Do today's Catholics wish we would be less Catholic?

[Walk-worthy]

Do today’s Catholics wish we would be less Catholic? In a March 29 essay by Bradley Eli, M.Div., Ma.Th. • ChurchMilitant.com there is a rising concern Catholics are losing their identity, and want to reclaim it before it’s gone forever! How do others view this perspective by Bradly?

 

[TheLittleLady]

I’ve never met nor encountered a Catholic who wishes so.

CM uses these articles to generate unrest, fear, scandal. To take our eyes away from the Gospel.

 

[Lou2U]

Do you have a link to the article in question?

Church Militant is not a good source to read. They were requested some time ago to change their name (as it was previously titled 'Real Catholic TV) because the Archdiocese of Detroit did not considered them authorised to use the term Catholic for their activities. You would be best served not reading it.

 

[ProdglArchitect]

50/50. There’s a large contingent of “Catholics” who don’t care at all for what the Church teaches. They want the Church to conform to the spirit of the age.

On the other end of the spectrum, there’s a large contingent of faithful who want the Church to fully embrace her identity and preach the hard truths on issues, with accompanying action from our clergy. (Especially true from those of us who wish they’d publicly denounce the politicians/celebrities who are Catholic in name only.)

I’m not quite as dismissive as CM as others on the forum, but I still only read about a quarter of their articles, if even that many. Most of their work is inflammatory and, while I think well-meaning for the Church, usually misses the mark.

 

[Walk-worthy]

Do you have a link to the article in question?

Sorry, I don’t but go to their site and search. I’m sure it’s there. I found it there.

 

[Walk-worthy]

I’m not quite as dismissive as CM as others on the forum, but I still only read about a quarter of their articles, if even that many. Most of their work is inflammatory and, while I think well-meaning for the Church, usually misses the mark.

It’s possible CM has opened the can of worms! Without them asking the tough questions most of us would have never known what goes on behind closed doors! Just my HO!

 

[ProdglArchitect]

ProdglArchitect:

I’m not quite as dismissive as CM as others on the forum, but I still only read about a quarter of their articles, if even that many. Most of their work is inflammatory and, while I think well-meaning for the Church, usually misses the mark.

It’s possible CM has opened the can of worms! Without them asking the tough questions most of us would have never known what goes on behind closed doors! Just my HO!

That’s why I don’t write them off completely.

 

[Lou2U]

Sorry, I don’t but go to their site and search. I’m sure it’s there. I found it there.

I’m afraid I can’t find one article written on the date you cited, or by the author you cited on their site at all.

It’s possible CM has opened the can of worms! Without them asking the tough questions most of us would have never known what goes on behind closed doors! Just my HO!

Please be careful with this, and bear in mind CM does not have the permission of its archdiocese to call itself Catholic.

 

[Salibi]

One thing I find confusing is what exactly do you mean by a “Catholic identity”?

Catholicism is a religion. Religion (or lack thereof) is an integral part of people’s identities, but it’s not the alpha-omega of identity in general. Catholics’ identities are shaped by numerous factors and issues other than Catholicism. For example, I identify as an Arabic-speaking (language) Lebanese (nationality) Maronite ( ethno-religion). Others many identify as American-French Catholic or by any other combination. I don’t see how exactly one can craft a ‘one-size-fits-all’ Catholic identity, given the numerous other factors people take into account when identifying themselves.

I would appreciate it if you could clarify what the author means by Catholic identity, so that we on here can better get the gist of what he is talking about. Perhaps he means the mostly-Latin Western world is losing its identity as the historical centre of Latin-Rite Catholicism? In that case one is inclined to objectively agree. However, a Latin Catholic identity is not the sole Catholic identity out there.

 

[choose_to_love]

wait, do mean that it is CM’s intention to take one’s eyes away from the Gospel? If so, I am wondering how you know that.

 

[choose_to_love]

“they were requested some time ago to change their name” And of note, they did, as opposed to some others who have manifestly refused such directives.

Disagree that one is best served by not reading CM. They are like any other source, one must evaluate each article independently, and they do report things others do not.

 

[TheLittleLady]

When we focus on unrest, fear, suspicion, we are not looking at the joy and beauty of the Gospel.

Whatsoever things are true, just, honest, merciful, if there is virtue and praise think on THOSE things.

 

[choose_to_love]

But is it CM’s “intention” (your word, not mine) to take one’s eyes away from the Gospel?

How does one address the abuse crisis, for instance, without looking at it?

Could there not be time in one’s day for contemplation of the true and beautiful, and time for considering the problems of the world as well?

 

[TMC]

One thing I find confusing is what exactly do you mean by a “Catholic identity”?

This is the core issue, in my opinion. There is a small but very vocal group that wants to be able to say what “Catholic” looks like (culturally, spiritually, not necessarily physically). Unsurprisingly, they invariably conclude that Catholic looks like them (and not like others). They have a lot to say about pretty much every topic, but the core message boils down to “I am a real Catholic, those others are not.” Its a good way to collect an internet following, but not good for much else, IMHO.

 

[phil19034]

One thing I find confusing is what exactly do you mean by a “Catholic identity”?

