B
Do regular Catholics (like me) really commit so many mortal sins? Really?!
- Status
C
Cat
Guest
In I Corinthians 9:22, St. Paul says, “I have become all things to all men, that I may by all mean save some.”That is exactly what we are doing! You can’t teach if you don’t have people come.
I really want everyone to know about Christ, so whatever it takes…
Seriously we are trying to be merciful and really trying to meet people where they are and hopefully they will see the truth, just a little at a time. It worked for me
Read the verse in the context of the chapter, and St. Paul describes how he becomes “all things”. He essentially does the ol’ Bait and Switch!
Also, there is the Mars Hill speech, in which St. Paul starts out by making it appear that all the Greek gods are good, and then masterfully tells the Greeks that he knows who The Unknown God is. Again, Bait and Switch.
B
Blessedwithfive
Guest
I do not lie to the kids or parents, I simply follow my pastors advice (and Pope Francis) that we first need to be merciful, get them through the doors, and then carefully teach them first by example then by words.
I really do know the “rules” and what might be a mortal sin for me might not be for someone else. I will admit, that concept took me some time to realize. I think that was the point of this whole post. Mortal sins are complicated. The more you know, the more harshly you are judged. Of course, I also teach my teens that with all the information on the web, ignorance is a choice.
Feel free to PM me if you want to discuss this further.
C
Cat
Guest
I and others have stated it several times on this thread–the internet is not a good catechist.
Anyone searching for information will find what they WANT to find. And there are a lot of spurious “Catholic” sites on the internet.
And I stick by what I said about the priest’s homily–so many people do not listen with their whole mind. I think that Satan and his demons go into full attack mode when a priest starts giving a really pithy homily. These evil ones will do everything in their power to distract the Christians in the pews who are trying to listen.
The best catechist is the Church–the people in the local parish who live in Christ and love with His agape love. ALL of the parishioners are involved with catechesis, not just those who are called to be official religious teachers! Kids learn what they live with day after day, year after year. When they live with loving, disciplined people, they will become loving, disciplined people. When they see gossip, bitterness, grudge-holding, snobbery, stinginess, complaining, prejudice, hypocrisy, co-habiters, perverts, etc.–that’s what they will learn to accept as “normal” for Christians.
T
turtle18
Guest
I go to Confession because I want to; I love God and it is one of the best means of drawing closer to Him. It is also one of the best ways to humble yourself in front of the Lord. All of us owe our lives to God’s mercy. So it does not matter to me if the sin is mortal or venial, I just go.
I also know many people who claim they are scrupulous. But they really seem to be blind to some of their true sins-narcissism, pride, egoism, selfishness, etc. As I pointed out at the start of the thread, it seems most people go because of sexual sins but it seems it is quite easy to be blind to other sins.
I also know many people who claim they are scrupulous. But they really seem to be blind to some of their true sins-narcissism, pride, egoism, selfishness, etc. As I pointed out at the start of the thread, it seems most people go because of sexual sins but it seems it is quite easy to be blind to other sins.
S
steve_b
Guest
You are telling your students & their parents, that deliberately missing mass on Sunday is not a mortal sin. You know that’s wrong. Which of their parents also know that’s wrong as well? Your pastor is telling you to lie to them so that good might come from it? Good grief!!!
It is NEVER permissible to do evil that good might come from it. That is NOT my opinion.
Romans 3:8
Have you read Splendor of Truth by St JPII the Great? Give this to your pastor as well to read
http://w2.vatican.va/content/john-p...p-ii_enc_06081993_veritatis-splendor.html#$3K
In it JPII says (beginning at paragraph 79)
***Intrinsic evil": it is not licit to do evil that good may come of it ***(cf. Rom 3:8)
no evil done with a good intention can be excused. ‘There are those who say: And why not do evil that good may come? Their condemnation is just’ (Rom 3:8)"
B:
All your doing with that statement is saying,
*]there is no absolute truth. Your truth isn’t my truth. That’s moral relativism, which is a heresy.
*]or it’s being deceitful, let’s keep people ignorant so they don’t know the truth
Both are wrong
B:
Mortal sin is NOT complicated. It’s only complicated for the relativist, the deceitful, or the mentally impared.
