Do members of non-Cathoic denominations believe their church is the One True Church of Jesus Christ?

[Nicea325]

Quote:
Originally Posted by rovimax
If Jesus established a Church why other men established their own? Mat 16 is very clear only one Church was built. Nothing else, only the selfish one’s built their own church that’s why there are plenty now…

I

don’t know, why did some men from Rome find the Roman Catholic church, and say Jesus found it. It’s beyond me!

What men from Rome? Provide the names of the men who founded the Roman Catholic Church?

It stems from Apostolic Traditions that Peter who was the head apostle and given the keys to bind and loose spent His last days at Rome. However,Peter did not found his own church,he simply was carrying on what Christ already established: His Church.There is plenty of early church writings supporting it. Now,if you deny the current historical evidence of Peter at Rome,then provide the historical evidence giving us a different tradition?

 

[Nicea325]

Texasgringo70:

So Nicea325 calling protestants an underground, insignificant sect is not an attack, but me bringing up the possibility that the church might not have acted charitably towards Polycarp and Luther is an attack. I think I got it now.

That is not what I said or meant to convey to you or any Protestant. I apologize if you misunderstood me. I was refering to Christ and His church and how he did not want it to be some insignificant sect. I did not mean it towards Protestants.

 

[LittleSoldier]

Philippians 1:15 Some, to be sure, are preaching Christ even from envy and strife, but some also from good will; 16 the latter do it out of love, knowing that I am appointed for the defense of the gospel; 17 the former proclaim Christ out of selfish ambition rather than from pure motives, thinking to cause me distress in my imprisonment. 18 What then? Only that in every way, whether in pretense or in truth, Christ is proclaimed; and in this I rejoice. Yes, and I will rejoice.

The apostle Paul was happy enough to see others preach Christ even with selfish motives. We could argue about who is selfish and and who has pure motives, but that would only divide us further. Would it not benefit us more to simply rejoice like the apostle Paul that Christ is being preached by protestants and catholics alike?

Would it not benefit us more to rejoice that we are faithful to the Church that Jesus founded? The Catholic Church? And then rejoice that the message of Christ is being shared by those who know Truth?

Or is it better for a minister from one protestant church to preach Christ by saying infant baptism is wrong and a minister from another protestant church to preach Christ by saying infant baptism is perfectly OK? What kind of jumbled-up message is that?

I’m confused as to why you even brought up this passage. Who has selfish motives? The Catholic Church? Nope. Any protestant church? I don’t know but you introduced it and it appears to me that you are saying that it’s OK to belong to a protestant church because it’s OK to selfishly preach the message of Christ (please correct me if I’m wrong).

 

[Nicea325]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nicea325
And what gave you the idea or impression the Catholic Church has taught for 2,000 years that "church’ is a only a building?

Nothing. I said building OR organization to be inclusive of various beliefs so as to not offend. I tried again, but it didn’t work, again.

Okay my bad for misunderstanding you.

Quote:
The church is organic and it is living and with all human institutions,organization is usually part of the package. I think Jesus words: Go and preach to ALL nations, means He wanted His Church to grow and develop,not remain some underground insignifcant sect.

Thank you very much for the example of the double standard of which I mentioned. You are very consistent in belittling protestant denominations. Your contempt oozes out so naturally. Heaven forbid if anyone reciprocate and express even a fraction of the disrespect (you have for protestants) toward the Catholic Church.

Well my apologies if you misunderstood me. My statement of insignifcant sect is not a reference to ANY Protestant,Fundamentalist,Evangelical,etc, but as to Christ Church which he founded here on earth.

Quote:
Catholics also believe the church is the Body of Believers,but under the same ‘universal’ doctrine and deposit of faith.

So why the contempt for protestants? Oh, that’s right, we aren’t really Christians. We are just an underground, insignificant sect. I’m OK with being respectful to the Catholic Church. I am not OK with rolling over every time my faith is trashed. If y’all are going to demand respect, how about showing some to the rest of us so we can see how that works?

Again,I my intent was not trash your faith in any shape or form. I know you are a God-loving Christian as are many Protestants.

Again, my apologies for coming across as insulting or disrespectful,those were not my intentions.

 

[LittleSoldier]

Okay my bad for misunderstanding you.

Well my apologies if you misunderstood me. My statement of insignifcant sect is not a reference to ANY Protestant,Fundamentalist,Evangelical,etc, but as to Christ Church which he founded here on earth.

Again,I my intent was not trash your faith in any shape or form. I know you are a God-loving Christian as are many Protestants.

Again, my apologies for coming across as insulting or disrespectful,those were not my intentions.

