Do we try to become holier than the Church?

[Toni]

Just a question to all of you out there. We are having a problem with our parish closing exposition. There are a lot of people who are very upset because the Pastor chose this one thing to follow every letter to the ‘t’. But of course follows the rules he chooses on Confession etc.
So my question are you holier than the Church when you bicker and fight about this issue or are we obliged as Catholics to fight to the death on issues that we feel are correct?
For instance if the pastor chooses to close our exposition chapel should we hold him accountable for all the other errors he choses to ignore?

 

[paramedicgirl]

I think prayer is your best recourse for preventing the adoration from being discontinued. Get the whole parish to pray! As for the other things you say your priest is making his own rules on, I would approach him first, and then go to the bishop if you are not satisfied.

 

[Peace-bwu]

Interesting question, “do we become holier than the Church?”

I think that the Church is in dire need of lay people and of religious vocations who are willing to strive for a deeper holiness, to up the bar and carry on our precious Apostolic Tradition. We need to strive to be the saints of our time in order to counteract watered down, disrespected and attacked doctrine, Tradition and morality.

Married people need to live their vocations with love, compassion and on fire for Jesus and His Church. I’m not going to just sit back and complain, I want to do my part. It sounds like you do too. Pray and support other devout members of your parish. Hang in there, God bless you!

 

[Toni]

paramedicgirl:

Get the whole parish to pray!.

I agree 100 percent. If there weren’t so many of them that were not so fighting mad. Even when I went today, some came in and had the paper work in their hands waving it around as I was trying to pray. When I left one followed me out to discuss the matter. What a day. It would not be so hard on me if I could look out on the church as a whole and see everyone following the rules that have been given to us. But I feel like I go to school and am blessed to teach the truth to all these children and they have nothing but pollution in their parishes. Some are so corrupt, with bread not a host, intincture where they are dipping the bread into the blood, confession in 4th grade yet they are able to make confession at the school. There are so many issues and I am feeling really discouraged about all of this. I think thats why I needed to post this. I NEED EVERYONES ENCOURAGEMENT to keep going forward. Especially when you feel yourself slipping. I am sure Satan would be pleased if I just quit my job and never taught religion again anywhere. That I will not do. I just wish I did not always have to read so much negative about the church. Yet the same old posters are posting on the rosary for CA members and for priests.(that is not to say that others are not praying for the priests) But when I spoke to my Spiritual director he said to me we need more prayers for priests.

paramedicgirl:

As for the other things you say your priest is making his own rules on, I would approach him first, and then go to the bishop if you are not satisfied.

This has been brought to the priest daily by many. I did print the vatican paperwork on the confession issue but I don’t feel I can attend the meeting #1 reason I teach catechism that night (where yes I get to teach the truth) #2 I can’t stand to see so many holy Catholics beating up a priest because they want things their way.
Please pray.

 

[Toni]

Peace-bwu:

Interesting question, “do we become holier than the Church?”

Married people need to live their vocations with love, compassion and on fire for Jesus and His Church. I’m not going to just sit back and complain, I want to do my part. It sounds like you do too. Pray and support other devout members of your parish. Hang in there, God bless you!

Thank you for your encouragement.

 

[Brendan]

The Church is entirely Holy, the Perfect Bride of Christ. Ergo, one can never be ‘more holy’ than perfected holiness.

We, as members of the Church, are called to emulate that Holiness that the Church calls us to be.

 

[Walking_Home]

Toni:

Just a question to all of you out there. We are having a problem with our parish closing exposition. There are a lot of people who are very upset because the Pastor chose this one thing to follow every letter to the ‘t’.

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I am confused here. Is there a mandate from the Church to close exposition. Whose directive is your Pastor following to a ‘t’.

 

[Toni]

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I am confused here. Is there a mandate from the Church to close exposition. Whose directive is your Pastor following to a ‘t’.

