Do we easily become lukewarm in our faith?

[Christine85]

I find this happens with me, that I get kind of lukewarm in my faith , I go to daily Mass, weekly Confession pray every day and read the Bible, yet the thing is, it is like I am not living the faith from my heart. I am concerned that I am living the religion but not the relationship, I am doing everything right by the books, but in terms of a closeness with God and true sorrow for my sins it seems lacking.

I just wanted to post this thread to maybe help us assess ourselves, are we doing everything we can for our salvation? Do we think that we will live many many more years to come and get lazy because of that thinking we have time to fix ourselves no need to rush. Well the thing is, we dont know if we will even wake up tomorrow. I personally live way too much in the future and tell myself constantly Ill try harder tomorrow Ill do better tomorrow Ill be more faithful and trusting of God tomorrow or when I get through this thing etc etc etc, all these excuses. When the truth is that lukewarmness is almost a state of unbelief in a way because you are doing everything as though you are a robot. You are living the motions but are you being interiorly converted.
When was the last time you moved past blockages in your life. Our faith is meant to be used in a way to move us forward very quickly. I personally go to Confession yet I dont know whether I really do put in everything to stop the thing again, perhaps its slow progress or perhaps lukewarmness.

But I must say lukewarmness really is a killer, be on caution for lukewarmness.
Just wanting to share my experiences to try and help someone if I can.
We have to live in the present moment that is where God is, we have to live for today, NOW, not tomorrow, next week or next year, we may not even be here then. Today is the day!! Live for today!!

Wanted to add this Michael Voris talk on Spiritual warfare, some people dont like him because he is too full on , but I like his in your face attitude~
Michael Voris on Spiritual warfare ~
youtube.com/watch?v=B0CwcRJoe6A

God bless you.

 

[runningdude]

Take a break! You are wearing yourself out. Go to mass on Sunday, confession when needed. Love God. Love thy neighbor. Don’t burn yourself out!

 

[Christine85]

Lol… No I’m not really burning myself out. I need to go to Mass as often as possible as it really helps me. I’m trying hard to be holy. Sorry to seem obsessive, but seriously my point is we can do everything by the book yet still be lukewarm.
My point is we need to have a fresh and alive spirit within ourselves. Sorry but I will not be taking your advice… … Apart from the love God, love thy neighbour part. God bless

 

[lizaanne]

I find this happens with me, that I get kind of lukewarm in my faith , I go to daily Mass, weekly Confession pray every day and read the Bible, yet the thing is, it is like I am not living the faith from my heart. I am concerned that I am living the religion but not the relationship, I am doing everything right by the books, but in terms of a closeness with God and true sorrow for my sins it seems lacking.

I get it - and I think it is human nature to roll with the flow of life and society, and it is a struggle to live a solid holy life.

One thing my priest said to me in confession one time, is that we need to orient our day around our prayer life, and not the other way around. This is a lot easier than it sounds!! But just the perspective of prayer around the day, or the day around prayer, was quite impacting to me.

Take a break! You are wearing yourself out. Go to mass on Sunday, confession when needed. Love God. Love thy neighbor. Don’t burn yourself out!

Horrible advice. Daily Mass and frequent confession is a great blessing. There is grace there - how can grace ever be bad or wearing someone out?

Lol… No I’m not really burning myself out. I need to go to Mass as often as possible as it really helps me. I’m trying hard to be holy. Sorry to seem obsessive, but seriously my point is we can do everything by the book yet still be lukewarm.
My point is we need to have a fresh and alive spirit within ourselves. Sorry but I will not be taking your advice… … Apart from the love God, love thy neighbour part. God bless

~Liza

 

[pollylodges]

Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee.

Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb Jesus.

Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death.

Amen.

†

Our Father who art in Heaven, hallowed be thy name.

Thy kingdom come, thy will be done on Earth as it is in Heaven.

Give us this day our daily bread.

And forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us.

And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil.

Amen.

†

 

[Tigg]

I find this happens with me, that I get kind of lukewarm in my faith , I go to daily Mass, weekly Confession pray every day and read the Bible, yet the thing is, it is like I am not living the faith from my heart. I am concerned that I am living the religion but not the relationship, I am doing everything right by the books, but in terms of a closeness with God and true sorrow for my sins it seems lacking.

I just wanted to post this thread to maybe help us assess ourselves, are we doing everything we can for our salvation?