I can’t see anywhere where you came across as insulting or disrespectful. You didn’t even mention any or all protestant churches when you made your comment about “insignificant sect.” Someone assumed that’s what you meant, but it’s clear to me that you didn’t.

 

[Johnwesley]

The point is we don’t have the name of the men who found the church. It was true that Jesus said to peter “Upon this rock I will bouild my church.” Ive gotten into argument’s with the Church of Christ saying they found it. The point is the Catholic stuff is a myth Jesus found the Christian church!! When you see people out on the streets suffering, do yall people help them or ask them if there Catholic, because yall seem to be denying the scriptures. There is nowhere in the BIBLE where Jesus founded the CATHOLIC church he found the uneversal church! And Church of Christ believes they were the first to!(They weren’t)

 

[LittleSoldier]

I like your sarcasm. I feel the same way some times (with the rolls reversed), but if I express it here I can get in trouble.

I am not really sure how to square the bit about truth with Vatican II. If protestant teaching can lead to salvation (according to Vatican II) is it really in error? Obviously there are some lines that cannot be crossed, but if results are the the standard by which methods are judged, why is it so hard to accept that we are all on the same team here?

Look, what I saw in your post was disrespect to the Catholic Church and I told you what I saw. Now it appears to me that you are using my statements to you as some sort of shield which you can back down behind and then say “well, I could say the same about you, but if I do I can get in trouble.”

Forget my post. I’m only a member here, just like you. Forget I ever said anything about what I perceived as disrespect to the Church. And please stop using my comments in such a twisted way.

 

[Johnwesley]

Does that include a rapist/torturer/murderer of small children who was saved a year ago and believes in Jesus and will keep on raping/torturing/murdering small children until the day he dies?

If they keep on doing that theyre not truly saved.

 

[Nicea325]

I can’t see anywhere where you came across as insulting or disrespectful. You didn’t even mention any or all protestant churches when you made your comment about “insignificant sect.” Someone assumed that’s what you meant, but it’s clear to me that you didn’t.

Well thank you for noticing too. Texasgringo70 simply misunderstood me and believed I was being disrespectful and I was not.

 

[LittleSoldier]

If they keep on doing that theyre not truly saved.

What if the person who is doing this absolutely believed in God, asked Him to come into his heart, prayed and prayed and prayed and left himself open to the Holy Spirit, accepted that Jesus sacrificed Himself to open the gates of heaven, and fully believed with his whole heart, soul, and mind that Jesus has saved him and was baptized?

Does that saving go away? I was under the impression that once a person is saved, that person is saved. And as this person still has faith and faith alone is sufficient (according to the KJB), why isn’t he saved?

 

[LittleSoldier]

I don’t know, why did some men from Rome find the Roman Catholic church, and say Jesus found it. It’s beyond me!

Who are these men from Rome?

 

[Nicea325]

QUOTE=Johnwesley;6730444]The point is we don’t have the name of the men who found the church.

Well if you have no empirical-historical evidence,then why make the assertion or presuppositions some men founded the church at Rome?

It was true that Jesus said to peter “Upon this rock I will bouild my church.” Ive gotten into argument’s with the Church of Christ saying they found it.

Yeah thousand of the other Protestant,Evangelical,Fundamentalist churches have claimed the same.Does not matter,because history proves them all wrong.

The point is the Catholic stuff is a myth Jesus found the Christian church!!

Excuse me? A Catholic 'myth" Jesus founded the Christian church? Then who? John Wesley? Martin Luther? John Knox? Chuck Smith?

When you see people out on the streets suffering, do yall people help them or ask them if there Catholic, because yall seem to be denying the scriptures.

I beg your pardon? Deny the scriptures? And is bearing false witness not in your Bible? Help the less fortunate? Well I hate to rain on your parade,but the Catholic Church started doing it long before any Protestant church existed.

There is nowhere in the BIBLE where Jesus founded the CATHOLIC church he found the uneversal church! And Church of Christ believes they were the first to!(They weren’t)

No where in the Bible? Then you cannot discern between bibical exegesis and eisegesis.The term eisegesis literally means “to lead into,” which means the interpreter injects his own ideas into the text, making it mean whatever he wants.

Ahhhhhh…Go and preach to ALL NATIONS…baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit.

Christ Church IS universal and the term ALL is inclusive of Christ universal church.

Sorry,but you are wrong.

 

[LittleSoldier]

I don’t know, why did some men from Rome find the Roman Catholic church, and say Jesus found it. It’s beyond me!