B:
Here’s a suggestion
Ask your question (exactly as it’s being presented here) to Fr Serpa and see if he answers it on CAF.
forums.catholic-questions.org/images/ask-an-apologist.png
B
Blessedwithfive
Guest
You are telling your students & their parents, that deliberately missing mass on Sunday is not a mortal sin. You know that’s wrong. Which of their parents also know that’s wrong as well? Your pastor is telling you to lie to them so that good might come from it? Good grief!!!
It is NEVER permissible to do evil that good might come from it. That is NOT my opinion.
Romans 3:8
Have you read Splendor of Truth by St JPII the Great? Give this to your pastor as well to read
http://w2.vatican.va/content/john-p...p-ii_enc_06081993_veritatis-splendor.html#$3K
In it JPII says (beginning at paragraph 79)
***Intrinsic evil": it is not licit to do evil that good may come of it ***(cf. Rom 3:8)
no evil done with a good intention can be excused. ‘There are those who say: And why not do evil that good may come? Their condemnation is just’ (Rom 3:8)"
All your doing with that statement is saying,
*]there is no absolute truth. Your truth isn’t my truth. That’s moral relativism, which is a heresy.
*]or it’s being deceitful, let’s keep people ignorant so they don’t know the truth
Both are wrong
Mortal sin is NOT complicated. It’s only complicated for the relativist, the deceitful, or the mentally impared.
Here’s a suggestion
Ask your question (exactly as it’s being presented here) to Fr Serpa and see if he answers it on CAF.
forums.catholic-questions.org/images/ask-an-apologist.png
If mortal sin culpability wasn’t complicated, we would have nothing to discuss here on Catholic Answers. Just to be clear. I still teach that missing Mass is a grave matter. Then I explain the three conditions needed for a sin to be mortal. I stop just short of saying that missing Mass intentionally is a mortal sin.
Not to be snippy but, why don’t you ask Father Serpa if we are all held to the exact same standards for a sin to be Mortal. I stand by my understand that what might be a mortal sin for me might not be for you.
If push comes to shove, I say that I believe missing Mass unjustly for me is a Mortal sin because I believe it fits the requirement/conditions.
Can’t someone help me out? I really struggled with this last year but I have come to terms with what my pastor said. I only want to do what is best for the kids. (I teach 6th and 10th grades).
R
robertmidwest
Guest
This forum really seams to attract the scrupulous. It is frustrating because many will acknowledge they are scruplous, then launch into the very behavior they supposedly want to overcome.
The protestant background helps you see things from a different perspective, but it doesn’t look like it is warping your judgement. It seems like you have a very good handle on things.
S
steve_b
Guest
Complicated for whom?
B:
So…you are intentionally deceiving them?
An example is in order here to make some qualified distinctions.
I was in the store the other day getting some meat for a BBQ
At the meat isle, I heard a woman a few paces away, asking another person (who looked like a fellow shopper) where the pickles were. He pointed her in the wrong direction. I spoke up to direct her in the right direction. I was then informed by another woman near me, what was REALLY going on here. It was a class exercise, and she was their teacher. Noticing the dynamic of the 2 students involved in this exercise, I asked her if the man and the woman here (both adults), were special ed students. She said yes. They were in the store to see if they could follow simple directions. Neither could do that and they struggled to do what was asked of them. I asked their teacher how serious was their mental deformity? She said it was very difficult. So I asked is their IQ less than 50. She said it was right around there.
So, back to the topic
When it comes to committing mortal sin, 3 componants are necessary
- serious wrong
- a person knows it’s serious wrong
- they then consent to commit the sin
- understand wrong vs serious wrong?
- does their consent to commit sin come from full cognitive reasoning?
Given that example, I have to say, It amazes me how people NOT on this spectrum of mental deformity, all of a sudden when it comes to mortal sin, want to argue mental defect or that mortal sin requires genius level IQ status in order to figure it out, ergo mortal sin is virtually impossible to commit for the average person…
B:
And not to be snippy in return are you reluctant to ask Fr Serpa about this?
