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truetofaith
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What good is the Bible, if nobody seems to believe what it says? Everyone is giving their own interpretations of God’s Word.
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Gary_Sheldrake
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Good Evening TruetoFaith: I know a lot of Protestants and I have never been likened to a heathen by any of them. But I would say that any person of any faith who has time to cast dispersions on the thinking of others regardless of their faith, would do far better to attend to their own affairs. Anyway, most of the Protestants I have met here are thankful that the Catholic Church has provided this forum for us to talk to one another on.
All the best,
Gary
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Gary_Sheldrake
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Hello again TruetoFaith: While it’s not my place to judge someone else’s question, I would say that yours is a very good question. The way I see it, the answer is simple. The idea that truth descends through hierarchy and books is a human idea that took form in human social structure and then created analogs in religious thinking. If this were actually the case and truth did emanate from books and institutions and was manifest primarily in events of long ago, there would be absolutely no purpose in our being. Every living thing is a revelation unto itself and God is manifest for all to see in each of us. Our very lives are the fruition of God’s truth. No books are needed. The way to be what we were intended to be is to live out God’s will with the lives that we have, and the way to do that is simply to get out there and do things. Live, love, interact, laugh, cry, get a thrill, scare yourself - whatever it takes to feel life. Life is not something we are moving through or happens to us. Life is what we are, don’t you think?What good is the Bible, if nobody seems to believe what it says? Everyone is giving their own interpretations of God’s Word.
All the best
Gary
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John_Paul_Jones
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thistle
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Findings from modern science are irrelevant in matters of faith. Catholics are required to believe everyone living today is descended from the set of parents we call Adam and Eve. This is not something we can choose to believe or not.
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Hans_W
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Well, let’s reword it - some people seem to wrestle.
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Hans_W
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If you don’t like the term “science” then replace it with “nature”.
Our knowledge about nature has increased tremendously over the last few centuries.
Don’t worry - science will never threaten our faith in the human soul, but it can tell us a lot about the origins of our bodies.
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truetofaith
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I used the wrong example, Gary, by saying heathens. I know a lot of Protestants feel Catholics…don’t read the Bible, if we do, we don’t accept what’s in the Bible, only know what is fed to us by the Pope or the priests’ sermons at Mass, without any knowledge of the new or old Testament & just thoughtlessly, recite the rosary…and many Catholics are just like that!
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Dorothy
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Thankfully, bible studies are abounding and spreading in Catholic Churches where I live.
What the pope feeds me on faith and morals I believe.
There are many Catholics who pray the rosary reverently; I do understand your concern about thoughtless praying.
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truetofaith
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What you said about the pope, reminds me of this…The pope is criticized in the media on many of his comments, but the only things he says that have no error are the proclamations he makes ‘Ex-cathedra’ …on Faith & Morals!
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Dorothy
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Please be aware that the secular media is having a great time at putting their own cast on the words of the pope.
Our Lord Jesus Christ protects the Church and we have His promise for that. With regards to what concerns us, his sheep, the gates of hell will not prevail against the Church.
So, even if we have a pope who freely chooses to be immoral (history shows that has happened), for the protection and love of the faithful we will not be misled.
God is perfect mercy and justice!
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truetofaith
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Amen!
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grannymh
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I believe in Adam and Eve because that unity makes sense when all humanity is
seen in the light of John 3: 16-17.
seen in the light of John 3: 16-17.
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Dorothy
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…and Amen!Amen!
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TarkanAttila
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What if I told you St. Augustine said it was possible that the Creation of everything could have occurred in an instant?What good is the Bible, if nobody seems to believe what it says? Everyone is giving their own interpretations of God’s Word.
Furthermore, no orthodox teachers require Genesis be read flatly and taken at blank face value. Such a flat reading of Genesis completely misses the point of that passage. And there is comparison to the need to take the Resurrection literally.
See what orthodox Catholics have said on this issue:
ewtn.com/vexperts/showmessage.asp?number=356774&Pg=&Pgnu=1&recnu=
catholic.com/tracts/creation-and-genesis
catholiceducation.org/en/controversy/answering-atheists/how-to-read-the-first-chapter-of-genesis.html
That is only a small sample.
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grannymh
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Additional Catholic sources regarding the credibility of Adam and Eve.
The new expanded third edition of the book *Origin of the Human Species *by Catholic author Dr. Dennis Bonnette includes the article “The Myth of the “Myth” of Adam and Eve” as Appendix One. Appendix Two is “The Philosophical Impossibility of Darwinian Naturalistic Evolution”
http://www.amazon.com/Origin-Human-Species-Third-Edition/dp/1932589686/ref=sr_1_cc_1?s=aps&ie=UTF8&qid=14124676 70&sr=1-1-catcorr&keywords=Origin+of+the+human+spe cies++Bonnette
Link to Catholic article published in Crisis Magazine online: crisismagazine.com/2014/d…e-really-exist
Additional Catholic article hprweb.com/2014/07/time-t…genesis-story/
Informative Catholic website drbonnette.com/
The new expanded third edition of the book *Origin of the Human Species *by Catholic author Dr. Dennis Bonnette includes the article “The Myth of the “Myth” of Adam and Eve” as Appendix One. Appendix Two is “The Philosophical Impossibility of Darwinian Naturalistic Evolution”
http://www.amazon.com/Origin-Human-Species-Third-Edition/dp/1932589686/ref=sr_1_cc_1?s=aps&ie=UTF8&qid=14124676 70&sr=1-1-catcorr&keywords=Origin+of+the+human+spe cies++Bonnette
Link to Catholic article published in Crisis Magazine online: crisismagazine.com/2014/d…e-really-exist
Additional Catholic article hprweb.com/2014/07/time-t…genesis-story/
Informative Catholic website drbonnette.com/
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Hans_W
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Granny, all the links you are listing are NOT “Catholic websites” but links to a retired philosophy professor, Dr. Dennis Bonnette, who happens to adopt Intelligent Design Creationism.