I’m very confused by your post. It’s not really the Roman Catholic Church. It’s the Catholic Church and one of its rites is the Latin Rite, which many times is rather mistakenly called the Roman Catholic Church. If you look at my religious affiliation you’ll see what I mean.

I think we all agree that Jesus founded a church. His Church. And He said that the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. That means that it will not be in error, although those in hell would certainly want it to be.

But what about the next part of the passage? Why was Peter given the keys to the kingdom of heaven? There is something very important about Peter and it has to do with Jesus’ Church. Peter was the first pope. The line has continued to this day, from pope to pope to pope.

The same can’t be said of any other church, no matter the denomination.

What do you think Peter being given the keys to the kingdom of heaven means?

 

[LittleSoldier]

The point is we don’t have the name of the men who found the church. It was true that Jesus said to peter “Upon this rock I will bouild my church.” Ive gotten into argument’s with the Church of Christ saying they found it. The point is the Catholic stuff is a myth Jesus found the Christian church!! When you see people out on the streets suffering, do yall people help them or ask them if there Catholic, because yall seem to be denying the scriptures. There is nowhere in the BIBLE where Jesus founded the CATHOLIC church he found the uneversal church! And Church of Christ believes they were the first to!(They weren’t)

When Catholics see people out on the streets suffering, do we help them? You bet we do, along with members of every other church here and a lot of secular organizations, at least where I live. Where I live the Catholic parish is part of the town-wide Food Share program (which is administered by a Protestant church). We also have Habitat for Humanity, the Caring Pregnancy Center, we foster children in need in other countries, there is an organization that gives free clothes to the poor, St. Vincent de Paul offers very low interest loans for house improvements and also has a very nice apartment complex with two-story apartments for the needy.

One Protestant church offers a free meal every Wednesday and it doesn’t matter how much money anyone has - they are welcome there. Another Protestant church provides free oil changes for anyone’s car - I’ve been there myself. I forgot to mention the Women’s Center and I’m sure there are many more I’ve missed.

I’ll be moving soon to another state and a much bigger city. I don’t think I’ll find so much coordination just because I think it would be difficult with a larger population (I’m comparing about 8,000 people to several hundred thousand). But maybe I’ll be pleasantly surprised. I hope so.

 

[LittleSoldier]

Fair enough … I didn’t particularly want to use the Wiki source (for the reason that you mentioned), but I couldn’t locate my usual source, so I used this one instead.

Thank you for the clarification. I should have realized that you wouldn’t use Wiki as a primary source because the other sources you’ve given me have been very good. Sometimes I feel forced to use Wiki because it’s absolutely the only source I can find and I’m stuck with it.

I really do appreciate your help with this.

 

[choy]

some Protestant sects do not believe that their church is the true one founded by Jesus Christ

they believe they don’t need the True Church. as long as they have a personal relationship with Jesus, they don’t need The Church

 

[rovimax]

I don’t know, why did some men from Rome find the Roman Catholic church, and say Jesus found it. It’s beyond me!

Saint Paul wrote to the Church in Rome, its been existing since Apostolic times, but I can’t find anywhere where did god tell, Luther, Wesley, Calvin, Smith, White and others to build their own.

 

[rovimax]

some Protestant sects do not believe that their church is the true one founded by Jesus Christ

they believe they don’t need the True Church. as long as they have a personal relationship with Jesus, they don’t need The Church

Its because they do not understand the reason why the Church was built.

 

[rovimax]

Philippians 1:15 Some, to be sure, are preaching Christ even from envy and strife, but some also from good will; 16 the latter do it out of love, knowing that I am appointed for the defense of the gospel; 17 the former proclaim Christ out of selfish ambition rather than from pure motives, thinking to cause me distress in my imprisonment. 18 What then? Only that in every way, whether in pretense or in truth, Christ is proclaimed; and in this I rejoice. Yes, and I will rejoice.

The apostle Paul was happy enough to see others preach Christ even with selfish motives. We could argue about who is selfish and and who has pure motives, but that would only divide us further. Would it not benefit us more to simply rejoice like the apostle Paul that Christ is being preached by protestants and catholics alike?

As long as the doctrine being preached is correct, I think no objections will be raised. But if the doctrine is wrong then objections and corrections should be raised. That is the role of the one true Church, to defend the teachings of Jesus Christ… the way, the truth and the life.

 

[Contarini]

I don’t know, why did some men from Rome find the Roman Catholic church, and say Jesus found it. It’s beyond me!

I second the poster who asked you to explain who these men were and where they found the “Roman Catholic church,” apparently sitting in an attic somewhere?

This is a very odd way to approach church history.

Edwin