My responses so far have been full of quotes. Not my opinion(s).
So I would still recommend, asking Fr Serpa on that link I provided, what he thinks of you as a catechist, telling your students it’s not a mortal sin to deliberately miss mass on Sunday. Also ask Fr Serpa, what he would suggest regarding your pastor who told you to teach what you know is wrong, so that peoples rear ends stay in the pew.
IOW contradict Paul Romans 3:8
B:
You’re a catechist. Teaching Truth should come easily and without compromise. Why would someone have to drag the truth out of you?
I would suggest, you’re struggeling with this because you know the truth, and what you’ve been told to teach by your pastor is wrong.
Think about this. You might be the ONLY or last catechist those kids ever have. After this class you might not see them or their parents ever again. They might not have another catechist in their life. Yet you’re teaching them it’s not a mortal sin to deliberately miss mass on Sunday and THAT’S what they go away believing… Ergo what they hear and understand, is that missing mass on Sunday is not a big deal.
That flat out contradicts scripture & Church teaching. .
I have to say again. Neither you nor your pastor want this to befall you for intentionally teaching error Matthew 18:6
And again, scripture is clear #22 and the CCC references that very passage from Hebrews 2178 in connection to the mass.
Here’s another thought. As a catechist, you have books I’m sure that come from the diocese. Ask your bishop what his position is on this subject we’re talking about. I’d be interested in the answer.
S
steve_b
Guest
I’ll give just one example
Ever hear the term C & E Catholics? That’s Christmas and Easter Catholics. Out of 52 Sundays in a year these “Catholics” go to mass 2 times in a year.
That means they are in mortal sin 50 out of 52 weeks. And if they just show up to mass on those 2 days and receive the Eucharist without previously confessing their deliberate missing mass all the rest of the year, they commit a sacreledge on top of their mortal sin which they remain in.
scripture is clear #22 and the CCC references that very passage from Hebrews 2178 in connection to the mass.
S
steve_b
Guest
He doesn’t lie, he doesn’t deceive, As Jerome would say Paul was being a bit hypocrytical rebuking Peter when Paul did the same and more. I’m not seeing the bait and switch however
C:
Again, I’m not seeing the bait and switch.
Acts 17:22 So Paul, standing in the middle of the Are-op′agus, said: “Men of Athens, I perceive that in every way you are very religious. 23 For as I passed along, and observed the objects of your worship, I found also an altar with this inscription, ‘To an unknown god.’ What therefore you worship as unknown, this I proclaim to you. 24 The God who made the world and everything in it, being Lord of heaven and earth, does not live in shrines made by man, 25 nor is he served by human hands, as though he needed anything, since he himself gives to all men life and breath and everything. 26 And he made from one every nation of men to live on all the face of the earth, having determined allotted periods and the boundaries of their habitation, 27 that they should seek God, in the hope that they might feel after him and find him. Yet he is not far from each one of us, 28 for
‘In him we live and move and have our being’;
as even some of your poets have said,
‘For we are indeed his offspring.’
29 Being then God’s offspring, we ought not to think that the Deity is like gold, or silver, or stone, a representation by the art and imagination of man. 30 The times of ignorance God overlooked, but now he commands all men everywhere to repent, 31 because he has fixed a day on which he will judge the world in righteousness by a man whom he has appointed, and of this he has given assurance to all men by raising him from the dead.”…
B
Blessedwithfive
Guest
Complicated for whom?
So…you are intentionally deceiving them?
An example is in order here to make some qualified distinctions.
I was in the store the other day getting some meat for a BBQ
At the meat isle, I heard a woman a few paces away, asking another person (who looked like a fellow shopper) where the pickles were. He pointed her in the wrong direction. I spoke up to direct her in the right direction. I was then informed by another woman near me, what was REALLY going on here. It was a class exercise, and she was their teacher. Noticing the dynamic of the 2 students involved in this exercise, I asked her if the man and the woman here (both adults), were special ed students. She said yes. They were in the store to see if they could follow simple directions. Neither could do that and they struggled to do what was asked of them. I asked their teacher how serious was their mental deformity? She said it was very difficult. So I asked is their IQ less than 50. She said it was right around there.
