Do Muslims Worship A Black Stone?

[Dempsey1919]

The Black Stone is the eastern corner stone of the Kaaba, the large black cube that lies in the centre of Mecca.

Muslims believe that a brilliant white stone fell from heaven during the time of Adam and Eve. Over time, this stone turned black because of the sins which it absorbed. It is believed that Abraham found this rock and the Angel Gabriel brought it to him while he was building the Kaaba.

To this day, the Black Stone is an object of reverence to Muslims. They turn east to face this Stone when they pray five times a day. During the pilgrimage to Mecca, they circle the Kaaba and attempt to kiss the Black Stone as Muhammad once did. If they can’t get near to kiss it, Muslims point towards it.

The Black Stone is believed to absorb sins; the Muslims pray towards it, and they attempt to kiss it during pilgrimage. This sounds like worship to me. Do Muslims worship the stone which has the ability to remove sins?

Why is this rock important? Why is is relevant? Where does it really come from?

 

[hamba2han]

It is generally believed that the black stone has the ability to float in water and this easily differentiates it from all other similar looking rocks.

 

[dmar198]

The Black Stone is the eastern corner stone of the Kaaba, the large black cube that lies in the centre of Mecca.

Muslims believe that a brilliant white stone fell from heaven during the time of Adam and Eve. Over time, this stone turned black because of the sins which it absorbed. It is believed that Abraham found this rock and the Angel Gabriel brought it to him while he was building the Kaaba.

To this day, the Black Stone is an object of reverence to Muslims. They turn east to face this Stone when they pray five times a day. During the pilgrimage to Mecca, they circle the Kaaba and attempt to kiss the Black Stone as Muhammad once did. If they can’t get near to kiss it, Muslims point towards it.

The Black Stone is believed to absorb sins; the Muslims pray towards it, and they attempt to kiss it during pilgrimage. This sounds like worship to me. Do Muslims worship the stone which has the ability to remove sins?

Why is this rock important? Why is is relevant? Where does it really come from?

I got some info from Wikipedia. They don’t worship but they do seem to revere it: the second leader of Islam spoke about the stone to all assembled with him nearby, saying,
“No doubt, I know that you are a stone and can neither harm anyone nor benefit anyone. Had I not seen Allah’s Messenger [Muhammad] kissing you, I would not have kissed you.” Many Muslims follow Umar: they pay their respects to the Stone in a spirit of trust in Muhammad, not with any belief in the Stone itself. This, however, does not indicate their disrespect to the Black Stone but their belief that harm and benefit are in the hands of God, and nothing else. In modern times, large crowds no longer make it practically possible for everyone to kiss the stone, so it is currently acceptable for pilgrims to simply point in the direction of the Stone on each of their circuits around the building. So it’s revered because of Muhammad’s association with it.
Nobody knows quite where it came from: some say it’s a meteorite, but since it allegedly floats they say that it could also be natural glass. The Black Stone has been described variously as basalt lava, an agate, a piece of natural glass or — most popularly — a stony meteorite. It is evidently a hard rock, having survived so much handling. A significant clue to its nature is provided by an account of the Stone’s recovery in 951 AD after it had been stolen 21 years earlier; according to a chronicler, the Stone was identified by its ability to float in water. If this account is accurate, it would rule out the Black Stone being an agate, basalt lava or stony meteorite, though it would be compatible with it being glass or pumice.

 

[Isa_Almisry]

It is generally believed that the black stone has the ability to float in water and this easily differentiates it from all other similar looking rocks.

and this has been tested?

In premodern times musilms made the claim that the Great Mosque would expand to accomodate all worshippers. Since the Saudis recently expanded it, I would hope this “miracle” in proof of Islam had been laid to rest.

Btw, I have some floating lava rocks from Hawaii. Should we worship Madame Pele?

 

[Publisher]

I’m always amazed by some of the threads I read on this board. Sometimes I read Protestantposts who “accuse” that Catholics “worship statues”. I read Catholic accusations that Protestants “worhship the Bible”…now we have probably both Protestants and Catholics accusing Muslims of “worshipping a stone.”

I wonder why when “I” do it it’s called “veneration” but when “you” do it it’s called “worship”?

