Do non-Catholic churches have the Keys to the Kingdom of Heaven?

[ufamtobie]

The reason He mentions no names in John 20 is because they are equal in rank, equal in their responsibilities to bind and loose, to make disciples of all nations, etc.
Peter initially receives the keys, but the power of the keys belongs to the Church, to mind and loose, etc.

There is no problem with hierarchy. There are times I wish the LCMS were more hierarchical, and less congregational, but scripture clearly doesn’t give to St. Peter anymore than a primacy, which was observed and honored in the early Church.

Jon

JonNC, here in John 20 the Apostles are equal in forgiving or retaining sins. But binding and loosing is a whole different story, this binding and loosing was given to St. Peter only in the Singular, and to his successors the Popes

JonNC, how is it different you may say. binding and losing goes beyond forgiving and retaining sin. Such as the Catholic Church Teaches: Invincibly Ignorant The Church recognizes that God does not condemn those who are innocently ignorant of the truth about his offer of salvation. Regarding the doctrine in question, the Catechism of the Catholic Church (quoting Vatican II document Lumen Gentium, 16) states: affirmation is not aimed at those who, through no fault of their own, do not know Christ and his Church: Those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or** his Church**, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience—those too may achieve eternal salvation. (CCC 847)

Basing itself on Scripture and Tradition, the Council teaches that the Church, a pilgrim now on earth, is necessary for salvation: the one Christ is the mediator and the way of salvation; he is present to us in his body which is the Church. He himself explicitly asserted the necessity of faith and baptism, and thereby affirmed at the same time the necessity of the Church which men enter through baptism as through a door. Hence they could not be saved who,** knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ, would refuse either to enter it or to remain in it**. (CCC 846)

JonNC, the above teaching (CCC847) (CCC 846) etc… is Binding on earth and is binding in heaven. You know Jesus Christ, but you do not recognize His One Church teachings, where does this leave you?

When you come before Jesus Christ, you can not say you were invincibly ignorant of the Catholic Church Teachings, you know them very well and you yet frankly reject it.

Ufam Tobe

 

[ufamtobie]

Ufam,

Why do you think you are the only one who has St. Peter?

Does Orthodoxy have the keys?

Jon

JonNC, easy question The Catholic Church has St. Peter the first Pope because we have His successor with us now Pope Francis

Re: Orthodoxy, first of all only the Pope has the Keys of the Kingdom of Heaven, no other church, no Bishop, Priest, within the Catholic Church has the Keys to the Kingdom, only One Bishop, the Bishop of Rome the Pope.

JonNC, don’t worry to much about Orthodoxy if they are invincibly ignorant God will show them the Light worry about yourself who are not Invincibly ignorant and not have the Successor of St. Peter, Pope Francis Amen

Worry about your stubbornness that keeps you away from being in full Communion with the Holy See. Amen

Orthodoxy, all Christians have St. Peter, the Apostle but to have St. Peter the first Pope you must then have His successor Pope Francis as your Pope, now:thumbsup:

JonNC, Does Orthodoxy Church Have Pope Francis as their Leader now? IF you say no, then you have answered your own question:thumbsup:

Ufam Tobie

 

[1ke]

How can you say the above proves nothing?

I think I was pretty clear that using etymology of English words proves nothing because the Bible was not written in English. If one is attempting to argue individual words, which isn’t something I recommend unless you are a linguistics scholar and know biblical Greek and Aramaic, then one should use the original language to make one’s case.

Many protestant churches if not all, say, that they have the Keys to the Kingdom of Heaven to bind and loose, that is so untrue, how so?

I don’t know any Protestants who make this argument.

Well, if Jesus Christ gave the Keys to only St. Peter and not the rest of the Apostles, how can any other church say they have the Keys to the Kingdom of heaven?

I’m not arguing that your conclusion is wrong, merely your reasoning. Again, see Upon This Rock by Steven Ray.

 

[JonNC]

I don’t know any Protestants who make this argument.

Lutherans practice Confession/Holy Absolution. Our pastors act* in persona christi* to grant absolution. From the Smalcald Articles:

Part III, Article VII. Of the Keys.

1] The keys are an office and power given by Christ to the Church for binding and loosing sin, not only the gross and well-known sins, but also the subtle, hidden, which are known only to God, as it is written in Ps. 19:13: Who can understand his errors? And in Rom. 7:25 St. Paul himself complains that with the flesh he serves the law of sin. 2] For it is not in our power, but belongs to God alone, to judge which, how great, and how many the sins are, as it is written in Ps. 143:2: Enter not into judgment with Thy servant; for in Thy sight shall no man living be justified. 3] And Paul says, 1 Cor. 4:4: For I know nothing by myself; yet am I not hereby justified.

Jon