Do Pagan/ Wiccan "spells" really work?

[exoflare]

The evidence for the efficacy of spells is in the tangible results, not in the physical sensations of raising power during ritual. That’s just a byproduct. The majority of the spells that I do involve things that I have no mundane control over, which means that it can’t be self prophecy.

But isn’t that why the spells sometimes “fail”? How is it different from making a prediction about future events and going on a lucky streak every now and then? If you’re going to cling to the standard of pure skepticism and denying the supernatural here, at least be consistent.

 

[tequilamac]

The evidence for the efficacy of spells is in the tangible results, not in the physical sensations of raising power during ritual. That’s just a byproduct. The majority of the spells that I do involve things that I have no mundane control over, which means that it can’t be self prophecy. If it was something that I could control through mundane means, then I probably wouldn’t do the spell in the first place. Magic is always a last resort.

If you claimed to feel the presence of angels or demons, I would accept that you felt something. I would however need some further proof to verify that it was really an “angel” or “demon,” as opposed to an overactive imagination.

forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=1633465&postcount=59

Let me see. Is it a demon or a an angel? Death of infants and fraud? Not a difficult decision. Considering he danced around his bonfire the night before and threw my picture in the flames, (really he’s my next door neighbor so I could see). His spell failed but without that little tingling warning sign down the spine, how could I have known?

If we took spells seriously, thre would be nothing stopping us from taking a bottle of Lourdes water to the nearest casino and dousing the slot machines with it. I had one lady tell me I had to puch the machine just so before it would deliver, and another told me I had to chant a nonsense thing. Why not just pour holy water over the machine before we play if we think spells have uses?

 

[lvy]

How is it different from making a prediction about future events and going on a lucky streak every now and then?

Predictions are passive; spells are active. If you make predictions based on what you want to have happen, you will very often be wrong. If you cast a spell for what you want to have happen, a good caster will often see it manifest.

By self prophecy, I had assumed that you were referring to self fulfilling prophecy. There are spells that fall into that category, but I rarely use them for reasons I already explained. And I never claimed to be a “pure skeptic.” If I was, then I wouldn’t believe in magic in the first place.

Let me see. Is it a demon or a an angel? Death of infants and fraud? Not a difficult decision.

From what you’ve said, it sounds like you just got bad vibes from them. I don’t think there were any “demons.”

 

[JudieK]

Ivy- thank you for your patient replies. You have been very kind here. I still don’t understand, and probably never will… I can’t wrap my mind around all of this spellcasting stuff (it scares me!) … but that’s OK. I work with many people all day long who do not understand my Catholic faith and even mock it. But I still can work side by side with them and get along fine. I don’t bash people over the head with it… but if they want to know more, I will gladly share. You have shared your ideas with us because I asked, and I respect your courage and honesty. Being a Catholic Answers forum, it could have been like jumping behind enemy lines. I can’t imagine going onto a Wiccan forum and engaging in discussion. I know others do, and bless them for that. Anyway… thanks.

 

[exoflare]

Predictions are passive; spells are active. If you make predictions based on what you want to have happen, you will very often be wrong. If you cast a spell for what you want to have happen, a good caster will often see it manifest.

By self prophecy, I had assumed that you were referring to self fulfilling prophecy. There are spells that fall into that category, but I rarely use them for reasons I already explained. And I never claimed to be a “pure skeptic.” If I was, then I wouldn’t believe in magic in the first place.

From what you’ve said, it sounds like you just got bad vibes from them. I don’t think there were any “demons.”

Okay, I see. I guess without knowing exactly what kind of things you are trying to make manifest I wouldn’t be able to comment any further. On a related note, thanks for being so patient with your replies.

 

[bigee]

Hey Wicca people! I met a young girl at work, very sweet and outgoing. She says she is a Pagan, Wiccan. Doesn’t go to Covens. I would like to convert her to Catholicism, any suggestions?

 

[exoflare]

Hey Wicca people! I met a young girl at work, very sweet and outgoing. She says she is a Pagan, Wiccan. Doesn’t go to Covens. I would like to convert her to Catholicism, any suggestions?

You can’t “convert” her yourself - that’s the wrong way to think about it. That’s a decision she would have to make on her own.

But anyway how receptive do you think she seems toward learning about the Church?

 

[Loginus]

YOU FOOLISH CHRISTIAND HOW DARE YOU QUESTION OUR POWER!

Through the blessings of Molock the Destroyer, Tiamat Mother of Choas and Pastrami the Yummy!

I CURSE YOU ALL!

DEATH AND ITCHNESS TO THE DEFILERS! Weep as your God can do nothing

0o0o0o0o0o0o0o0o0o!!!

…lol

 

[jmcrae]

Hey Wicca people! I met a young girl at work, very sweet and outgoing. She says she is a Pagan, Wiccan. Doesn’t go to Covens. I would like to convert her to Catholicism, any suggestions?

Pray to the Holy Spirit for her, and tell her about Holy Water and Blessed Salt.