So, back to the topic
When it comes to committing mortal sin, 3 componants are necessary
Does a person with an IQ of 50 like these 2 in the example
- serious wrong
- a person knows it’s serious wrong
- they then consent to commit the sin
Both requirements are doubtful given the mental capacity of these 2 people.
- understand wrong vs serious wrong?
- does their consent to commit sin come from full cognitive reasoning?
Given that example, I have to say, It amazes me how people NOT on this spectrum of mental deformity, all of a sudden when it comes to mortal sin, want to argue mental defect or that mortal sin requires genius level IQ status in order to figure it out, ergo mortal sin is virtually impossible to commit for the average person…
And not to be snippy in return
My responses so far have been full of quotes. Not my opinion(s).
So I would still recommend, asking Fr Serpa on that link I provided, what he thinks of you as a catechist, telling your students it’s not a mortal sin to deliberately miss mass on Sunday. Also ask Fr Serpa, what he would suggest regarding your pastor who told you to teach what you know is wrong, so that peoples rear ends stay in the pew.
IOW contradict Paul Romans 3:8
You’re a catechist. Teaching Truth should come easily and without compromise. Why would someone have to drag the truth out of you?
I would suggest, you’re struggeling with this because you know the truth, and what you’ve been told to teach by your pastor is wrong.
Think about this. You might be the ONLY or last catechist those kids ever have. After this class you might not see them or their parents ever again. They might not have another catechist in their life. Yet you’re teaching them it’s not a mortal sin to deliberately miss mass on Sunday and THAT’S what they go away believing… Ergo what they hear and understand, is that missing mass on Sunday is not a big deal.
That flat out contradicts scripture & Church teaching. .
I have to say again. Neither you nor your pastor want this to befall you for intentionally teaching error Matthew 18:6
And again, scripture is clear #22 and the CCC references that very passage from Hebrews 2178 in connection to the mass.
Here’s another thought. As a catechist, you have books I’m sure that come from the diocese. Ask your bishop what his position is on this subject we’re talking about. I’d be interested in the answer.
You’re right. I do struggle with this. I’ll give you that. But I am not willing to undermine my pastor. I follow his lead. I do worry about the future of the Church. I personally think we need to hold the line and teach that some things a simply sins no matter how you cut them up but I was not put in charge of the parish. He was and I will follow his lead. We have to do something or we won’t have anyone left to teach.
About a year ago I put this out in these forums. And after much discussion and prayer I decided to follow my pastor for now. To be completely honest this church is known as the more traditional church in the area.
W
wadramli
Guest
Lets do my mother and her . my mother 14 kids and she has 2 kids and baby on the way . lets level the fields some.
My bible class . tribal women with babies crying . I have to yell the lesson in a loud voice like Methodist preacher . hey tatonti , wha ? WHAAAAAaaaaaaat are the names of Jacob wives ? repeat them for me . hey TATONTIIIIII I’m talking to you. She in a different world . one of hers dangling in the open and the other nursing the baby . I have to walk over to her and yell …get rid of the baby now . she looks at me and hands her baby to the other woman who does what ? she nurses the baby .
Do you see it ? half of my siblings were not nursed by my mother . my kid brother was not even nursed by my mother . my aunt nursed him. In infact I suspect this lady here did more nursing than my mother .
Note also neither me nor anyone object to the babies presence . they stay .
At Mass over one thousand attend . packed big chapel. Not a sound. Where are the kids ? they’re out in the compound supervised and watched by members of the tribe . here it is not uncommon that a child tugs at you and demand you pick him/her up or get him this and that . he belongs to your tribe therefore he is yours too. its an issue for the church . church takes orphan and raises him but tribe can claim the child anytime . there are really no orphans .not in the western sense .
But the kids sometimes do go in the chapel during mass and run around sometimes. Not for long . playing hide and seek or chasing one another sort of thing . we ignore them. some laugh or smile. youth where did it go they say ?
