Do we become the body and blood in the Eucharist?

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I’ve noticed in several songs in OCP’s Music Issue, a theology that seems to infer that in Communion we become the Eucharisted bread and wine. (“Bread of Life” by R. Cooney being the one with the most confusing lyrics: “You and I are the bread of life,… This is our body, this is our blood… This bread is spirit…”) I understand the idea of receving Jesus in the Eucharist and thus becoming one with Him and with those who receive Him, but this business of us being the Eucharist seems a bit confusing if not altogether falacious. Are we the bread and wine before consecration or after, and do we become Jesus in receiving Him? :confused: Aaagh! Light shedders please help.
 
Theologically speaking, we are to be “transformed” by the Eucharist so that we become what we eat. We do not become “Eucharist” – at least, not in the same sense as the bread and wine become the Body and Blood of Jesus. Rather, as St. Peter tells us, we share in the Divine Life.

The song takes “musical license” in the phraseology, but there is an underlying truth. While the Real Presence remains in us, we are, indeed, to be a people giving thanks (which is what Eucharist means). We are also to go into the world and “be Christ” to others.

So, while the wording is, at best, fuzzy, the concept of transformation and our role in the world is there. We just have to understand that the song does not accurately reflect the theology of the Church.

Deacon Ed
 
Beno said:
I’ve noticed in several songs in OCP’s Music Issue, a theology that seems to infer that in Communion we become the Eucharisted bread and wine. (“Bread of Life” by R. Cooney being the one with the most confusing lyrics: “You and I are the bread of life,… This is our body, this is our blood… This bread is spirit…”) I understand the idea of receving Jesus in the Eucharist and thus becoming one with Him and with those who receive Him, but this business of us being the Eucharist seems a bit confusing if not altogether falacious. Are we the bread and wine before consecration or after, and do we become Jesus in receiving Him? :confused: Aaagh! Light shedders please help.
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Those songs pressent very poor theology in my opinion and should be avoided.
 
These songs are misleading and since it is dealing with our religious beliefs, it is pretty disgusting.

I have to sing a “gathering song” a couple days ago which included the words “we are the bread”…whaaa?

I look around and think,“is everyone taking crazy pills?” but we go on singing without a blink. I am trying to invite the choir director to our Bible studies so maybe I could relate to her a bit more and see where she is coming from.

I agree with you this is wrong and unfortunately many have become desensitized to misleading teachings and sometimes outright heresy.

God Bless
Scylla
 
Grace & Peace!

I’ve often thought that when Jesus said, “Do this in remembrance of me,” that he was not speakly only of the ritual (of course he was definitely speaking of the Eucharistic rite), but also of the same Eucharistic self-giving. That is, like Jesus broken for us, we are meant to be broken (for love, by love, and by grace) for the world. Like Jesus shedding his blood for us, we are meant to give our lives, our substance, and our blood, if need be, out of love for the world, by grace.

In the breaking of the Eucharistic bread, Jesus reveals to us the counter-intuitive idea that the perfection of the body and of the world is in its broken-ness, because it is in broken-ness, in the cry of love, in the cry for love, in the breaking of the ego, that we receive grace.

The lyrics of the song quoted do seem a bit misleading, though–the theology is not quite wrong, to my understanding, in its identification of the believer with Christ in his sacrifice, but what strikes me as upsetting is its glibness, it’s location of that identification in a very touchy-feely emotional realm–and it does not seem to want to appeal to anything more than the emotional response.

It also reads like a self-help positive affirmation sort of thing. But the life of grace is not a course of self-help affirmations, but a way of living the mysteries of love and of grace. I’m a bit wary of a song that informs me of what I should believe the eucharistic event to be when the event itself embodies its own theology and needs no gloss beyond catechetical preparation and the movement of grace!

Under the Mercy,
Mark

Deo Gratias!
 
Anyone else noticed that before the 60’s, most Catholic liturgical music was “God centered”, giving praise and glory to God and Jesus and the Holy Spirit, etc.

Then, all of a sudden, WE became the focus of the music and worship (of God) became a side-script.

I’m getting too old and cranky, but I hate the new (most of the last three decades) stuff that centers on the people and LOVE when the hymns give all the glory and praise to God. And I don’t mind when we say “thank-you” to Him in our hymns, instead of telling Him how He’s supposed to bless us and take notice of us.

Give me a “Holy, Holy, Holy” or “To Jesus Christ our Sovereign King” anyday.
 
Beno said:
I’ve noticed in several songs in OCP’s Music Issue, a theology that seems to infer that in Communion we become the Eucharisted bread and wine. (“Bread of Life” by R. Cooney being the one with the most confusing lyrics: “You and I are the bread of life,… This is our body, this is our blood… This bread is spirit…”) I understand the idea of receving Jesus in the Eucharist and thus becoming one with Him and with those who receive Him, but this business of us being the Eucharist seems a bit confusing if not altogether falacious. Are we the bread and wine before consecration or after, and do we become Jesus in receiving Him? :confused: aagh! Light shedders please help.
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If you understood the current trend, the past forty years or so, of theology you should know this… What is normally espoused these days is what is generally termed Christolgy from Below. Two of its major proponents were Kung and Zanzig.