I believe it is more the effort that God sees, and the fidelity to Him, regardless of the results. Perhaps we are not the best judge of our own spiritual condition, at least I know I’m not because often times I have a tendency toward scrupulosity. Yes, spiritual zeal is a wonderful thing, but we all know the dangers of judging it based upon any emotion, and who knows our human weakness better than God? Here is an excerpt from a book I read that helped me greatly with my perspective. I hope it blesses you as well, although it is more specifically geared toward prayer, if you think of it as the spiritual life in general, it might make more sense.

THE PRAYER OF FUTILITY

The great complaint with most people about their prayer is that they never feel they’re getting anywhere. But of course it would be a very bad sign if they did. A lot of the trouble about prayer would disappear if we only realized – really realized, and not just supposed that it was so – that we go to pray not because we love prayer but because we love God. Not in order to master distractions or perfect a system or because we have said we would go on with the thing, but simply in order to please God. Once granted that God’s view of our prayer is the only one that is at all worth taking into account, it can’t much matter what our own view of it is. In fact the less view we have of it- and for the less view we can substitute the word “feeling” – the better.

“Oh, I know all about that,” you will say, “but it’s no use telling me that God’s way of judging prayer is so different from my way of judging it that what are distractions to me are praises to Him. Distractions and praises are not only different things altogether, they are completely opposite things. Your theory doesn’t make sense”. Excuse me, it does. In the first place the opposite to a praise is not a distraction but an insult-and ordinary distractions are certainly not that. In the next place we must remember that God’s scale of values, His sphere of operation, His terms, even, are quite different from ours. What is light to Him is so luminous that to our materially focusing eyes it appears as darkness.

God knows the limitations which He has imposed upon man and makes allowances. There is only one test of our prayer: are we wanting God? Do we want Him so much that we are prepared to go on looking for Him in our prayer in spite of apparently never getting any nearer to Him? Upon the answer to this inquiry depends the whole business of our success or failure in prayer. Success and failure to be judged in God’s terms, not ours.

Pick out a typical day in our prayer life and consider the kind of account which Satan might present at the judgment seat of God. This typical day shouldn’t be one when we are in particularly good form or bad, but simply one that runs true to normal, punctuated occasionally by the arrival of not very memorable diversions. “See this dilapidated prayer”, says the devil, ”and tell me Lord, whether You don’t think it has been a waste of time. Those yawns, for instance, and those furtive glances at the watch-they must certainly score heavily in my favor. And what about that lengthy digression on the subject of his health, or what about those vacation plans in the back of his mind? Followed by at least ten minutes when nothing seems to have gone on at all. Surely, Lord, You got very little out of that prayer today – especially if You take into consideration those memories and imaginations which I suggested to his muddy mind; memories which would be unsuitable anywhere but which are especially so at prayer. Even the attempts at returning to Your presence, Lord, can be counted as winning points to me: they were so half-hearted and infrequent. Add to the total that confessedly bored attitude of mind in which the whole thing was conducted and You will admit that I have won hands down”.

So much for the devil’s report. First of all, there is nothing to show that our prayers are as boring to God as they feel to us. Moreover, even granted that in the given prayer there was nothing substantial which could be listed on the credit side (and there usually is something, though not always something you could put your finger on), it would surely be reasonable to think of God as countering Satan with the all important question: “But whom was he doing it for?” That’s the point. It would be in keeping with the spirit of the Book of Job to consider the Lord pursuing Satan relentlessly. “It’s all very well for you to cite the distractions in My friend’s prayer” so we would have the Lord defending His own- “but, though he may not have made a very good thing of it, at least he has not gone back to bed or picked up a novel. He did, you notice, go on. Discouraged as he is about the result of his effort (unreasonably discouraged in point of fact) he will be at it again, you will find, tomorrow morning. His object all along has been-and still is-to please Me, and though he imagines he isn’t doing this, he has no intention of pleasing you. While certainly, he isn’t, poor man, pleasing himself.

 

[Tigg]

(Continued from prior post) Sorry for the length, but I just love this part:

The prayer of futility, then, has this inestimable advantage; it keeps us in our place. (It has its dangers, too: particularly dejection and laziness), but it enables us to say with sincerity, “I am nothing, I can do nothing, I deserve nothing but kicks and crosses. At the same time nothing in the world will induce me to give it up”.

Such is the mind of the man of prayer. The true soul of prayer strives after God alone. Not after personal satisfaction, nor after recollection (for itself’s sake alone), not even after holiness (regarded as a state and not as a means of loving God), but simply after God Himself. And inevitably God is the reward of such a striving……but God expressing Himself more in His Absence than in His Presence.

