Do you appreciate reverence and decorum in the celebration of the Mass

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Do you appreciate the presence of reverence and decorum in the celebration of the Mass?

Do you appreciate when it’s clear that those in the sanctuary adequately prepared to execute their parts of the celebration to the best of their abilities and with great dignity? Are you thankful for all the underpinnings (from the mindset and expectations of those in the sanctuary, to their intrinsic abilities, to the the church building and all of its furnishings) which made possible the celebration of the Mass with great reverence and decorum?

Or do you think reverence and decorum necessarily come at something(s) you value more? Things like love, efficiency, being more “welcoming”/“come as you are”, “spiritual”, etc?

Do you appreciate reverence and decorum in things like school graduations, funerals, military celebrations, etc? Or do you prefer things more casual?

Do you believe that reverence and decorum can be present in very simple ceremonies? Do you believe that the level of ceremony (no matter what it might be) complexity – whether it is high or low, is not necessarily a function of reverence and decorum?

How are you expectations of reverence and decorum influenced by today’s society and its continued coarsening?

What are your own expectations when it comes to reverence and decorum when you attend the celebration of Mass. Are you someone that has essentially “lost hope” that they will encounter reverence and decorum when they attend Mass?

NB: Please, please, let’s not make this an OF vs. EF Mass discussion, or one of mere personal preferences. Let’s go a little deeper on this thread. Thanks.
 
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I have been helping out at the Mass by being a reader. I’ve learned that there is a lot of preparation involved in celebrating the Mass and I do appreciate reverence and decorum, but it is my personal like and I like it if other people display respect for the Mass. It seems like you can have both being welcoming and reverence and decorum. I sometimes think there is too much talking right before Mass and right after. But recently our church has begun to pray the rosary before Mass and it is so much better, like we are getting prepared for a really special event (which we are!) I’m torn about the welcoming part after Mass. I know we have just received Jesus, and I’m so grateful. I want to offer my thanksgiving right away but if I do the people leave without any greeting from me and doesn’t Jesus want me to greet his people? So I say my thanksgiving in the car on my way home… I wonder, what would Jesus do?
 
Is this a debate, or a questionare for some kind of personal survey ?

I don’t think many people today realize what it means for reverance and decorum in a Catholic Mass, sure you have a tiny few parishes that offer the Latin mass or a traditional mass, but for the most part, participating or walking into a catholic church has become a social gathering spot for people. yes some are there to actually pray, and even those who aren’t being reverent or displaying decorum do tend to be silent for most of the mass , there are just beyond too many distractions.

for funerals of course i would expect reverence and decorum, usually there is even more so than there is going to a catholic mass. the rest i expect things to be more casual.

But Priests are cuffed to those who are already running a particular parish, those with the money make the standards and rules, it takes an extremely thick skinned priest to rock the boat and be willing to lose deep pockets in the pews, to enforce any kind of silence , decorum, or reverence before during and after mass. An not come off as cold and indifferent or mean.

To many priests are playing the popularity and appeasing game or the money and management game and working into the line up for being a bishop.

The actual number of solid honest priests and bishops, cardinals, are very small. Let alone the numbers of a catholic church that anyone can walk into and go , oh wow this is a place of prayer, not a place to chill an goof off an annoy everyone sitting around me. So in turn the Mass becomes a place to go to out of obligation and routine and is not the place most go to for constant prayer and solace.
 
superblue said:
Is this a debate, or a questionare for some kind of personal survey ?
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I’m just curious. What do people even expect/appreciate in these days? Your posting actually gave me quite a bit to think about.
 
These are great questions but they take me back to high school essay tests and I’m not sure I want to subject myself to that. 🤣

I’d like to just touch on the last question you ask regarding if I’m someone who has lost hope. I think that in general, the answer to this question is yes for me. I would like to see a high bar when it comes to reverence, decorum, and respect for those things from the laity at any Mass I attend. Sadly, this has not been my experience, so I do not expect to see these things in any new parish I attend unless it is an EF or eastern rite mass. I’m not pitting one liturgy against the other, but simply sharing what my experience has led me to expect in attending new parishes. I’ve altered my attendance because of my experiences.

Although, I’ve realized that even at one parish the reverence of the Mass and respect of the laity can vary greatly depending on the time of day and the typical folks who attend each Mass. At a former parish I belonged to where I used to live, there were three Sunday Masses. The church building, statues, and altar were the same for all of these Masses since they were said at the same location. I believe these aspects to be important to draw out the due respect of the Mass from the laity, but there is still a responsibility on the laity to acknowledge the significance of the Mass and act accordingly. Amazingly, even with such beauty available to us through these structures, there were still those who acted as if they were at a picnic rather than at the most important event they could witness on earth. The laity at the EF Mass were always respectful and dressed appropriately during Mass. The ad orientem OF Mass was quite silent for being the OF, and although many people were dressed casually, their behavior (most notably, lack of chatter) during Mass indicated they understood the importance. The mid-day OF was another story. People regularly showed up late; and by late, I mean, post-gospel, post sermon, 40 minutes into Mass late. These same people would then receive communion. I don’t actively pay attention to other people at Mass, but I choose to sit in the back of the church and when the people who come late are sitting in front of or right next to me it’s hard to miss what they’re doing. Could these people have been late through no fault of their own? Absolutely. However, I witnessed people coming late to this Mass much more often than any other Mass I’ve regularly attended. It was definitely a regular occurrence. People would chatter before, all throughout, and after the Mass without exiting the nave. Once during the priest’s sermon a woman came up to the family sitting in front of me, handed the mother a gift, then started small talking in normal volume. This went on for several minutes. Other similar events occurred at this particular time of day that I stopped attending unless it was the only time that worked for me. I attended the early morning EF or late day OF ad orientem instead. Now, I attend EF exclusively but that is a result of my journey in the Faith.
 
