Do Non-Catholic Christians go to Heaven too?

[DJgang]

Of course, non-Catholics can go to Heaven…

And of course, even some Catholics will NOT make it to Heaven…

God alone determines this, as the Catholic Church teaches.

 

[cruisin]

“It is not about what you think is pretty clear or what I think is pretty clear, it is about what the Church teaches. The Church is the authority on Scripture. The Church is the pillar and bullwork of the turth.”

Question: Did the any of the Apostles depend on the church for his Salvation or Christ Jesus? What say you?

 

[catholiconce]

We can all agree that my decision to convert from Methodist to Catholicism is great, since I can participate in the sacrifice of the Mass and receive Jesus in the Eucharist. Okay that’s good. But then it dawned on me: will my family come to salvation with me? Are my dead grandparents who stayed Protestant their entire lives in Heaven?

Jesus says that if one does not eat his body or drink his blood then they have no life within them. But, I certainly don’t think that God would doom all non-Catholic Christians to hell!

Some protestant churches(lutheran) do believe that the Bread and Wine is the true Body and Blood of Christ because scripture says that it is. So we are partaking in the body and blood of christ. I as a former Catholic still do have the fullness of the faith and the body and Blood of Christ in the Eucharist. For the Catholic church to interpet the words of John 6:53 as they do and that they are the only ones that have everlasting life is wrong.

 

[ncguy]

Question: Did the any of the Apostles depend on the church for his Salvation or Christ Jesus? What say you?

Cruisin,

Salavation comes through Christ Jesus.

 

[ncguy]

Some protestant churches(lutheran) do believe that the Bread and Wine is the true Body and Blood of Christ because scripture says that it is. So we are partaking in the body and blood of christ. I as a former Catholic still do have the fullness of the faith and the body and Blood of Christ in the Eucharist. For the Catholic church to interpet the words of John 6:53 as they do and that they are the only ones that have everlasting life is wrong.

I believe you have a misunderstanding of Catholicism.

catholic.com/thisrock/2004/0403sbs.asp

 

[jmcrae]

We can all agree that my decision to convert from Methodist to Catholicism is great, since I can participate in the sacrifice of the Mass and receive Jesus in the Eucharist. Okay that’s good. But then it dawned on me: will my family come to salvation with me? Are my dead grandparents who stayed Protestant their entire lives in Heaven?

Jesus says that if one does not eat his body or drink his blood then they have no life within them. But, I certainly don’t think that God would doom all non-Catholic Christians to hell!

I am in a similar situation. Since I have no way of knowing whether my ancestors made it to Heaven or not (especially since a lot of them were extremely anti-Catholic) I am assuming that they went to Purgatory, and offering up any Indulgences I obtain on their behalf, since, as far as I know, there has never been anyone else to pray for them - everyone else in the family just assumes that they went to Heaven. (And, no, I don’t tell anyone what I am doing with my Indulgences, or even that I have any.)

If they went to Hell, then my Indulgences will go to other worthy souls; likewise if they went to Heaven - and then they are already praying for me - but on the off-chance that they are in Purgatory, and with me being the only one available to pray for them, I think this is something important to do for them.

 

[Homerun40968]

By the way, how is it possible to know when an ancestor or family member has exited Purgatory and entered Heaven?

 

[jmcrae]

Question: Did the any of the Apostles depend on the church for his Salvation or Christ Jesus? What say you?

They were the Church, and other people depended upon them to teach them about Jesus and to administer Jesus’ Sacraments to them.

If the Apostles had taken a “once saved always saved” approach and stayed quietly in their caves avoiding trouble, none of us would ever have even heard the Gospel. It is through the Church that the Gospel of Jesus Christ is transmitted, and that the Sacraments are administered, so that we can also be saved by Jesus Christ, alongside those who knew Him in person.