  		Excerpt from “We Die Standing Up” by

  			Hubert Von Zeller

 

[BobCatholic]

Lukewarm is the default setting.

By default we are supposed to go to Hell. With God’s grace, we have a CHANCE of going to heaven.

But God does not force his grace on us, so we can resist the grace, and become lukewarm again, back to the default setting.

You want to go to hell? Do nothing. It is the default setting.
Want to go to heaven? Suffer tremendously to hold on to God’s grace.

 

[runningdude]

Lukewarm is the default setting.

By default we are supposed to go to Hell. With God’s grace, we have a CHANCE of going to heaven.

But God does not force his grace on us, so we can resist the grace, and become lukewarm again, back to the default setting.

You want to go to hell? Do nothing. It is the default setting.
Want to go to heaven? Suffer tremendously to hold on to God’s grace.

Catholic teaching is that we are innately good. Following baptism, the default is heaven, unless one deliberately commits a mortal sin. It is a Protestant notion that original sin completely corrupts the soul.

 

[Lady_Love]

I remember going to Mass one Sunday and hearing Jesus speak to me. First through the homily which was, “When is it ever going to be ENOUGH for you? When are You going to be enough?”

I was wrestling with whether or not I should go to communion because my faults were so glaring. I constantly fell short in so many areas. Discouraged, I decided I was going to avoid communion when I heard Jesus speak in His own voice, “I am your Judge. What are you afraid of?”

I was afraid of receiving Him unworthily, I was afraid of condemnation, I was afraid that I was not perfect “enough.” But in His voice I heard Him saying that it was o.k. That I need not be afraid. That I was good enough. All my fears melted away in His voice, all my self-accusation ceased. Jesus said that I was enough for Him just as I was.

I was and am so far from perfect but my hope does not lie in me. My hope does not lie in my own goodness but in His. He is faithful and unconditional. He showed me that He does not want me to let my unworthiness to be a barrier to our union.

 

[BobCatholic]

Catholic teaching is that we are innately good.

We are innately good but we are messed up. It is called concupiscence. It makes us want to sin.

Following baptism, the default is heaven, unless one deliberately commits a mortal sin. It is a Protestant notion that original sin completely corrupts the soul.

If one never gets baptized…then what? For an unbaptized adult, the default setting is elevator down.

And if one is baptized and never does anything again. Nothing. They still go to heaven? Or are they condemned due to not doing anything? I recall Matthew 24 being particularly harsh. I recall a fig tree being rebuked for doing nothing.

I recall someone saying that we are unprofitable servants. Unprofitable means what? Even if we survive in a state of grace, we don’t make God happy.

Hell is the default. It is easy to fall but hard to keep in the state of grace. Thus the road is narrow, and St. Leonard says the saved are few.

 

[Christine85]

Thankyou for the thoughtful replies and the prayer of futility.

I think the Church helps us have a foundation, but I suppose we have to be zealous to have a one on one relationship with God ALL THE TIME…
A great book is available online to read for free called
“The practice of the presence of God” it takes a couple of hours to read.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

You remind me of me, before I ever heard of contemplative prayer. You have a very active faith life. But you want to go further, and you can. A prayer life should also include “resting in God,” another term for contemplative prayer forms. This may give you exactly the change you want; to supplement your active faith life with a relationship that goes beyond and into true union with Christ.

Reference: CCC 2700-2724

A couple samples:

2709 What is contemplative prayer? St. Teresa answers: “Contemplative prayer [oracion mental] in my opinion is nothing else than a close sharing between friends; it means taking time frequently to be alone with him who we know loves us.” Contemplative prayer seeks him “whom my soul loves.” It is Jesus, and in him, the Father. We seek him, because to desire him is always the beginning of love, and we seek him in that pure faith which causes us to be born of him and to live in him. In this inner prayer we can still meditate, but our attention is fixed on the Lord himself.

2718 Contemplative prayer is a union with the prayer of Christ insofar as it makes us participate in his mystery. The mystery of Christ is celebrated by the Church in the Eucharist, and the Holy Spirit makes it come alive in contemplative prayer so that our charity will manifest it in our acts.

2724 Contemplative prayer is the simple expression of the mystery of prayer. It is a gaze of faith fixed on Jesus, an attentiveness to the Word of God, a silent love. It achieves real union with the prayer of Christ to the extent that it makes us share in his mystery.

Does any of this sound attractive to you? Do you ever read of mystical literature?

