheism allowed me to approach the Bible with no end in mind, whatsoever. Only to read it. You can believe ParkerD, I spend 2 years in this study, which was also a comparison to what I learned in Mormonism, and I was illuminated, by God, to His teachings.

I cannot give you chapter and verse off the top of my head, but I can teach you from the Bible. Only thing is, you are one of those people that already know everything and so are unteachable.

 

[FidesSpesCarita]

Please Parker, as though you could teach anyone here about the teaching in the Bible. You think Jesus always has in his mind ways to trick people.

I may not be a Bible scholar but I know the Bible well enough to understand what it teaches about God. The first teaching you should understand is there is One God and no other. This is a basic commandment. I think you know it. Tell everyone how Mormons understand this commandment, and then continue to tell us how you don’t believe in multiple Gods.

Very defensive and arrogant. Are these the characteristics you extrapolate from the Bible through your studies?

The Savior, taught humility, he also taught understanding. His example was a humble one especially when faced with the so called “Scholars” of his day. I see no where in your communication here with T.P. or Rebecca where you utilized those traits in your own attempt to teach or enlighten.

RebeccaJ,
The original question brought up the Bible. Your comment talked about “Christian understanding”, which I have to assume you mean is founded in Biblical understanding.

If you or Twopekinguys want to discuss the specific verses in the Bible that form the basis of your assertions about my beliefs versus your beliefs, then I am more than happy to do that in a respectful way.

A person who disparages another person’s beliefs and does so inferring that their own beliefs are based on the Bible, had best have become a “Bible scholar” before they do that or they might as well spend their time becoming one–that would be time better spent.

I have nothing of weight to add to this thread except this comment.

While many of the LDS posts on this thread are dismissive, I think that none of them (with the possible exception of the bible reading comment) have been rude. I think that it is fair to say that Mormons are not Christians as any Non-Mormon Christian would define it, but that is their opinion. While we do not have to accept or promote their opinion as false, we should not be rude in return. Any perceived slight should be brushed off.

Please show love in truth as we are called to do. It is something that I struggle with every day, but it is something that I am working toward.

With love,

FSC

 

[ParkerD]

To the general reader,
Evidently from some remarks on this thread, people are offended if it is suggested to them that they should read the Bible. I don’t understand why. The Savior Himself said “Search the scriptures,…”

I’ve read the comments, but I see no point in discussing these issues further. I appreciate Dianaiad’s superlative comment. Thanks, Diana.

Have a good day, all.

 

[CHRISTINE77]

In fact, you are right in most things you have written here. The difference, I think, would be in this: Truly monotheistic religions (like Judaism and Islam) say the same thing about Christianity; all of us worship three Gods. Orthodox Christianity hates this idea, and tries to reconcile it with the idea of the Trinity…some go all the way to modalism. However, as I mentioned, to a TRUE monotheistic religion even this doesn’t fly.

Mormons believe that there are Three in the Godhead; they are absolutely one in purpose and thought (I keep wanting to put another word in there just to keep the rhetoric pleasing and to keep the ‘three’ going, but ‘intent’ is the same thing as ‘purpose’) And then there is that "thing’ nobody can quite describe–a power of the priesthood…something, anyway, that makes them all three God. Something that none of the rest of us have.

And yes, we do ACKNOWLEDGE that there may be other gods…but if there are, they have their own universes and we neither know who, or how many there are, but we have absolutely no dealings with them. Therefore they are not important to our salvations, or even to our doctrines–IF they exist. God the Father, His Son Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghost created the universe…everything around us; all space, all time; anything we can possibly encounter was created by Him through His Son.

As to that, there is this other small but important aspect of our worship. We do not pray to Jesus. I can’t think of a single prayer we say, scripted or un–that addresses Jesus. We pray to His Father THROUGH Jesus. We recognize the role Jesus plays in our salvation; we honor that HE 'bought us with a price…" and so everything we do must be through Him…but we do not pray TO, but THROUGH, Him.

So…in one way you could call us polytheist–or rather, ‘henotheist,’ but in another, we are more monotheistic than those who pray to God AND Jesus, or even who pray to others for intercession WITH them.

More importantly, though, than all the titles and classifications one might assign to us is this:

we’re right.

I’m curious of how Mormons see the Holy Spirit. Is it a dove or a ghost or the spirituality of God descending upon men? I understand that you view God the Father and Jesus as two separate persons with one intent, but what about the Holy Spirit?

 

[Kdesiel]

I’m curious of how Mormons see the Holy Spirit. Is it a dove or a ghost or the spirituality of God descending upon men? I understand that you view God the Father and Jesus as two separate persons with one intent, but what about the Holy Spirit?

The Holy Spirit in the Mormon view is a “Personage of Spirit” He has the appearance of a physical body but being comprised of “Spirit” matter.

 

[CHRISTINE77]

The Holy Spirit in the Mormon view is a “Personage of Spirit” He has the appearance of a physical body but being comprised of “Spirit” matter.