 

[bigee]

Well Exoflare, I don’t know the answer to any of that, I mostly just acted interested, which I was. I asked her what experience she had with other religions and she said that she was raised Mormon, that she had tried to become Wiccan when she was 11 or 12 but I guess her family had a cow or something and she became a Wiccan when she was eighteen, she is twenty two now. She is a very nice, good looking, caring girl.

 

[bella5110]

What is wrong here?? There is only one religion, one saviour, our lord Jesus christ. Forget wicca.

 

[Loginus]

What is wrong here?? There is only one religion, one saviour, our lord Jesus christ. Forget wicca.

You are the one who is mistake foolish Christian.

Great Cthulhu is ever a warrior god, and of all the Old Ones he is the most terrible, for it is his delight to slay and lay waste to everything that lies beneath his feet, and the very lust to conquer what was once free drives him onward across the heavens and through the spheres; it was he together with his star spawn that defeated the Elder Things, who had long possessed soverieignty of this world before he descended on his gray leathern wings through the upper gate opened by Tog-Sothoth.

Within a tomb protected by great seals he lays as in death, yet he dreams and in his dreams he continues to rules the world, for his thoughts mastered the wills of all lesser creatures.

When he awakens from his island city of R’lyeh, he will once again purge the Earth of its insepid life and cleanse the cities of its non-believers

Wo’oh foolish mortals, bow down and sumit to his greatness or resist and feel the wrath of his fury!

 

[bella5110]

You are the one who is mistake foolish Christian.

Great Cthulhu is ever a warrior god, and of all the Old Ones he is the most terrible, for it is his delight to slay and lay waste to everything that lies beneath his feet, and the very lust to conquer what was once free drives him onward across the heavens and through the spheres; it was he together with his star spawn that defeated the Elder Things, who had long possessed soverieignty of this world before he descended on his gray leathern wings through the upper gate opened by Tog-Sothoth.

Within a tomb protected by great seals he lays as in death, yet he dreams and in his dreams he continues to rules the world, for his thoughts mastered the wills of all lesser creatures.

When he awakens from his island city of R’lyeh, he will once again purge the Earth of its insepid life and cleanse the cities of its non-believers

Wo’oh foolish mortals, bow down and sumit to his greatness or resist and feel the wrath of his fury!

Let me know when the LSD wears off…:whacky:

 

[Loginus]

Let me know when the LSD wears off…:whacky:

How DARE you mock a faithful servant of the Old Gods?? Especially a servant of mighty Cthuhlu!

These words were taken from the book of dark power itself, the Necronomicon written by the all powerful necromancer, Alhazred!

 

[MikeinSD]

“Well Exoflare, I don’t know the answer to any of that, I mostly just acted interested, which I was. I asked her what experience she had with other religions and she said that she was raised Mormon, that she had tried to become Wiccan when she was 11 or 12 but I guess her family had a cow or something and she became a Wiccan when she was eighteen, she is twenty two now. She is a very nice, good looking, caring girl.”

Ask her for a charm. If she gives you one, pls be appreciative. It just might bring you good luck.

 

[bella5110]

How DARE you mock a faithful servant of the Old Gods?? Especially a servant of mighty Cthuhlu!

These words were taken from the book of dark power itself, the Necronomicon written by the all powerful necromancer, Alhazred!

Er…I’m scared…not

Do you know what you sound like?? You know what you can do with that book?

 

[Caesar]

If these “spells” work, they are the work of Satan.

 

[Loginus]

Er…I’m scared…not

Do you know what you sound like?? You know what you can do with that book?

Fool! So be it, Incure my wrath!

You shall fall like all those before you. Be fearful as I send my minions, Eaters of the Dead to torment you!

So to shall you learn the err of insulting this necromancer!

 

[callador]

I have yet to see one work. I don’t see many spells cast, but on occasion someone at a bar will mention they are a witch / warlock.

I was watching my brother play pool a couple of months ago (for a tournament he was in), and there was a lady there who said she could cast spells. I let the subject drop, as it seemed she was just tryinh to get attention. A couple of minutes later, one of the opposing players missed the 8 ball shot. The lady then turns to us and says, “Monkey Dust.” I asked her to explain what she was talking about, since I did not see powder or a chimp nearby. She said that the Monkey Dust spell makes people become inaccurate. Of couse, she only mentioned if AFTER he missed the shot.

Basically, if I can’t get verifiable and more importantly, repeatable results, it is just BOGUS. Saying you did something after it happened, and then not being able to do it again when asked, is not very impressive.

 

[Milliardo]

I have yet to see one work. I don’t see many spells cast, but on occasion someone at a bar will mention they are a witch / warlock.

I don’t take much stock on that; most serious Wiccans will not announce they’re a witch, obviously because of the reprisals if one makes such a declaration.

Basically, if I can’t get verifiable and more importantly, repeatable results, it is just BOGUS. Saying you did something after it happened, and then not being able to do it again when asked, is not very impressive.

True, but that can also be said of prayer; would it be less impressive then if one’ prayer for something be granted, and another’s prayer for the same thing is not? Both are not verifiable, and both are not repeatable results. So, in essence then, are both bogus? of course not. I am not saying casting spells is true or even the thing to do, but just to dismiss it offhand doesn’t work either, because in many cases, the spells do work.