Our Pastor wrote a letter to the Cardinal because he says we are not having exposition properly. Then proceeded to put a book with rules in the chapel for all of us to read. With rules such as two adorers per hour etc. etc. So because we do not have this for each hour we are not following the rules.
A letter from the Cardinal sent to our pastor stated that exposition is really for orders not parishes. But then I saw a letter from the desk of Cardinal Maida promoting exposition in parishes. Interestingly enough though when some people called down to the diocese the letter sent to our parish is authentic.

 

[Giannawannabe]

Toni,

What would happen if you could get 2 adorers per hour? How much of a problem is that? Is that your pastor’s only “problem” with your Adoration Chapel?

It sounds as if there is a lot of anger re: this issue. Has there been any organized effort to pray for your pastor—maybe the rosary or intentions offered in your Adoration Chapel? Storm heaven with your prayers. When you are trying to pray and someone is waving a paper in your face, it sounds as if people are so angry that they are losing sight of the precious gift that they are trying to save. I will pray for you and your pastor.

 

[Toni]

Giannawannabe:

Toni,

What would happen if you could get 2 adorers per hour? How much of a problem is that? Is that your pastor’s only “problem” with your Adoration Chapel? .

Well that would be great but the chapel is connected to the Church and the tabernacle backs up to the monstrance. There were many other things in the book that he put out, so I can not remember them all. But I knew getting two worshippers would be a problem.

Giannawannabe:

It sounds as if there is a lot of anger re: this issue. Has there been any organized effort to pray for your pastor—maybe the rosary or intentions offered in your Adoration Chapel? Storm heaven with your prayers. When you are trying to pray and someone is waving a paper in your face, it sounds as if people are so angry that they are losing sight of the precious gift that they are trying to save. I will pray for you and your pastor.

Anger yes. Now the pastor posts one date for this big meeting in the bulletin and on the chapel door but it was mentioned at Mass today that the day is changed. I am sure this is going to cause more anger. But as you stated I am storming heaven and trying to get others to do the same. I will be obedient no matter what. I just hope and pray everyone else will.

 

[Brendan]

Toni:

A letter from the Cardinal sent to our pastor stated that exposition is really for orders not parishes. But then I saw a letter from the desk of Cardinal Maida promoting exposition in parishes. Interestingly enough though when some people called down to the diocese the letter sent to our parish is authentic.

I’m wondering if you are confusing something here.

In the Archdiocese of Detroit, Exposing and Reposing the Blessed Sacrament is reserved for those in Holy Orders. There is an exception in the GIRM allowing for lay people to do this, but Cardinal Maida has reserved this to priests and deacons.

So for a parish to have an Exposition of the Blessed Sacrament, it must be done in conjunction with those in Orders.

So yes, Cardinal Maida is a BIG fan of Eucharistic Adoration, but it must involve the clergy, it cannot be a lay run ministry.

If your parish was doing this as a lay run ministry, your pastor would be correct, the operation must change.

At our parish, for example, The celebrating priest exposes the Host after morning Mass.

Adoration continues during the day. The clergy do not have to be present during this time, but the Blessed Sacrament should not be left unattended. Our parish has a sign up sheet for adoration, to insure all ‘timeslots’ are covered.

That evening, one of the parish deacons has a Benediction, then reposes the Eucharist.

Such as system would be more than acceptable to the Cardinal.

 

[Toni]

Brendan:

I’m wondering if you are confusing something here.

In the Archdiocese of Detroit, Exposing and Reposing the Blessed Sacrament is reserved for those in Holy Orders. There is an exception in the GIRM allowing for lay people to do this, but Cardinal Maida has reserved this to priests and deacons.

So for a parish to have an Exposition of the Blessed Sacrament, it must be done in conjunction with those in Orders.

So yes, Cardinal Maida is a BIG fan of Eucharistic Adoration, but it must involve the clergy, it cannot be a lay run ministry.

If your parish was doing this as a lay run ministry, your pastor would be correct, the operation must change.

At our parish, for example, The celebrating priest exposes the Host after morning Mass.