So Mormons are always talking about praying for guidance, and the Holy Spirit comes and helps them resolve their dilemmas. But it sounds more like the way mainstream Christians believe, that we pray to God and are filled with the Holy Spirit which gives us discernment.

What is the appearance of physical body of the Holy Spirit?

 

[Kdesiel]

So Mormons are always talking about praying for guidance, and the Holy Spirit comes and helps them resolve their dilemmas. But it sounds more like the way mainstream Christians believe, that we pray to God and are filled with the Holy Spirit which gives us discernment.

What is the appearance of physical body of the Holy Spirit?

I believe his default appearence would be that of a man.

Mormons believe personal revelation is communicated from God through the Holy Spirit. He is the conduit persay for personal revelation, or for revelation in General. Since God the Father and Jesus have physical bodies of Flesh and Bone they cannot be in two different places at the same time, thus the Holy Ghost is used as the messenger.
That’s how I understood it as a Mormon.

 

[wmscott]

OK, because I know about nothing of the Mormon religion I want to ask the following question, they were taken from this site. Please indicate which number is true and which is false.

1. “God the Father” to a Mormon is not God the Father, first Person of the Holy Trinity, whom Christians confess. He is one of many gods.
2. The Mormon worships God the Father because he is the god of this planet, but other planets have other gods equal to or even greater than God the Father.
3. The Mormon “God the Father” had a Father and was once a man on a planet who worshipped his own Father God. He was subsequently exalted to godhood. He has a physical, human body.
4. It is the hope of the male Mormon to progress to the point where he too will be a god like God the Father and be ruling over his own planet.
5. The Mormons have a saying: “What man is, God once was; what God is, man will become.” This is polytheism.
6. The Mormon Jesus is the spirit brother of Lucifer (Satan). They were both born in heaven by God the Father’s union with one of his many spirit wives.
7. According to Mormon teaching, when it was time for Jesus to come down to earth, God the Father sent down one of his spirit wives from heaven to be born as a woman, Mary. Then he came down and had physical, marital relations with her in order for her to give birth to a human body inhabited by Jesus coming from heaven. This is a denial of the Virgin Birth.
8. According to Mormonism, all human beings existed as spirit children of God and his wife in heaven before coming to earth.
9. They grow to spirit “adulthood”, serving God (even fighting in heavenly battles), and are then sent to earth to be babies of human parents.
10. The earthly life is their opportunity to become gods themselves, like their heavenly Father by “obeying the laws of the Gospel” just as the god of this planet once did.
11. While heaven is the presence of God with unfettered communion, the distinction between God and creatures remains (Rev. 5.13,14).

Thanks in advance.

 

[thecourt]

OK, because I know about nothing of the Mormon religion I want to ask the following question, they were taken from this site. Please indicate which number is true and which is false.

1. “God the Father” to a Mormon is not God the Father, first Person of the Holy Trinity, whom Christians confess. He is one of many gods.
2. The Mormon worships God the Father because he is the god of this planet, but other planets have other gods equal to or even greater than God the Father.
3. The Mormon “God the Father” had a Father and was once a man on a planet who worshipped his own Father God. He was subsequently exalted to godhood. He has a physical, human body.
4. It is the hope of the male Mormon to progress to the point where he too will be a god like God the Father and be ruling over his own planet.
5. The Mormons have a saying: “What man is, God once was; what God is, man will become.” This is polytheism.
6. The Mormon Jesus is the spirit brother of Lucifer (Satan). They were both born in heaven by God the Father’s union with one of his many spirit wives.
7. According to Mormon teaching, when it was time for Jesus to come down to earth, God the Father sent down one of his spirit wives from heaven to be born as a woman, Mary. Then he came down and had physical, marital relations with her in order for her to give birth to a human body inhabited by Jesus coming from heaven. This is a denial of the Virgin Birth.
8. According to Mormonism, all human beings existed as spirit children of God and his wife in heaven before coming to earth.
9. They grow to spirit “adulthood”, serving God (even fighting in heavenly battles), and are then sent to earth to be babies of human parents.
10. The earthly life is their opportunity to become gods themselves, like their heavenly Father by “obeying the laws of the Gospel” just as the god of this planet once did.
11. While heaven is the presence of God with unfettered communion, the distinction between God and creatures remains (Rev. 5.13,14).

Thanks in advance.

You do not know what my church believes and spreading this garbage confirms to me those who have a agenda to state for my church what it believes. Trust me, the church is doing quite well by itself without the need your help, particularly when what you say is false.

 

[ralphinal]

You do not know what my church believes and spreading this garbage confirms to me those who have a agenda to state for my church what it believes. Trust me, the church is doing quite well by itself without the need your help, particularly when what you say is false.

Court,
Would you be so kind as to show where the errors are on his list?

I know that this has been done before, and will be again, but in the interest of charity and sharing knowledge, please help

 

[wmscott]

You do not know what my church believes and spreading this garbage confirms to me those who have a agenda to state for my church what it believes. Trust me, the church is doing quite well by itself without the need your help, particularly when what you say is false.