I’m not sure people got inside the Jerusalem temple. they just got into the courtyards, where there would be the odor of the animal sacrifices – kinda like Arby’s – maybe. So, Idon’t know what the proper decorum would be.
 
seriously, I’m PTSD about people talking before Mass. Like the ladies behind me who were talking about their 4th of July parties and their new puppy --I walked out of church. what;s the point of being there?
 
BayCityRickL said:
seriously, I’m PTSD about people talking before Mass. Like the ladies behind me who were talking about their 4th of July parties and their new puppy --I walked out of church. what;s the point of being there?
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Have you considered wearing stereo or noise-cancelling headphones before Mass begins to block out the noise?
 
yes. I have my mp3 player with rosaries and hymns that I occasionally use, if I remember, and nuclear grade earplugs,
 
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the lowest form of decorum I have encountered is priest’s telling jokes, Adam and Eve jokes at the lowest level of propriety.
 
I remember in Australia the priest a couple of decades ago wanted to make the church seem more modern by inviting people at the end of the mass to come up to the altar and tell jokes. As you would expect this half ass attempt to modernise the church led to many families leaving the congregation, including mine. Like other liberal reforms it didn’t last but it needed massive immigration into the parish before the numbers recovered. No doubt the church will lose these people too in its attempt to forsake Catholic culture and join the uncultured mess that is now secular western civilisation.
 
Roseeurekacross said:
reverence and decorum
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rev·er·ence
ˈrev(ə)rəns/
noun
noun: reverence; plural noun: reverences
Code: 
1.
deep respect for someone or something.
"rituals showed honor and reverence for the dead"
synonyms:	high esteem, high regard, great respect, acclaim, admiration, appreciation, estimation, favor
"reverence for the countryside"
antonyms:	scorn
    archaic
    a gesture indicative of respect; a bow or curtsy.
    "the messenger made his reverence"
    a title given to a member of the clergy, or used in addressing them.
    noun: His Reverence; noun: Your Reverence
verb
verb: reverence; 3rd person present: reverences; past tense: reverenced; past participle: reverenced; gerund or present participle: reverencing
Code: 
1.
regard or treat with deep respect.
de·co·rum
dəˈkôrəm/
noun
noun: decorum
Code: 
behavior in keeping with good taste and propriety.
"you exhibit remarkable modesty and decorum"
synonyms:	propriety, seemliness, decency, good taste, correctness; More
politeness, courtesy, good manners;
dignity, respectability, modesty, demureness
"he had acted with decorum"
antonyms:	impropriety
    etiquette.
    "he had no idea of funeral decorum"
    synonyms:	etiquette, protocol, good form, custom, convention; More
    formalities, niceties, punctilios, politeness
    "a breach of decorum"
    antonyms:	impropriety
    archaic
    a particular requirement of good taste and propriety.
    plural noun: decorums
 
Duesenberg said:
Do you appreciate the presence of reverence and decorum in the celebration of the Mass?

Do you appreciate when it’s clear that those in the sanctuary adequately prepared to execute their parts of the celebration to the best of their abilities and with great dignity? Are you thankful for all the underpinnings (from the mindset and expectations of those in the sanctuary, to their intrinsic abilities, to the the church building and all of its furnishings) which made possible the celebration of the Mass with great reverence and decorum?

Or do you think reverence and decorum necessarily come at something(s) you value more? Things like love, efficiency, being more “welcoming”/“come as you are”, “spiritual”, etc?

Do you appreciate reverence and decorum in things like school graduations, funerals, military celebrations, etc? Or do you prefer things more casual?

Do you believe that reverence and decorum can be present in very simple ceremonies? Do you believe that the level of ceremony (no matter what it might be) complexity – whether it is high or low, is not necessarily a function of reverence and decorum?

How are you expectations of reverence and decorum influenced by today’s society and its continued coarsening?

What are your own expectations when it comes to reverence and decorum when you attend the celebration of Mass. Are you someone that has essentially “lost hope” that they will encounter reverence and decorum when they attend Mass?

NB: Please, please, let’s not make this an OF vs. EF Mass discussion, or one of mere personal preferences. Let’s go a little deeper on this thread. Thanks.
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I was kind of hoping you would define these terms for what you mean, in your words.
For example culturally we can see how very different we interpret or invest these words into ceremony.

I am in Australia, I might go to a Mass where acknowledgement and involvement of the Traditional Owners of the land lead to the Masses St Pope John Paul II celebrated.
 
petra22 said:
I sometimes think there is too much talking right before Mass and right after.
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Yes. I agree. I once went early to mass and thought I could say the Rosary. Bad move. I could not concentrate for all the talking around me - especially from the priests! Now I say my Rosary at home before I go or in the chapel outside since no one ever goes there.
 
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