I do not believe Catholics worship statues, nor to Protestants worhips the Bible…NOR do Muslims worship a “black stone.”

 

[Isa_Almisry]

I’m always amazed by some of the threads I read on this board. Sometimes I read Protestantposts who “accuse” that Catholics “worship statues”. I read Catholic accusations that Protestants “worhship the Bible”…now we have probably both Protestants and Catholics accusing Muslims of “worshipping a stone.”

I wonder why when “I” do it it’s called “veneration” but when “you” do it it’s called “worship”?

I do not believe Catholics worship statues, nor to Protestants worhips the Bible…NOR do Muslims worship a “black stone.”

Problem in the Muslim case is that they condemn as pagan the worship of similar stones (ancient Arabian idols were rock formations, etc). The Black Stone is different only because Muhammad worshipped it.

 

[Publisher]

Problem in the Muslim case is that they condemn as pagan the worship of similar stones (ancient Arabian idols were rock formations, etc). The Black Stone is different only because Muhammad worshipped it.

Again, Muslims do not claim to “worhship” it…they “venerate” the stone because Muhammed “venerated” it…

I wonder if honesty and truth are as important as “one upmanship” many times. Do you know any Muslim that claims they “worship” the black stone of the Kabba? Or is it only non-Muslims which claim they do?

Do you know any Catholics that affirm they “worship” statues…or is it only non-Catholics which make this claim?

Catholics, who profess to have the blessings of the “fulness of truth”, should IMO, live out of that “Fullness”…do you agree?

Are we discussing that Muslims condemns pagan worship if images or are we discussing that Muslims “worship” a black stone? Muslims do not worship the stone…no more than Catholics “worship” statues of Mary and the Saints.

 

[Isa_Almisry]

Again, Muslims do not claim to “worhship” it…they “venerate” the stone because Muhammed “venerated” it…

I wonder if honesty and truth are as important as “one upmanship” many times. Do you know any Muslim that claims they “worship” the black stone of the Kabba? Or is it only non-Muslims which claim they do?

Do you know any Catholics that affirm they “worship” statues…or is it only non-Catholics which make this claim?

Catholics, who profess to have the blessings of the “fulness of truth”, should IMO, live out of that “Fullness”…do you agree?

Are we discussing that Muslims condemns pagan worship if images or are we discussing that Muslims “worship” a black stone? Muslims do not worship the stone…no more than Catholics “worship” statues of Mary and the Saints.

The pagan Arabian had every right, by your thinking to ask the difference between Muhammad’s Kaaba and stone and the pagan’s kaaba (there were others) and stone, which the Muslims destroyed. Ibn al-Kalbi wrote about these others in the “Book of Idols.” (Kitaab al-aSnaam).

 

[Publisher]

By definition a “pagan” may in fact actually worship a stone…Muslims are not pagans…Friend Isa, are you claiming that Muslims worship the stone? Are you refusing in making the distinction of “latria” and “dulia” in regard to Muslims, but demand it in regard to Catholics?

I do not know how we can share with our Muslims friends Truth found in Jesus of Nazareth, when our words do not flow from that Center of Truth. Our words must convey Truth in these matters…I leave you now to your own conclusions of whether your post is from Truth.

Peace to you.

 

[ibkc]

By definition a “pagan” may in fact actually worship a stone…Muslims are not pagans…Friend Isa, are you claiming that Muslims worship the stone? Are you refusing in making the distinction of “latria” and “dulia” in regard to Muslims, but demand it in regard to Catholics?

Just so you know, Isa is not Catholic, as is indicated in his signature, so it’d be nice of you to not lump all critics of Islamic practices in under the “Catholic” umbrella by default. Thnaks.

 

[hamba2han]

and this has been tested?

In premodern times musilms made the claim that the Great Mosque would expand to accomodate all worshippers. Since the Saudis recently expanded it, I would hope this “miracle” in proof of Islam had been laid to rest.

Btw, I have some floating lava rocks from Hawaii. Should we worship Madame Pele?

If it was not true to begin with, then I cannot imagine anyone would be foolish enough to make such an outlandish claim because it is so easily provable.