The theory is basically that Christ is seen primarily as a man, and that we meet Him and conceptualize Him primarily as a man not as divine. It does not deny His divinity but rather exalts His humanity. In exalting His humanity it is a logical step to say that since He was just like us, when we unite with Him in the Eucharist we become like Him and He like us.I guess the best way to describe it would be to say that you are Christ and so is your neighbor. A simplification but basically a true representation of the theology.

Knowing that it is easy to see why certain practices and hymns reflect the view that Christ is among us and in us in a particularly physical sense as opposed to the old Christology from Above model that conceptualized Christ primarily as divine and emphasized that.
 
Jn 17:20-21 "My prayer is not for them alone. I pray also for those who will believe in me through their message, that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me.”

1 Cor 12:12 The body is a unit, though it is made up of many parts; and though all its parts are many, they form one body. So it is with Christ.

Jn 15: 5-8 "I am the vine; you are the branches. If a man remains in me and I in him, he will bear much fruit; apart from me you can do nothing. 6If anyone does not remain in me, he is like a branch that is thrown away and withers; such branches are picked up, thrown into the fire and burned. 7If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be given you. 8This is to my Father’s glory, that you bear much fruit, showing yourselves to be my disciples.”

Rom 12:5 So in Christ we who are many form one body, and each member belongs to all the others.

Eph 4:16 From him the whole body, joined and held together by every supporting ligament, grows and builds itself up in love, as each part does its work.
 
We have some very poor songs these days, many with a false ‘theology’. I refuse to sing any of the ‘we are bread’ songs. I am not bread and do not want to be bread. Jesus is more than a ‘wine of compassion’. I do not come for the ‘dreams, signs, and wonders’ and I do not ‘sing to the mountains’.

I will only sing true hymns that are worshipful of God. I am not going to sing any junk in praise of myself or the gathering or the community. A number of songs are written by protestants and ex-catholics. It shows.

Ave Maria!
 
dulcissima,
You make some good points we are one body, and this is affirmed when we worship God.
We are insulting God when we take our unity of belief and elevate that to a level where we are singing about it and equating ourselves with God.
We are the Body of Christ because God unites us, not because we unite God.

Thank you for posting some of these verses that dissenters use to pretty much deny the reality of Christ in the Eucharist. It is common for them to elevate certain portions of our belief above the center of our faith which is Christ and our devotion to Him. This is common in my diocese here in SoCal, and I am sure I will see plenty of dissent at L.A. Religious Congress.

In Christ
Scylla
 
I have a really hard time believing that there are any Catholics who believe that we are on a level with God or that Christ is not the center of our worship at Mass. Of course, I haven’t ever heard the specific song that the OP is referring to.
 
Just check out some of the songs in the OCP hymnbook. I will see if I can get some specifics for you tomorrow.

There are plenty of Catholics who believe that primarily Mass is a work of the people which brings us together and we celebrate the Body of Christ which is made up of ourselves.

This is the emphasis of these type songs which insults the presence of Jesus in the Eucharist who is the reason why the Mass is different from any other service. Of course our presence is required but that is always overshadowed by the presence of Christ.

God Bless
Scylla
 
I thought Deacon Ed gave a wonderful answer in the beginning of this thread and agree the theology is a bit “fuzzy,” and can be mis-leading…especially for Catholics who do not have a complete understanding of Eucharist. It is for this reason, as a music director, that I have avoided using the song. However, a very good argument can be made that songs with lyrics like this, which ignite a discussion on the theology of Eucharist, can serve a great purpose in the church. They can inspire conversations like this that help people to gain a deeper understanding of what Eucharist is.
 
palmas85 said:
If you understood the current trend, the past forty years or so, of theology you should know this… What is normally espoused these days is what is generally termed Christolgy from Below. Two of its major proponents were Kung and Zanzig.

The theory is basically that Christ is seen primarily as a man, and that we meet Him and conceptualize Him primarily as a man not as divine. It does not deny His divinity but rather exalts His humanity. In exalting His humanity it is a logical step to say that since He was just like us, when we unite with Him in the Eucharist we become like Him and He like us.I guess the best way to describe it would be to say that you are Christ and so is your neighbor. A simplification but basically a true representation of the theology.

Knowing that it is easy to see why certain practices and hymns reflect the view that Christ is among us and in us in a particularly physical sense as opposed to the old Christology from Above model that conceptualized Christ primarily as divine and emphasized that.
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Palmas:

This is a complete contrast to St. Athanasius, “God become man so that we could share in his nature.” John 1 which stated that God the Word, who had been with been with God the Father from before the beginning, became one of us, and that of His Glory we have all had a share, not that Christ was a man who became aware of his divinity. And, Luke 1 where Elizabeth asked, “Who am I that the mother of my Lord should come to me?”

If you read many of the Great Saints from both East and West, you’ll see that part of redemption is that God makes us to share in His nature, so that we can participate in heaven and not just be members of a passive audience.

None of this means that the wreatched songs in that OCP “Hymnal Version” are theologicaly sound or should even be published as aids for worship.

Your Brother in Christ, Michael
 
It’s also important to remember that the bread and wine offered at mass are symbols of our very lives (work of human hands…). And they are to be transformed into the body and blood of Christ.

So in a very real way, ‘we’ are part of the changing of bread and wine into Jesus.

Admittedly, some songs take this too far, and without proper catechesis can sort of have people wondering what the heck we’re singing about.
 
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