Now the lady here complained about her two kids throwing tantrum. The issue here is with the congregation. They get touchy . in her smaller world , the world at home she is in control . but she doesn’t have that control in church . she can probably slide by for a shorter a Mass. But a long winding Mass ? she got placed in a difficult position .the congregation is an issue .
Also someone could go to the priest and tell him look I need a dispensation because I really couldn’t participate because there are a couple of kids making noise.
There is something in St Aquinas writing about the law to do with the common good . I am not sure though.
the sabbath for man or man for sabbath .
if she had time she would have prevalied . so invite priest for dinner at home. then he is in her truf . good food .have kids all over priest . show him what it is like . in no time he will cough up that dispensation . in no time . no father , you really didn’t have too. well if you insist .okay now you may go here two acid relief pills lol. j/k
The problem of course can be solved by having a nursery . where I’m the nursery comes built in the culture. Women nursing babies of other mothers . kids are everyone kids
.
So we level the fields and we see the lady job is harder than my mother .
Her husband issues. down where I’m at things are different . a guy beat up his wife . woman screams . men from extended family come to see what’s up. Woman has black eye . who did this they ask? she says husband. Husband grabbed by older men and they beat the living something out of him . you really don’t have that much say as a husband when you’re young. . the tribes are not about to let a woman be under the mercy of a young male powered by testosterone. This western life style where you put a woman with a man in a house by themselves is madness . a man gets to have a say after many years after he has proven he is a man . but for the lady here she has to control her husband with what ? with love ? a deal that involves so many untenable stuff such as self realization and actualization and determination and who knows what else . she is always at risk of her husband walking out on her . in this incident he gave her a look . get in the car he says . more work for her . she comes to Mass and she leaves having to discipline her husband for rebellious behavior . she has to nip at the pod this sort of thing to make sure it doesn’t grow and cause further trouble down the road. frankly If he has any issues he should have taken it with the priest . so he didn’t really back his wife. he blamed her rather .so she has to fix this problem
Now there is another issue . western commitment to cultural pluralism. .but look enough for now . go ahead beat me up
My bible class . tribal women with babies crying . I have to yell the lesson in a loud voice like Methodist preacher . hey tatonti , wha ? WHAAAAAaaaaaaat are the names of Jacob wives ? repeat them for me . hey TATONTIIIIII I’m talking to you. She in a different world . one of hers dangling in the open and the other nursing the baby . I have to walk over to her and yell …get rid of the baby now . she looks at me and hands her baby to the other woman who does what ? she nurses the baby .
Do you see it ? half of my siblings were not nursed by my mother . my kid brother was not even nursed by my mother . my aunt nursed him. In infact I suspect this lady here did more nursing than my mother .
Note also neither me nor anyone object to the babies presence . they stay .
At Mass over one thousand attend . packed big chapel. Not a sound. Where are the kids ? they’re out in the compound supervised and watched by members of the tribe . here it is not uncommon that a child tugs at you and demand you pick him/her up or get him this and that . he belongs to your tribe therefore he is yours too. its an issue for the church . church takes orphan and raises him but tribe can claim the child anytime . there are really no orphans .not in the western sense .
But the kids sometimes do go in the chapel during mass and run around sometimes. Not for long . playing hide and seek or chasing one another sort of thing . we ignore them. some laugh or smile. youth where did it go they say ?
Now the lady here complained about her two kids throwing tantrum. The issue here is with the congregation. They get touchy . in her smaller world , the world at home she is in control . but she doesn’t have that control in church . she can probably slide by for a shorter a Mass. But a long winding Mass ? she got placed in a difficult position .the congregation is an issue .
Also someone could go to the priest and tell him look I need a dispensation because I really couldn’t participate because there are a couple of kids making noise.
There is something in St Aquinas writing about the law to do with the common good . I am not sure though.
the sabbath for man or man for sabbath .
if she had time she would have prevalied . so invite priest for dinner at home. then he is in her truf . good food .have kids all over priest . show him what it is like . in no time he will cough up that dispensation . in no time . no father , you really didn’t have too. well if you insist .okay now you may go here two acid relief pills lol. j/k
The problem of course can be solved by having a nursery . where I’m the nursery comes built in the culture. Women nursing babies of other mothers . kids are everyone kids
.