You are absolutely correct!!! I do not know what your church believes, this is why I have asked the specific questions that I have. I have also provided the link as to where I got this information to provide a source of where I got them. I was not being dishonest, there is a Catholic site that makes these points, and I just want to know which are true and which are false. Your answer is an attempt to divert my questions and tends to make one think that they are either true, or you do not know the answers. If it is the latter just say so I won’t think bad of you.

 

[dianaiad]

OK, because I know about nothing of the Mormon religion I want to ask the following question, they were taken from this site. Please indicate which number is true and which is false.

1. “God the Father” to a Mormon is not God the Father, first Person of the Holy Trinity, whom Christians confess. He is one of many gods.

Actually…no. God the Father is God the Father, the First Member of the God-head. His Son, Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghosts are the two other Members of the Godhead. They are one in intent and purpose, and a certain quality of being “God” that nobody else has. Catholics believe that this quality is a ‘substance’ that in effect makes them One even as they are completely different Personages, each separate. We believe that they are indeed separate, to a greater extent than they do–or perhaps we are talking semantics. I dunno.

Anyway, we do believe that God the Father is God the Father, Creater of all things through His Son, Jesus Christ.

1. The Mormon worships God the Father because he is the god of this planet, but other planets have other gods equal to or even greater than God the Father.

No. We believe that God created the entire universe. “Worlds with out number,” even. Everything we see, or can see, in earth or sky, to the furthest reaches of everything.

1. The Mormon “God the Father” had a Father and was once a man on a planet who worshipped his own Father God. He was subsequently exalted to godhood. He has a physical, human body.

Well, yeah. Sorta. Though most of us believe that it’s more like God used to be someone like Jesus.

1. It is the hope of the male Mormon to progress to the point where he too will be a god like God the Father and be ruling over his own planet.

Not exactly. See answer to # 2

1. The Mormons have a saying: “What man is, God once was; what God is, man will become.” This is polytheism.

Yes, we have that saying. And no, that is NOT polytheism, strictly. Henotheism, perhaps. Actually, we are closer to monotheism than most Christians are, because although trinitarian Christians worship, and pray to, all the members of the Trinity, we pray to only one of them; God the Father, through His Son, Jesus Christ.

1. The Mormon Jesus is the spirit brother of Lucifer (Satan). They were both born in heaven by God the Father’s union with one of his many spirit wives.

Yep, they are spiritual brothers…and y’know, the first time I was accused of believing this, my first response was…yeah, so? I could NOT understand the sort of horrified angst that went along with that. I mean…so what? ALL of us are the children of God, we believe; angels, men, the whole kit and caboodle. So in that sense we are all spiritual brethren. It’s not as if we believe that Jesus and Lucifer have a special relationship that they don’t share with the rest of us, after all. So in that sense, Lucifer is Jesus’ brother. But then in that sense so are you, and I am His sister. Lucifer screwed up. Some of God’s other children have ALSO royally screwed up.

In another sense, though, Jesus HAS no brothers and sisters. He is the Only Begotten Son of God in the flesh. In that sense, then, He has no full blooded brothers and sisters. Especially not Lucifer, whom we believe will never have a mortal body, much less one that is tied in any familial way to the Christ.

1. According to Mormon teaching, when it was time for Jesus to come down to earth, God the Father sent down one of his spirit wives from heaven to be born as a woman, Mary. Then he came down and had physical, marital relations with her in order for her to give birth to a human body inhabited by Jesus coming from heaven. This is a denial of the Virgin Birth.

Uh…no. None of the above is accurate. Sorry. We most definately believe in the virgin birth.
I’ve never heard of the “arranging for one of His wives to be born as Mary.” (grin) I have to admit, every so often one of you pulls a new one. Congratulations, you win this week’s prize.

1. According to Mormonism, all human beings existed as spirit children of God and his wife in heaven before coming to earth.

Yep. So far that’s what, one correct thing out of 8, so far? You might want to relate this belief to # 6

1. They grow to spirit “adulthood”, serving God (even fighting in heavenly battles), and are then sent to earth to be babies of human parents.

If you are referring to that ‘war in heaven,’ well, yeah…though I think that was more about choosing and voting, not fighting and killing.

1. The earthly life is their opportunity to become gods themselves, like their heavenly Father by “obeying the laws of the Gospel” just as the god of this planet once did.

See the response to #2…but the part about ‘obeying heavenly laws’ is about right.

1. While heaven is the presence of God with unfettered communion, the distinction between God and creatures remains (Rev. 5.13,14).

uh, HUH?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Stephen168]

Catholics believe that this quality is a ‘substance’ that in effect makes them One even as they are completely different Personages, each separate.

I think you should stop trying to explain Catholic beliefs to Catholics. It just makes you look bad.

 

[CHRISTINE77]

I think you should stop trying to explain Catholic beliefs to Catholics. It just makes you look bad.

 

[Kdesiel]

I think you should stop trying to explain Catholic beliefs to Catholics. It just makes you look bad.

Here Here!

 

[dianaiad]

I think you should stop trying to explain Catholic beliefs to Catholics. It just makes you look bad.

I don’t want to do that. Tell me how I got that wrong, please?