Do only fanatics go to Heaven?

[distracted]

If you read the New Testament… and i mean read the whole thing, not just the parts that make one feel “good” …

you see that it is very difficult to get into Heaven… Jesus said that the way to eternal life is narrow and there are few who find it. He said that not many will be “strong enough” to get in… He said that not all who say “Lord Lord” will enter… but only he “who does the will of the Father…”

The will of the Father, in a nutshell, is Jesus Christ (Isaiah, etc…).

Only the Catholic Church has Jesus Christ in a tangible, powerful way… (the Real Presence)…

I believe the Catholic Faith (applying it, that is) is that narrow way…

Do you agree? Why/Why not?

 

[Nick9]

If you read the New Testament… and i mean read the whole thing, not just the parts that make one feel “good” …

you see that it is very difficult to get into Heaven… Jesus said that the way to eternal life is narrow and there are few who find it. He said that not many will be “strong enough” to get in… He said that not all who say “Lord Lord” will enter… but only he “who does the will of the Father…”

The will of the Father, in a nutshell, is Jesus Christ (Isaiah, etc…).

Only the Catholic Church has Jesus Christ in a tangible, powerful way… (the Real Presence)…

I believe the Catholic Faith (applying it, that is) is that narrow way…

Do you agree? Why/Why not?

hi distracted, I agree with you that it is a narrow way and that the Catholic faith is that way in its pure form. I also believe that God is merciful and that many people are invincibly ignorant of His Church, so that He in some mysterious way channels the grace of the Church to them. As Vatican II, Gaudium et Spes (22) says: all men of good, in showing that God’s grace is active in them in a hidden way, are associated with the Paschal Mystery.

 

[spauline]

hi distracted, I agree with you that it is a narrow way and that the Catholic faith is that way in its pure form. I also believe that God is merciful and that many people are invincibly ignorant of His Church, so that He in some mysterious way channels the grace of the Church to them. As Vatican II, Gaudium et Spes (22) says: all men of good, in showing that God’s grace is active in them in a hidden way, are associated with the Paschal Mystery.

Amen, Nick! Well put. And might i add, that even though non-Catholics and even non-Christians, if they meet certain criteria, can be saved, the degree of truth and graces they lack will diminish their chances of attaining to salvation, hence our grave obligation to evangelize those the world.

 

[distracted]

hi distracted, I agree with you that it is a narrow way and that the Catholic faith is that way in its pure form. I also believe that God is merciful and that many people are invincibly ignorant of His Church, so that He in some mysterious way channels the grace of the Church to them. As Vatican II, Gaudium et Spes (22) says: all men of good, in showing that God’s grace is active in them in a hidden way, are associated with the Paschal Mystery.

i agree… and Christians outside the Church who believe in Christ and attempt to follow him to the best of their ability ARE part of the Church, albeit indirectly & incompletely… However, i also feel that those who love Jesus, really Love him… will find the Cahtolic Church… They may rail against Her for awhile… but they will find her…

 

[Nick9]

Amen, Nick! Well put. And might i add, that even though non-Catholics and even non-Christians, if they meet certain criteria, can be saved, the degree of truth and graces they lack will diminish their chances of attaining to salvation, hence our grave obligation to evangelize those the world.

I agree with you. It is a great worry since I come from a non-Catholic family and even a non-church-going family. They are good people and all I can do is love them and pray for them. I asked my moral theology lecturer about my role in their salvation. I asked him if they somehow could be saved through me, as I am saved through Christ (daft, I know). He replied that my role was to be a good example and help form their consciences. I feel deep down that God will save them.

 

[distracted]

Amen, Nick! Well put. And might i add, that even though non-Catholics and even non-Christians, if they meet certain criteria, can be saved, the degree of truth and graces they lack will diminish their chances of attaining to salvation, hence our grave obligation to evangelize those the world.

thank you… and i need to take this much more to heart than i have been lately. I don’t even know why i am struggling as i do… (just a lot of crosses, etc…) but for some reason… i keep thinking God wants me to do this orthat… Yet, i am asking myself: What is more important than sharing Truth (Christ) with those who are lost?? Nothing… there is no work greater than trying to save souls from eternal death… Hell…

 

[Nick9]

i agree… and Christians outside the Church who believe in Christ and attempt to follow him to the best of their ability ARE part of the Church, albeit indirectly & incompletely… However, i also feel that those who love Jesus, really Love him… will find the Cahtolic Church… They may rail against Her for awhile… but they will find her…

I think that people can love Jesus as the Word, but not necessarily know Him as the historical figure who saves us. In loving truth and goodness, they love Jesus in a mysterious way…

 

[distracted]

I think that people can love Jesus as the Word, but not necessarily know Him as the historical figure who saves us. In loving truth and goodness, they love Jesus in a mysterious way…

the primary “thing” Protestants lack is the Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist (and in the Church 24/7)…

The more time i spend There, the more is see the truth of this… because i see how different htings are for me when i am outside the Church… outside that Presence… :hypno: uch: :hypno:

 

[Nick9]

the primary “thing” Protestants lack is the Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist (and in the Church 24/7)…

The more time i spend There, the more is see the truth of this… because i see how different htings are for me when i am outside the Church… outside that Presence… :hypno: uch: :hypno:

yes, having Jesus present with us in that physical way is more in keeping with our nature as bodily beings. It is sometimes difficult to appreciate that the Real Presence which we benefit from so strongly during exposition we actually take into our bodies during Communion.