 

[Discourser]

Amen to jmcrae’s comments, and I would add…

They were the Church, and other people depended upon them to teach them about Jesus

…without a New Testament to quote from, there was no such thing for the next 300 years…

If the Apostles had taken a “once saved always saved” approach

…without John 3:16 to use as a proof text for it! …

and stayed quietly in their caves avoiding trouble, none of us would ever have even heard the Gospel. It is through the Church

…whose members wrote, compiled, and guaranteed the Bible …

that the Gospel of Jesus Christ is transmitted, and that the Sacraments are administered, so that we can also be saved by Jesus Christ, alongside those who knew Him in person.

Amen!
I would also add that the writings of the Apostles and early Christians support what the Catholic Church teaches today.

 

[catholiconce]

Amen to jmcrae’s comments, and I would add…

…without a New Testament to quote from, there was no such thing for the next 300 years…

…without John 3:16 to use as a proof text for it! …

…whose members wrote, compiled, and guaranteed the Bible …

Amen!
I would also add that the writings of the Apostles and early Christians support what the Catholic Church teaches today.

The Church Catholic teaches as the apostles and Early christians did the Roman Church does for the most part. I as a Lutheran am Catholic just not Roman. We are all Christian and you do not have to be Roman to have the Fullness of the Faith or a valid Eucharist.

 

[adstrinity]

By the way, how is it possible to know when an ancestor or family member has exited Purgatory and entered Heaven?

Unless God tells you or sends somebody to tell you, I don’t know that there is a way. Just keep praying for them, if they are out of Purgatory, your prayer will go to someone/thing else.

Which brings me to something I read. Don’t remember it much, but, it was along the lines that Protestants spend the most time in Purgatory because they have never had their sins forgiven coupled with they do not have anybody to pray for them. If Protestants make it to Purgatory to be purged to be perfected, then it is for the reason they will be in Heaven.

 

[RomanRevert]

I guess I should respond to the original post.

In the Catechism of the Catholic Church, paragraph 169 states:

"Salvation comes from God alone; but because we receive the life of faith through the Church, she is our mother: “We believe the Church as the mother of our new birth, and not in the Church as if she were the author of our salvation.” (italic emphasis is as appears in the catechism)

I am thinking that there should be another reference to this subject in the catechism, but I couldn’t find it right offhand. Does someone else know where this is addressed in the catechism?

My opinion is that any Catholic who thinks that non-Catholic Christians cannot go to heaven does not understand, or is not abiding by, the teachings of the Catholic Church.

Correct … Non-Catholic Christians CAN be saved. However, consider the teachings of the Church regarding Mortal Sin. If you are in a state of Mortal Sin at the time of death, you cannot be saved (although God alone has this power) since you are an enemy of God. So how is Mortal Sin forgiven? Mortal Sin is forgiven through the Sacrament of Penance (confession) to a Priest. Since most, if not all, Protestant sects deny this, the Sacrament of Penance is not available to them (and even if they did humble themselves to do this, since their ministers are not validly ordained, it would be a nice but meaningless exercise) So, can a non-Catholic Christian be saved? Yes, but this assumes that this non-Catholic Christian lived his entire life without committing any Mortal sins. Possible? yes. Probable? not so sure about that one. This is what the Church teaches. It may not be announced as boldly as this (at least for the last 40 years) but it is nonetheless the teaching of Holy Mother Church. So before some of you craft a clever email with lots of Scriptural references, keep in mind that I did not make this up. That is the joy of being Catholic: I get to trust the Church and not feel that I need to reinvent Christianity like so many “Bible Churches” and mainline Protestant sects do every day in order to attract new members or appease a special interest group.

The Catholic Church is not just some “denomination.” It is the Church that Christ Himself founded and promised that the gates of Hell shall not prevail against it.

 

[Discourser]

I don’t doubt that, but I wish I knew exactly where the catechism addresses this specifically. I like to be able to read the information directly from the catechism for myself. Anybody know the paragraph # in the catechism?

 

[valient_Lucy]

We can all agree that my decision to convert from Methodist to Catholicism is great, since I can participate in the sacrifice of the Mass and receive Jesus in the Eucharist. Okay that’s good. But then it dawned on me: will my family come to salvation with me? Are my dead grandparents who stayed Protestant their entire lives in Heaven?