Adoration continues during the day. The clergy do not have to be present during this time, but the Blessed Sacrament should not be left unattended. Our parish has a sign up sheet for adoration, to insure all ‘timeslots’ are covered.

That evening, one of the parish deacons has a Benediction, then reposes the Eucharist.

Such as system would be more than acceptable to the Cardinal.

Ok I understand this. As it is now we have a chapel with a Monstrance behind glass that backs up to the tabernacle. Yes it is a lay run ministry but has been like this for at least 10 years. The biggest problem that we are facing is this; Why does our Pastor choose to fix only this problem and refuses to follow the Cardinal or Rome on the First Confession issue? I will except whatever happens I just think at this point the parishioners want to know if he wants to follow this to a ‘t’ why does he refuse to adhere to the other rules of the Church. Note: Some on parish council have already told me that confession will remain in 4th grade.

 

[Brendan]

Toni:

Why does our Pastor choose to fix only this problem and refuses to follow the Cardinal or Rome on the First Confession issue? I will except whatever happens I just think at this point the parishioners want to know if he wants to follow this to a ‘t’ why does he refuse to adhere to the other rules of the Church. Note: Some on parish council have already told me that confession will remain in 4th grade.

Write a letter to the Cardinal on this, and cc: your pastor and the regional associate bishop. Be very cordial and pose everything as a question.

That is clearly a violation of Canon Law to NOT offer confession before Communion. The rights of the parishioners are being violated.

Oh, and another thing. If you have a child who is looking at First Communion, there is no reason at all you cannot bring that child to Confession.

Every Baptized Catholic who has achieved the age of reason (defined by the Church to be 7 years old) has a right to confess their sins.

If the priest rejects your child, I can tell you with absolute certainty that the Cardinal would be VERY interested in finding out why.

Cardinal Maida is a very ‘by the book’ person in these matters.

 

[tjmiller]

Better to have no Exposition, than to have Exposition, badly done.

 

[Toni]

tjmiller:

Better to have no Exposition, than to have Exposition, badly done.

AGREED!

 

[Giannawannabe]

Toni:

Ok I understand this. As it is now we have a chapel with a Monstrance behind glass that backs up to the tabernacle. Yes it is a lay run ministry but has been like this for at least 10 years. The biggest problem that we are facing is this; Why does our Pastor choose to fix only this problem and refuses to follow the Cardinal or Rome on the First Confession issue? I will except whatever happens I just think at this point the parishioners want to know if he wants to follow this to a ‘t’ why does he refuse to adhere to the other rules of the Church. Note: Some on parish council have already told me that confession will remain in 4th grade.

Toni,
I think I am now familiar with the situation that you are posting about. I, too, know some people at that parish who serve on the parish council. I also know a few CCD teachers, some who have or are now teaching 4th grade. Apparently, the way this is being approached is to tell the 2nd grade parents that they have the option of having their child go to confession before receiving their First Communion. If the PARENT does not feel that their child is mature enough to go to Confession, then they can go to First Confession in 4th grade. Of course, it is not emphasized that the children SHOULD be making their confession before First Holy Communion, only that it is an option. In this way, I believe that they can truthfully answer that Confession is offered before First Communion. The vast majority of parents, who probably are not catechized properly, will choose to wait until 4th grade. The 4th grade teacher I know is quite distressed that her curriculum contains virtually no instruction for First Confession. She has been instructed to give the parents info about First Confession, and the parents bring their children on their own. This is how I understand it from her.
What a sad and frustrating situation. I’m glad that you have an opportunity to teach the Truth to your catechism students. I also have that opportunity and am so glad that my children can experience that. I certainly didn’t.
I will continue to pray for your Adoration Chapel situation. Isn’t there an Adoration Chapel at parish in Hamburg? I wonder how that is run?