 

[distracted]

yes, having Jesus present with us in that physical way is more in keeping with our nature as bodily beings. It is sometimes difficult to appreciate that the Real Presence which we benefit from so strongly during exposition we actually take into our bodies during Communion.

yes, its funny you mention that because i was thinking about that… about how i have grown to love spending time with Him in the Church so much that i have lost sight of the fact that i have also received him into my very body… unworthy vessel that it is …

I appreciate the Real Presence because i see things differently There than outside There… & when there is a contradition between those 2 perspectives, i try always to believe what i “get” at the Blessed Sacrament…

One time some0ne said to me that “Jesus is everywhere”. I’m sorry but that is NOT true… a little bit of God is everywhere… but Jesus, in His “entirety” is only in the Church…

 

[bpbasilphx]

**Only the Catholic Church has Jesus Christ in a tangible, powerful way… (the Real Presence)… **

Not true. So do the Orthodox and non-Chalcedonian Eastern Churches.

 

[spauline]

the primary “thing” Protestants lack is the Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist (and in the Church 24/7)…

The more time i spend There, the more is see the truth of this… because i see how different htings are for me when i am outside the Church… outside that Presence… :hypno: uch: :hypno:

that is a big deficiency, but it goes much deeper. They lack the Oral Word of God, and hence lead to many errors. That is serisous, especially regarding justification. That they accept contraception usually is really bad, plus they lack four other sacraments, including confession. Confession is more important than eucharist, for without, you can’t even have the eucharits

 

[spauline]

**Only the Catholic Church has Jesus Christ in a tangible, powerful way… (the Real Presence)… **

Not true. So do the Orthodox and non-Chalcedonian Eastern Churches.

that is absolutely correct. Which is why you have practically as good a chance as good Catholics to get to heaven. Now if you guys could unanimously realize the evils of contraception, you’d be even better.

 

[distracted]

. Confession is more important than eucharist, for without, you can’t even have the eucharits

hmmm… never thought of that before…

but if that is the case, there are a lot of people receiving unworthily… in some Churches, No one ever goes to confession… yet they all receive Communion… every mass…

 

[distracted]

that is absolutely correct. Which is why you have practically as good a chance as good Catholics to get to heaven. Now if you guys could unanimously realize the evils of contraception, you’d be even better.

i don’t see how they could have the Real Presence unless they have ordained Catholic priests… to consecrate the Host…

I am not big on this aspect of Catholicism… Maybe i am getting orthodox mixed up with Eastern orthodox… Could you explain what they believe… the difference… etc…

i know one group broke from Rome a long time ago… I would think that would (eventually) make their consecrations invalid… because no properly ordained priest

 

[Nino]

The immortal Teddy Roosevelt said “keep your eyes on the stars but also keep your feet on the ground” A baseball batter tries to get a hit each time…but when he makes an out he should not be surprised or disappointed…why even a hit every other time up is batting .500 which is not bad not bad. I used to have certain standards in my classes…also I would after the first quarter and the grades were in…break my class down into rows of sorts…the row to my right were the high achievers,the middle were average and to my left were those heavily challenged by the subject! When I posted an assignment on the board I listed three problems each was required to do…those in the 90s must do this one…in the 80-90s this one and the others here…but but each had a chance to do an extra credit in another column…and thus they gained confidence and moved up…in classmates.com I have received over 500 contacts from former students each and every one commented on my fairness etc etc…and my jokes (ahem) If I just an average joe can be fair…need it be said my Creator also is ‘fair’…hell is like the "cheers’ sit com…a room full of losers who cant get out and are stuck with each other forever…I dont want that so I will end my note here…

 

[spauline]

hmmm… never thought of that before…

but if that is the case, there are a lot of people receiving unworthily… in some Churches, No one ever goes to confession… yet they all receive Communion… every mass…

well, confession is not ABSOLUTELY necessary for eucharist unless you are in mortal sin. What i mean is, if you commit a mortal sin, eucharist is ruled out until you confess. If you don’t attain justification, you will go to hell. Eucharist doesn’t RESTORE justification, only strenghthens it. It is indeed, the most precious way to strengthen justification, but if one has not justification, the only thing that can save you from hell is confession, unless you acquire perfect contrition.

That is why I would say Confession is more important than the Eucharist. Not that it is a greater sacrament, for the Eucharist is the greatest, but it is more needed when you have fallen from grace, and is the only sacrament you can have before the Eucharits or any others.

 

[spauline]

i don’t see how they could have the Real Presence unless they have ordained Catholic priests… to consecrate the Host…

I am not big on this aspect of Catholicism… Maybe i am getting orthodox mixed up with Eastern orthodox… Could you explain what they believe… the difference… etc…

i know one group broke from Rome a long time ago… I would think that would (eventually) make their consecrations invalid… because no properly ordained priest

the Eastern O -[captial O]- rthodox Churches have valid bishops and priests. They are only in schism, not heresy. Their split, more or less, was 1064 or something like that. Mainly they take issue with Peter, but not with Apostolic Succession as a whole. Further, they have always intended the Eucharist in the sense of Catholicism, even if they don’t use the term “transsubstantiation”.

Hence, they have all seven sacraments.

but the Protestants, even the Anglicans, do not have valid bishops, for eventually their ordained leaders no longer intended to confer the Eucharist as the CC intends it, and so eventually, their valid orders died out. As for other Protestants, they don’t even usually use terms like bishops and priests. They don’t even come close.

As it stands, then, the heretics of Protestantism have no valid Apostolic succession, and hence retain only the Sacraments of Baptism and Marraige in validity (USUALLY, not always, in which case the particular denomination won’t even have these explicitly).

Aside, usually the heretical sects think they have Baptism and Communion, but they don’t. They have only baptism and marraige, if at all any sacraments.

Plus, the Orthodox share most of our Apostolic Tradition, and so fall into far less errors than the Protestants, who are heretics.

That is why I reiterate, there is VERY little that separates the Eastern Orthodox Churches from the Catholic Church. VERY little, so their chances of attaining heaven are really good.