Jesus says that if one does not eat his body or drink his blood then they have no life within them. But, I certainly don’t think that God would doom all non-Catholic Christians to hell!

Congratulations!

As to your grandparents, we cannot know their hearts, minds and souls, so no one can know whether or not they are in heaven. They certainly COULD be in heaven, since anyone who, out of sincere ignorance, does not know that the Catholic Church is Christ’s church COULD still be in heaven. I can’t say that they are, since only God can judge another person.

My advice is to pray for their souls, and entrust them to the mercy of God. Their salvation is in His just and merciful hands. Also, pray for your living relatives and friends, and “work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.”

 

[RomanRevert]

I don’t doubt that, but I wish I knew exactly where the catechism addresses this specifically. I like to be able to read the information directly from the catechism for myself. Anybody know the paragraph # in the catechism?

Look at post #10 of this thread … that is cut and pasted from the Baltimore Catechism (#4). Still valid, more direct, and unambiguous. You don’t have to guess what is meant … they make it painfully obvious with examples, etc. I really like it. Here is the link:

cin.org/users/james/ebooks/master/baltimore/bcreed09.htm

go down to number 121. The Baltimore Catechism is laid out a little differently … more of a question/answer format. The new Catechism is more of an outline. It is well done and certainly presents the faith, but it can be a bit confusing at times.

here is a link to the whole Baltimore Catechism:
cin.org/users/james/ebooks/master/baltimore/bindex.htm

Enjoy!!

 

[RomanRevert]

I don’t doubt that, but I wish I knew exactly where the catechism addresses this specifically. I like to be able to read the information directly from the catechism for myself. Anybody know the paragraph # in the catechism?

I did some digging around the new Catechism and found the following:

1035 The teaching of the Church affirms the existence of hell and its eternity. Immediately after death the souls of those who die in a state of mortal sin descend into hell, where they suffer the punishments of hell, “eternal fire.” The chief punishment of hell is eternal separation from God, in whom alone man can possess the life and happiness for which he was created and for which he longs.

1856 Mortal sin, by attacking the vital principle within us - that is, charity - necessitates a new initiative of God’s mercy and a conversion of heart which is normally accomplished within the setting of the sacrament of reconciliation.

1461 Since Christ entrusted to his apostles the ministry of reconciliation, bishops who are their successors, and priests, the bishops’ collaborators, continue to exercise this ministry. Indeed bishops and priests, by virtue of the sacrament of Holy Orders, have the power to forgive all sins "in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit."

1462 Forgiveness of sins brings reconciliation with God, but also with the Church. Since ancient times the bishop, visible head of a particular Church, has thus rightfully been considered to be the one who principally has the power and ministry of reconciliation: he is the moderator of the penitential discipline. Priests, his collaborators, exercise it to the extent that they have received the commission either from their bishop (or religious superior) or the Pope, according to the law of the Church.

---

Therefore, mortal sin = enemy of God = Hell;
Mortal sin forgiven via the Sacrament of Penance;
Priests and Bishops (via Apostolic Succession) can administer the Sacrament of Penance
Since non-Catholic Christians have no Apostolic succession, they have no priests, they cannot administer the Sacrament of Penance which forgives Mortal Sin. A bit of a problem, n’est pas?

By the way, here is a link to the new Catechism:
vatican.va/archive/catechism/ccc_toc.htm

It is on the Vatican website and is laid out nicely.

+JMJ+

 

[buffalo]

If you find yourself in heaven it will have through the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church which Jesus founded and told us no one goes to the Father except through me. The Catholic Church is the body of Christ.

How He does it is a mystery.

 

[pismopal]

Of course, non-Catholics can go to Heaven…

And of course, even some Catholics will NOT make it to Heaven…

God alone determines this, as the Catholic Church teaches.

You have said it well. The idea that all one has to do is “believe”, without outward signs that you believe or any attempt to live the Christ centered life, is certainly not supported by the Bible and/or the Church.