As for your floating lava rocks from Hawaii:

http://www.fi.edu/fellows/payton/rocks/expert/graphics/PUMICE.JPG

Pumice rocks are igneous rocks which were formed when lava cooled quickly above ground. You can see where little pockets of air had been. This rock is so light, that many pumice rocks will actually float in water. Pumice is actually a kind of glass and not a mixture of minerals. Because this rock is so light, it is used quite often as a decorative landscape stone. Ground to a powder, it is used as an abrasive in polish compounds and in Lava© soap.

I said “similar looking” rocks and pumice rocks like the one above are not only smaller in size, it also does not at all look like the Black Stone below.

(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

 

[Publisher]

Just so you know, Isa is not Catholic, as is indicated in his signature, so it’d be nice of you to not lump all critics of Islamic practices in under the “Catholic” umbrella by default. Thnaks.

Thank you for the correction. I then would ask the question of the Orthodox who venerate icons.

I realize there is some animosity between Catholic and Orthodox as well…no offense was intended.

 

[Muslim_Woman]

Salaam/peace

They turn east to face this Stone when they pray five times a day.

We face towards holy kaaba , it’s the qibla/ direction .

Earlier Muslims used to face towards Jerusalem.

Muslims worship One God only.

a related ans is given here :

Ask about Islam

Misconceptions of non-Muslims

post 641

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=264987&page=43

Tawaf around Kaaba for indicating one God

When the Muslims go to Masjid-e-Haram in Makkah, they perform tawaf or circumambulation round the Kaaba.

This act symbolizes the belief and worship of One God, since, just as every circle has one centre, so also there is only one Allah (swt) worthy of worship.

1. Hadith of Umar (may Allah be pleased with him)

Regarding the black stone, hajr-e-aswad, there is a hadith (tradition), attributed to the illustrious companion of the Prophet Muhammed (pbuh), Umar (may Allah be pleased with him).

According to Sahih Bukhari, Volume 2, book of Hajj, chapter 56, H.No. 675. Umar (may Allah be pleased with him) said, “I know that you are a stone and can neither benefit nor harm.

Had I not seen the Prophet (pbuh) touching (and kissing) you, I would never have touched (and kissed) you”.

1. People stood on Kaaba and gave the adhaan

At the time of the Prophet, people even stood on the Kaaba and gave the ‘adhaan’ or the call to prayer.

One may ask those who allege that Muslims worship the Kaaba; which idol worshipper stands on the idol he worships?

institutealislam.com/answ…dr-zakir-naik/

 

[Isa_Almisry]

By definition a “pagan” may in fact actually worship a stone…Muslims are not pagans…Friend Isa, are you claiming that Muslims worship the stone? Are you refusing in making the distinction of “latria” and “dulia” in regard to Muslims, but demand it in regard to Catholics?

I do not know how we can share with our Muslims friends Truth found in Jesus of Nazareth, when our words do not flow from that Center of Truth. Our words must convey Truth in these matters…I leave you now to your own conclusions of whether your post is from Truth.

Peace to you.

The Muslims say they believe Jesus is the Christ. I ask what that means, and they say they do not know.

The Muslims say that Mary is a Virgin. I ask what that means, and they say that they do not know.

The Muslims say that they venerate the Black Stone. I ask them why, and they do not know.

The Muslims say that their veneration of the Black Stone differs from the worship given it by the pagans. I ask how, and they say they do not know.

So Islam is a religion that requires beliefs without meaning, and practices without a clue. Is it too much to expect more?

This Saturday my sons and I stopped by the Chicago Hindu Temple. We walked around, but did not go in, as we would have to remove our shoes. From a previous experience with a Hindu, I know that is to honor the idols (their term, btw). I told my sons we worship Jesus, we honor icons, but we neither worship nor honor idols.

I don’t take “because the Church says so” as an answer why we venerate icons. I don’t take “because Muhammad did” to explain this “veneration” of an old Arabian idol.

 

[rpp]

I do not think Muslims “worship” this stone. That sounds like something from the fevered imagination of Jack Chick. However, it is clear that they venerate it in much the same manner as Catholic venerate relics of the True Cross or similar things.

 

[Isa_Almisry]

Salaam/peace

We face towards holy kaaba , it’s the qibla/ direction .

Earlier Muslims used to face towards Jerusalem.