So we level the fields and we see the lady job is harder than my mother .
Her husband issues. down where I’m at things are different . a guy beat up his wife . woman screams . men from extended family come to see what’s up. Woman has black eye . who did this they ask? she says husband. Husband grabbed by older men and they beat the living something out of him . you really don’t have that much say as a husband when you’re young. . the tribes are not about to let a woman be under the mercy of a young male powered by testosterone. This western life style where you put a woman with a man in a house by themselves is madness . a man gets to have a say after many years after he has proven he is a man . but for the lady here she has to control her husband with what ? with love ? a deal that involves so many untenable stuff such as self realization and actualization and determination and who knows what else . she is always at risk of her husband walking out on her . in this incident he gave her a look . get in the car he says . more work for her . she comes to Mass and she leaves having to discipline her husband for rebellious behavior . she has to nip at the pod this sort of thing to make sure it doesn’t grow and cause further trouble down the road. frankly If he has any issues he should have taken it with the priest . so he didn’t really back his wife. he blamed her rather .so she has to fix this problem
Now there is another issue . western commitment to cultural pluralism. .but look enough for now . go ahead beat me up
C
Cat
Guest
You are telling your students & their parents, that deliberately missing mass on Sunday is not a mortal sin. You know that’s wrong. Which of their parents also know that’s wrong as well? Your pastor is telling you to lie to them so that good might come from it? Good grief!!!
It is NEVER permissible to do evil that good might come from it. That is NOT my opinion.
Romans 3:8
Have you read Splendor of Truth by St JPII the Great? Give this to your pastor as well to read
http://w2.vatican.va/content/john-p...p-ii_enc_06081993_veritatis-splendor.html#$3K
In it JPII says (beginning at paragraph 79)
***Intrinsic evil": it is not licit to do evil that good may come of it ***(cf. Rom 3:8)
no evil done with a good intention can be excused. ‘There are those who say: And why not do evil that good may come? Their condemnation is just’ (Rom 3:8)"
All your doing with that statement is saying,
*]there is no absolute truth. Your truth isn’t my truth. That’s moral relativism, which is a heresy.
*]or it’s being deceitful, let’s keep people ignorant so they don’t know the truth
Both are wrong
Mortal sin is NOT complicated. It’s only complicated for the relativist, the deceitful, or the mentally impared.
Here’s a suggestion
Ask your question (exactly as it’s being presented here) to Fr Serpa and see if he answers it on CAF.
forums.catholic-questions.org/images/ask-an-apologist.png
God will not count it as sin if with a pure heart and out of trust and loving respect, we obey our priests, who are ordained by the Church with the approval of Jesus Christ Himself.
It would be wrong to disobey our priests and undermine them by teaching something different than they have asked us to teach.
You are not a priest, are you? Only priests have the charism of a “pastor’s heart” (or a "shepherd’s heart). The Holy Spirit guides them so that they will know what is best for their flock of Christians. Just as real shepherds read the weather, sense the predators, and diagnose disease in their flock, so priests read their congregations and the situations, and make decisions, guided by the Holy Spirit, that will help their sheep to survive and thrive.
We cannot possibly judge a priest’s shepherding decisions. We are not where he is, neither do we have the Holy Spirit’s guiding about another man’s congregation.
B
Brendan_64
Guest
We are NOT being merciful by watering things down in order to make things seem more palatable for others. Mercy is embodied in Church teaching, Church teaching is mercy. Are we now saying that Christ himself was merciful, or that Church teachings are not the teachings of Christ?
It is not merciful by trying to give people the false impression that certain things are not sinful. Quite the reverse.
garve matter is grave matter. If someone commits such an act with full knowledge and full consent, then the sin is mortal.
If someone leads someone else to believe that something which is a mortal sin is in fact not a mortal sin, then that person has sinned by misleading someone like this. Personally I wouldn’t fancy having to stand alone before God on my day of judgement and be asked to justify why I led someone to sin by giving them the false impression that something was not a mortal sin (when I knew that it was).