Catholicism is a religion. Religion (or lack thereof) is an integral part of people’s identities, but it’s not the alpha-omega of identity in general. Catholics’ identities are shaped by numerous factors and issues other than Catholicism. For example, I identify as an Arabic-speaking (language) Lebanese (nationality) Maronite ( ethno-religion). Others many identify as American-French Catholic or by any other combination. I don’t see how exactly one can craft a ‘one-size-fits-all’ Catholic identity, given the numerous other factors people take into account when identifying themselves.

I would appreciate it if you could clarify what the author means by Catholic identity, so that we on here can better get the gist of what he is talking about. Perhaps he means the mostly-Latin Western world is losing its identity as the historical centre of Latin-Rite Catholicism? In that case one is inclined to objectively agree. However, a Latin Catholic identity is not the sole Catholic identity out there.

“Catholic identity” is often a phrase used regarding Catholic schools, colleges, hospitals, etc.

If I was the sum it up, it would be something like this:

A person and/or organisation has a “Catholic identity” when a third party can easily notice that the Catholic person/organization in question places the teachings & traditions of the Catholic Church into daily practice.

 

[TheLittleLady]

But is it CM’s “intention” (your word, not mine) to take one’s eyes away from the Gospel?

Kindly show me where I stated anything about Mr Voris’ “intention”.

What I said is:

CM uses these articles to generate unrest, fear, scandal. To take our eyes away from the Gospel.

How does one address the abuse crisis, for instance, without looking at it?

The abuse crisis has been addressed for nearly two decades, every Diocese in the US put policies in place years ago. There have been studies and documents from the Vatican, Bishop’s Conferences, individual Bishops, secular sources. Honestly, one could spend a very long time and not read all of the ink on this topic.

The Boston Globe did the journalistic work that brought the scandal to public light in 2002.

Again, the stories printed at CM, this story, in particular, promote the mindset of the Pharisee in Luke chapter 18. It plants a seed in the mind of the reader “those people are not real Catholics, I am a far better Catholic”. Not at all how Scripture teaches us to relate to our brothers and sisters in Christ.

As St Paul told us:

Rejoice in the Lord always. I shall say it again: rejoice!
Your kindness should be known to all. The Lord is near.

Have no anxiety at all, but in everything, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, make your requests known to God.

Then the peace of God that surpasses all understanding will guard your hearts and minds in Christ Jesus.

Finally, brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is gracious, if there is any excellence and if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things.

 

[Crusader13]

It’s difficult to say and I think that most Catholics want to identify as Catholic, but there’s often disagreement on what it means to be Catholic.

There’s certainly been a loss of faith over the last few decades and poor catechesis has contributed to much of this.

“I am a real Catholic, those others are not.”

I disagree with @TMC comments that it’s solely one side with a vocal opinion on what it means to be Catholic.

All one has to do is jump on these forums and they can see how various and opposing all of our views are regarding what the Church teaches.

This is also prevalent amongst our clergy. Some Catholics prefer the James Martin view of Catholicism and others gravitate more towards the Fr. Mike Schmitz view.

I think most people want the authentic form of Catholicism, but not everyone agrees on what that is anymore.

 

[TMC]

I disagree with @TMC comments that it’s solely one side with a vocal opinion on what it means to be Catholic.

I think this is a fair comment. I mostly see one particular “side” take this attitude, but I can admit that the “other side” does a lot of the same. Maybe I don’t see it as much – too me the more vocal and strident voices are mostly on the one side. But that may only seem that way to me because of my own biases. In fact, that seems likely.

One thing I am pretty sure of is that most Catholics are not on either “side,” they are just trying to live their lives as best they can.

 

[Crusader13]

But that may only seem that way to me because of my own biases. In fact, that seems likely.

One thing I am pretty sure of is that most Catholics are not on either “side,” they are just trying to live their lives as best they can.

I understand and I’m sure that my own opinions and biases would put me on the opposite side of many on here.

I would also agree that many Catholics are probably more middle of the road and don’t get swept up in the issues that we talk about on this forum.

I think our own personal experiences tend to shape much of our reality when it comes to our faith and if someone doesn’t have to deal with iturgical abuses or corruption in their diocese, then they may have a very different view on what it means to be Catholic today.

Whereas someone who’s suffered through a bad priest or lack of any good catechetical programs at their parish, might find themselves grasping at whatever they can to try learn more about what it means to be Catholic.

 

[choose_to_love]

By golly, you’re right. My mistake on the specific word “intention”. I’m sorry about that.

Still, I think that is a fair reading of your original statement. If CM ‘uses’ articles to generate fear, unrest, and scandal, as set forth in your first statement, and then in your second statement, you state '"(t)o take our eyes away from the Gospel", it seems to me that the purpose, or use, of the articles is then to take one’s eyes away from the Gospel. Put another way, it seems to me that stating that CM publishes articles which generate fear, which takes our eyes off the Gospel, is different than stating that CM uses said articles to generate fear and thereby take our eyes off the Gospel - - by choosing “uses” I take that to mean intent; maybe you didn’t. I submit that in the absence of an affirmative statement by CM as to its intent, an outsider cannot know it.