Muslims worship One God only.

a related ans is given here :

Ask about Islam

Misconceptions of non-Muslims

post 641

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=264987&page=43

Tawaf around Kaaba for indicating one God

When the Muslims go to Masjid-e-Haram in Makkah, they perform tawaf or circumambulation round the Kaaba.

This act symbolizes the belief and worship of One God, since, just as every circle has one centre, so also there is only one Allah (swt) worthy of worship.

1. Hadith of Umar (may Allah be pleased with him)

Regarding the black stone, hajr-e-aswad, there is a hadith (tradition), attributed to the illustrious companion of the Prophet Muhammed (pbuh), Umar (may Allah be pleased with him).

According to Sahih Bukhari, Volume 2, book of Hajj, chapter 56, H.No. 675. Umar (may Allah be pleased with him) said, “I know that you are a stone and can neither benefit nor harm.

Had I not seen the Prophet (pbuh) touching (and kissing) you, I would never have touched (and kissed) you”.

1. People stood on Kaaba and gave the adhaan

At the time of the Prophet, people even stood on the Kaaba and gave the ‘adhaan’ or the call to prayer.

One may ask those who allege that Muslims worship the Kaaba; which idol worshipper stands on the idol he worships?

institutealislam.com/answ…dr-zakir-naik/

I think we have repeatedly said that the things Islam does do not make any sense.

 

[Publisher]

The Muslims say they believe Jesus is the Christ. I ask what that means, and they say they do not know.

The Muslims say that Mary is a Virgin. I ask what that means, and they say that they do not know.

The Muslims say that they venerate the Black Stone. I ask them why, and they do not know.

The Muslims say that their veneration of the Black Stone differs from the worship given it by the pagans. I ask how, and they say they do not know.

So Islam is a religion that requires beliefs without meaning, and practices without a clue. Is it too much to expect more?

This Saturday my sons and I stopped by the Chicago Hindu Temple. We walked around, but did not go in, as we would have to remove our shoes. From a previous experience with a Hindu, I know that is to honor the idols (their term, btw). I told my sons we worship Jesus, we honor icons, but we neither worship nor honor idols.

I don’t take “because the Church says so” as an answer why we venerate icons. I don’t take “because Muhammad did” to explain this “veneration” of an old Arabian idol.

Isa, but the question is 'Do you believe Muslims as a whole actually worship the black stone of the Kaaba?" You as Orthodox have been accused of worshiping icons…the Divine Liturgy I have attended with Orthodox friends had worshipers kissing icons as they kneeled before them…I knew they did not “worship” the icon…but showed it veneration because it represented Christ or a Saint.

Do you really believe Muslims as a whole, worship the black stone?

I cannot believe the words of Jesus…“Do unto others as you would have them do unto you…” would not have meaning for you. To paraphrase, “Do not speak falsehoods about others that you would not have spoken about you.”…

So the real question isn’t whether a few select Muslims could not answer your questions to your satisfaction, but based on your knowledge of Islam…do you actually believe Muslims worship the black stone?

 

[Isa_Almisry]

Thank you for the correction. I then would ask the question of the Orthodox who venerate icons.

I realize there is some animosity between Catholic and Orthodox as well…no offense was intended.

We venerate the image of God made man, the Theotokos, who held within her Him Whom the Heavens could not hold, and the Saints, the members of His Body.

The Black Stone, what is that? besides an idol that the pagan Quraysh worshipped?

 

[Isa_Almisry]

I do not think Muslims “worship” this stone. That sounds like something from the fevered imagination of Jack Chick. However, it is clear that they venerate it in much the same manner as Catholic venerate relics of the True Cross or similar things.

The Cross is the Lord’s footstool.

What is the Black Stone?

 

[Publisher]

We venerate the image of God made man, the Theotokos, who held within her Him Whom the Heavens could not hold, and the Saints, the members of His Body.

The Black Stone, what is that? besides an idol that the pagan Quraysh worshipped?

As I understand it is a rock that Abraham may have offered his son upon, which the angel stopped the sacrifice at the last moment. As I understand it is a symbol only of the Oneness of the Almighty…it is venerated…it is not worshipped by Muslims…I do not know about the pagan Quraysh…we’re not discussing pagan Quraysh, we’re discussing Muslims who worship the One God…are we not?