Do we live in a world of NECESSARY deceit and lies?

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Robert_Sock said:
Do we live in a world of NECESSARY deceit and lies?
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We have always lived in a world where deceit and lies have a different accountability.

Abraham, whilst in Egypt said his wife was his sister. In truth she was his half sister but
was his wife.

During the war the people lied about hiding the Jews. They also were deceitful in the eyes of the German officers and soldiers because they hid those they were told not to hide.

God judges our hearts and our motives when it comes to our actions.
Is there a lesser or greater sin?
Sometimes there is necessary evil and necessary sin but it works for a greater good.

Satan told Eve if she ate the fruit she would be like God.

What he did was for evil to cause harm.

It isn’t necessary to be deceitful or lie. We are in a fallen world so they are package and parcel with life in the world.🙂
 
The Catholic Church is truth. God set up His Church to bring us all to Him and in doing so we must live by His teachings. God is love and part of love is truth. You cannot lie or deceive even if a person perceives the outcome to be good because you are living by treating others as a means to an end thus not acting out of love.

Also, “Do we live in a world of NECESSARY**** deceit and lies” implies there is no choice, which removes free will. From Webster, “a : of an inevitable nature : inescapable” This is impossible because God gave humanity free will. The choices may not always be the best, but there is always a choice. While we all end up lying, we can die unto ourselves with self mastery and not lie or deceive through confession, etc. Do we have to lie/deceive to get by in the world? No.

I agree with dshix and SuperLuigi in that discretion is not deceit or lying.
“dis·cre·tion
: the quality of having or showing discernment or good judgment”
 
Humbly_Hopeful said:
The Catholic Church is truth. God set up His Church to bring us all to Him and in doing so we must live by His teachings. God is love and part of love is truth. You cannot lie or deceive even if a person perceives the outcome to be good because you are living by treating others as a means to an end thus not acting out of love.

Also, “Do we live in a world of NECESSARY**** deceit and lies” implies there is no choice, which removes free will. From Webster, “a : of an inevitable nature : inescapable” This is impossible because God gave humanity free will. The choices may not always be the best, but there is always a choice. While we all end up lying, we can die unto ourselves with self mastery and not lie or deceive through confession, etc. Do we have to lie/deceive to get by in the world? No.

I agree with dshix and SuperLuigi in that discretion is not deceit or lying.
“dis·cre·tion
: the quality of having or showing discernment or good judgment”
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I believe we live in a miserable and corrupt world run by Satan. I also believe that God is allowing it as a means to our salvation. Lies and deceit runs very deep in our society.
 
Robert_Sock said:
I believe we live in a miserable and corrupt world run by Satan. I also believe that God is allowing it as a means to our salvation. Lies and deceit runs very deep in our society.
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That does not mean that deceit is necessary.
 
Robert_Sock said:
Do we live in a world of NECESSARY deceit and lies?
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I invite you to read what the Catechism has to say about not bearing false witness: link.

Lie and deceit can never be necessary, inasmuch as they are intrinsically evil and the work of Satan.

That is very different from what prudence dictates as necessary, and today more than ever. “The good and safety of others, respect for privacy, and the common good are sufficient reasons for being silent about what ought not be known or for making use of a discreet language.”
 
Robert_Sock said:
Are you inferring that we do not live in a fallen world? What does it mean if not having Satan rule the world until we are saved?
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Why do you jump to so many conclusions? Where in scripture does it say that Satan owns the world because of the fall?
 
dshix said:
Why do you jump to so many conclusions? Where in scripture does it say that Satan owns the world because of the fall?
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I’m definitely not saying that Satan ‘owns’ the world, but that he has a great influence over our fallen world.
 
edwest2 said:
Robert, where do you come up with this stuff? First, yes. Always have.

Peace,
Ed
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Sorry I don;'t think like everyone else. What I have written reflects some of my deepest beliefs that I think deserves respect. These thought came to me; I did not think them up on my own.
 
We live in a world of a grand illusion, but people take it at face value; they mistakenly take it as reality.
 
Robert_Sock said:
We live in a world of a grand illusion, but people take it at face value; they mistakenly take it as reality.
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Now here is where you cross the line.

I’m fine with you stating your bizarre, unproven, ridiculous theories and having a whole people look at you like you’re crazy, but when you begin stating these bizarre, unproven, ridiculous theories as facts begin judging other people based on them, that’s where I draw the line.

Don’t do it.
 
dshix said:
Now here is where you cross the line.

I’m fine with you stating your bizarre, unproven, ridiculous theories and having a whole people look at you like you’re crazy, but when you begin stating these bizarre, unproven, ridiculous theories as facts begin judging other people based on them, that’s where I draw the line.

Don’t do it.
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RESPECT! As I conveyed elsewhere, these are my own private thought that I wanted to share. Just because you don’t approve of them does not mean that they have no value. You’re free to believe as you wish, but please be respectful of the beliefs of others. It amazes me that Catholics on CAF are so disrespectful of fellow Catholics!
 
Robert_Sock said:
RESPECT! As I conveyed elsewhere, these are my own private thought that I wanted to share. Just because you don’t approve of them does not mean that they have no value. You’re free to believe as you wish, but please be respectful of the beliefs of others. It amazes me that Catholics on CAF are so disrespectful of fellow Catholics!
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I’m sorry if I offended you, but you cannot reasonably apply any of your ideas to other people unless they agree with you that those theories are reasonable, or even theologically correct.
 
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