I disagree. If a priest asks us to do something that we know is wrong, then we are not bound to obey that priest. If we know that what we are being asked to do is wrong then we should not teach it. We have a responsibility to act according to the teachings of the Church, and our parish priest is not the embodiment of Church teaching.
If what the priest is telling us is contrary to what our Church teaches, then he is wrong and he must be challenged. If we teach something that is wrong then, regardless of who told us to do it, we must not do it. We are called to teach the truth, not to simply do as we’re told to by our priest.
If a priest is telling us things that are contrary to Church teaching (and we have a responsibility to find that out for ourselves) then he ought to be called out on this.
C
Cat
Guest
The difficulty with this is interpreting what the Church teaches.
Certainly it’s obvious when it comes to the 10 Commandments. If the priest asks us for sex, we know that’s wrong because it breaks the commandment against adultery. Or if the priest tells us to go rob a bank, that’s wrong.
But one thing this thread has demonstrated is that not all sins are mortal, and not all actions are even sins.
There must be three things present for a sin to be mortal, and in the case of missing Mass, it is questionable whether people truly–REALLY TRULY–understand that this is a mortal sin. If they didn’t comprehend that, then it isn’t mortal.
The question is, did they really comprehend that? I think a lot of Catholics don’t believe or accept the teachings of the Church in regards to issues like homosexuality, divorce, drunkenness, birth control, etc… So they feel that attending Mass would be hypocritical and therefore, they don’t attend. IMO, this is a lack of comprehension of the obligation to attend Mass, and therefore, they are sinning without full knowledge, so it wouldn’t be mortal.
(Same for the other issues BTW–homosexuality, etc. The reason they don’t accept the teachings is that they don’t have a complete understanding of the Catholic Church teaching, so they aren’t accountable for their wrong beliefs.)
I also think that many people miss Mass because those who drive them there miss Mass. A lot of children and teenagers, as well as older people, rely on others for their transportation to Mass, so it’s not up to them whether they go. This also is not a sin because it’s not full consent.
And there’s sickness, which includes emotional illness. If someone is in a distraught frame of mind, they are not sinning by skipping Mass because they aren’t thinking straight due to their illness, and therefore don’t have full knowledge.
These are just a few examples of situations where it is not mortal sin to miss Mass. The point is that there are many situations, and it is not up to us to determine whether another’s sin is mortal or even sin. It’s up to the Holy Spirit to convict people of sin, and it’s up to the priest to determine whether the sin is mortal or venial.
V
Vico
Guest
Full knowledge means known by conscience or by the Church teaching that the action is sinful, even if the person does not agree with it personally.
B
Brendan_64
Guest
Knowingly rejecting Church teaching on an issue does not mean that commiting such a sin is not mortal. We are obliged to accept ALL Church teachings. If the Church teaches it and, knowing that the Church teaches this, we choose to reject it, then we have not lessened our culpability beacause we have full knowledge of what the Church teaches.
Conscience must be formed in line with Church teaching. We are NOT free to hold an opinion different to what our Church teaches.
Conscience must be formed in line with Church teaching. We are NOT free to hold an opinion different to what our Church teaches.
F
FreeEver
Guest
In the New Testament, 1 John, Chapter 1.
8 If we say, “We are without sin,” we deceive ourselves,* and the truth is not in us.
God Bless and Peace to all.
8 If we say, “We are without sin,” we deceive ourselves,* and the truth is not in us.
God Bless and Peace to all.
P
ProVobis
Guest
Personally I think this is a decadent way of looking at morality in general. As many of our transgressions are against our neighbors, perhaps we should ask them how severe or grave the sin was? Does one whose bike was stolen, for example, really care about whether the thief had full knowledge and consent?
They don’t teach moral theology very well, but I did take a graduate course in business ethics from a Benedictine university no less, and I know that if there is any perceived social injustice, people will fight back, whether you knew what you were doing or you didn’t or given full consent, blah. One doesn’t take responsibility for his deeds by rationalizing them to justify receiving communion, which shouldn’t be an end in itself but we treat it as such.
But that’s my opinion, for what it’s worth.
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