 

[Toni]

Giannawannabe:

Toni,
I think I am now familiar with the situation that you are posting about. I, too, know some people at that parish who serve on the parish council. I also know a few CCD teachers, some who have or are now teaching 4th grade. Apparently, the way this is being approached is to tell the 2nd grade parents that they have the option of having their child go to confession before receiving their First Communion. If the PARENT does not feel that their child is mature enough to go to Confession, then they can go to First Confession in 4th grade. Of course, it is not emphasized that the children SHOULD be making their confession before First Holy Communion, only that it is an option. In this way, I believe that they can truthfully answer that Confession is offered before First Communion. The vast majority of parents, who probably are not catechized properly, will choose to wait until 4th grade. The 4th grade teacher I know is quite distressed that her curriculum contains virtually no instruction for First Confession. She has been instructed to give the parents info about First Confession, and the parents bring their children on their own. This is how I understand it from her.
What a sad and frustrating situation. I’m glad that you have an opportunity to teach the Truth to your catechism students. I also have that opportunity and am so glad that my children can experience that. I certainly didn’t.
I will continue to pray for your Adoration Chapel situation. Isn’t there an Adoration Chapel at parish in Hamburg? I wonder how that is run?

Hamburg is a distance from here so I am unsure. Immaculate Conception in Lapeer has Expostion 24 hours or should I say 23 since it is set up like they have it set up like EWTN in the church. Highland is building a Chapel for Exposition. I know they have it at Grotto where my sister lives. I am sure they have it in many parishes.
As far as Confession my students were not really invited to have the opportunity to receive first confession at the parish. Our students all make confession at the school.

 

[puzzleannie]

Toni:

So my question are you holier than the Church when you bicker and fight about this issue or are we obliged as Catholics to fight to the death on issues that we feel are correct?
For instance if the pastor chooses to close our exposition chapel should we hold him accountable for all the other errors he choses to ignore?

we are certainly unChristian when we allow these issues to color our relationship with our pastor and fellow parishioners. Suggest your parish leadership could benefit from extended prayer and meditation with last Supper discourse in John’s Gospel where Christ repeatedly begs for unity among his followers.

did your pastor give an explanation for the situation, which I gather (op was unclear) is that exposition of the Blessed Sacrament for adoration has been curtailed or ended?

I am willing to bet that there have been periods where the Blessed Sacrament is unattended, that only relatively few parishioners are participating in adoration and keeping to their commitment, and that he is following the guidelines of his bishop and the universal church on this matter.

If there are other areas of parish life where the pastor and/or the parish are not following the prescribed rites or practices, of course they should be addressed by the proper persons, according to the proper procedure. But that does not relate to this issue.

 

[Toni]

puzzleannie:

I am willing to bet that there have been periods where the Blessed Sacrament is unattended, that only relatively few parishioners are participating in adoration and keeping to their commitment, and that he is following the guidelines of his bishop and the universal church on this matter.

If there are other areas of parish life where the pastor and/or the parish are not following the prescribed rites or practices, of course they should be addressed by the proper persons, according to the proper procedure. But that does not relate to this issue.

I am sure this has happened which yes is always a major concern.When we have adoration at school someone or a large group of classes are in the Chapel. Since I am unable to do anything but an hour now It is hard to say. I know this is a concern and we do not ever want to leave our Lord alone. But I think it is the way it has been approached. One of the really good things in the parish is being stopped.
If I had time to type the whole story going back to when adoration began you would be amazed at the blessings this parish has received from Exposition. Starting from no kneelers in the church etc. It has come so far. As far as talking to the Pastor it is difficult because I am in a position that I need to get along with all the DRE’S since I am teaching a lot of their students and they could make all the students attend religious ed which would totally erase the good that we are doing.
Charity of course is the number 1 issue. But I think when the Pastor changed the meeting day that has been posted all over it is one more thing that will make people angry.

 

[Toni]

Toni:

As far as Confession my students were not really invited to have the opportunity to receive first confession at the parish. Our students all make confession at the school.

Any parent that I have dealt with has told me that it is not something offered for 2nd graders and are thankful that we have confession at the school.