Alan

 

[ajecphotos]

I sometimes find it very hard to concentrate while praying or reading my morning and evening prayers. Sometimes it feels as though I am just going through the motions when I am really trying to concentrate on the words!! It can be very hard and I do feel guilty if I have read my prayers without much thought.

 

[Tigg]

Catholic teaching is that we are innately good. Following baptism, the default is heaven, unless one deliberately commits a mortal sin. It is a Protestant notion that original sin completely corrupts the soul.

The Church also teaches that we lost all the preternatural gifts because of the fall and we are now in a state of weakness (even after baptism) that requires constant struggle against temptation and sin.

 

[runningdude]

Lol… No I’m not really burning myself out. I need to go to Mass as often as possible as it really helps me. I’m trying hard to be holy. Sorry to seem obsessive, but seriously my point is we can do everything by the book yet still be lukewarm.
My point is we need to have a fresh and alive spirit within ourselves. Sorry but I will not be taking your advice… … Apart from the love God, love thy neighbour part. God bless

I stand corrected. I was responding to a marathon of burn-out, scrupulous posts, and lumped yours in with the bunch.

 

[Christine85]

You remind me of me, before I ever heard of contemplative prayer. You have a very active faith life. But you want to go further, and you can. A prayer life should also include “resting in God,” another term for contemplative prayer forms. This may give you exactly the change you want; to supplement your active faith life with a relationship that goes beyond and into true union with Christ.

Reference: CCC 2700-2724

A couple samples:

2709 What is contemplative prayer? St. Teresa answers: “Contemplative prayer [oracion mental] in my opinion is nothing else than a close sharing between friends; it means taking time frequently to be alone with him who we know loves us.” Contemplative prayer seeks him “whom my soul loves.” It is Jesus, and in him, the Father. We seek him, because to desire him is always the beginning of love, and we seek him in that pure faith which causes us to be born of him and to live in him. In this inner prayer we can still meditate, but our attention is fixed on the Lord himself.

2718 Contemplative prayer is a union with the prayer of Christ insofar as it makes us participate in his mystery. The mystery of Christ is celebrated by the Church in the Eucharist, and the Holy Spirit makes it come alive in contemplative prayer so that our charity will manifest it in our acts.

2724 Contemplative prayer is the simple expression of the mystery of prayer. It is a gaze of faith fixed on Jesus, an attentiveness to the Word of God, a silent love. It achieves real union with the prayer of Christ to the extent that it makes us share in his mystery.

Does any of this sound attractive to you? Do you ever read of mystical literature?

Alan

Thanks Alan. Actually I have read a bit of St John of the Cross and St Teresa, and most days I put aside time for contemplative prayer. Maybe I’m not doing it enough. I must admit it is addictive and once I start getting in really deep it scares me a little. Lol I suppose because I have a few defences towards God from past hurt. But I am slowly getting over that. I find Adoration very helpful also.
But I totally see what you mean about contemplative prayer, it certainly draws you closer to God !!

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Thanks Alan. Actually I have read a bit of St John of the Cross and St Teresa, and most days I put aside time for contemplative prayer. Maybe I’m not doing it enough. I must admit it is addictive and once I start getting in really deep it scares me a little. Lol I suppose because I have a few defences towards God from past hurt. But I am slowly getting over that. I find Adoration very helpful also.
But I totally see what you mean about contemplative prayer, it certainly draws you closer to God !!

It can be scary, because when you let go of your will to think things on purpose, it’s weird that the few stray thoughts that inevitably come to your attention seem to have free run of the place, you not being allowed to counter them. Depending on how you think, and how your imagination works, and of course your fears and everything else about you, these can be scary indeed, or they can be just “interesting.” Or if a good thought comes across, since you’re not supposed to focus on it, there is a fear of letting it go, even a grieving of a thought you may never remember because you weren’t able to put it to words the first time. So we’re not allowed to battle a bad thought, or embrace a good thought. It’s a very emptying feeling and can be uncomfortably helpless trying to trust that our minds are going to be safe.

Alan

 

[Christine85]

Hi,
I totally know what you mean. Even the experiences may freak us out but we have to stay grounded in trusting in God. I once felt like I had no body and was floating, and I felt so small as an individual and it did feel really weird, but I just got through it by focusing on God and holding my blessed crucifix.

 

[pollylodges]

Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee.

Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb Jesus.

Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death.

Amen.

†

Our Father who art in Heaven, hallowed be thy name.

Thy kingdom come, thy will be done on Earth as it is in Heaven.

Give us this day our daily bread.

And forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us.

And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil.

Amen.

†