This is NOT the stance of the Catholic Church.
The Church’s positions on the relationship of science and theology, theories of evolution and original sin, polygenism, biblical interpretation, are well documented.
The following links in chronological order are a good place to start. This is what the Church proposes for the common sense of the faithful.
w2.vatican.va/content/pius-xi…i-generis.html (Pius XII, 1950)
ewtn.com/library/Theology/SINEVOL.HTM (Paul VI, 1969)
ewtn.com/library/papaldoc/jp961022.htm (John Paul II, 1996)
The Catholic Church is concerned with theology, not science. When science over-reaches to propose theology, then the Church addresses it. This is why Humani Generis was proposed, to flesh out the relationship between science and theology.
No doubt, Pope Francis will have his say in due course. He already made it very clear that Catholics do NOT see God as a magician waving his magic wand from time to time (that’s what Intelligent Design teaches).
This is NOT the stance of the Catholic Church.
The Church’s positions on the relationship of science and theology, theories of evolution and original sin, polygenism, biblical interpretation, are well documented.
The following links in chronological order are a good place to start. This is what the Church proposes for the common sense of the faithful.
w2.vatican.va/content/pius-xi…i-generis.html (Pius XII, 1950)
ewtn.com/library/Theology/SINEVOL.HTM (Paul VI, 1969)
ewtn.com/library/papaldoc/jp961022.htm (John Paul II, 1996)
The Catholic Church is concerned with theology, not science. When science over-reaches to propose theology, then the Church addresses it. This is why Humani Generis was proposed, to flesh out the relationship between science and theology.
No doubt, Pope Francis will have his say in due course. He already made it very clear that Catholics do NOT see God as a magician waving his magic wand from time to time (that’s what Intelligent Design teaches).
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grannymh
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Pardon my ignorance. What is really Intelligent Design Creationism? The links I suggested are already based on a proper (Catholic) belief in God.
As far as the normal word creation, the links are based on the dramatic shift from Genesis 1: 25 to Genesis 1: 26.
We are talking about a real Adam and Eve who, according to the Catholic Church, is the population of two who founded humankind.
Again, please accept my apology. I do not mean to be rude. However, I do wonder if the dramatic shift from Genesis 1: 25 to Genesis 1: 26 has been noticed.
The links I presented are based on this shift and not, that is not, based on any program which seeks the originator of the universe. The links already are based on a true (Catholic) belief in God.
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grannymh
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What a way to start a week.
Another apology. Having to nitpick the sentence“The Catholic Church is concerned with theology, not science.” Of course, the Catholic Church is concerned with theology; but that does not imply that the scientific realm of devoted scientists is ignored.
The actual Catholic teachings on human nature, you and me, include the scientific (material) realm of scientists (our anatomies decompose) and the spiritual world of God and theologians starting with St. Paul. Our human goal is heaven and the Beatific Vision.
When there is a free moment, readers should check out CCC 355-356. Better yet, readers should continue reading the following paragraphs. We have a unique nature (Genesis 1: 26-27) which includes the spiritual and material worlds. In *CCC *365, readers will learn that spirit and matter in man are not two separate natures. It is their union which forms a single nature.
Therefore, we cannot ignore the presence of the material realm or domain of science.
Unfortunately the next sentence,
“When science over-reaches to propose theology, then the Church addresses it.” is a tad misleading. Authentic scientists, God bless them, are not in the business of proposing theology.
What really happens, is that a proposal by a scientist can intersect with a Catholic doctrine. Going back to the fact that we are body and soul, spirit and matter, material and immaterial, it should be easy to understand that a proposal based in the material world has the possibility of intersecting with the spiritual principle in a human person. Unfortunately, this is not so easy to understand because of all the sound bites about science and religion. For example: “The Catholic Church is concerned with theology, not science.”
Because the Catholic Church is concerned about the human person, the Catholic Church is deeply involved when certain scientific proposals deny basic Catholic doctrines flowing from the first three chapters of Genesis. Yes, I know all the gossip about the stupid author of those chapters. Sorry, human expectations cannot change Divine Revelation as taught by the Catholic Church.
I will answer questions because the two realms, material and spiritual, have to be completely understood when there are objections to the Catholic teaching that only Adam and Eve, not a population in the thousands, are the true progenitors of humanity.
Links to the universal Catechism of the Catholic Church, Second Edition
usccb.org/beliefs-and-teachings/what-we-believe/catechism/catechism-of-the-catholic-church/
scborromeo.org/ccc.htm
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Dorothy
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Grannymh,What a way to start a week.
“The Catholic Church is concerned with theology, not science.” Of course, the Catholic Church is concerned with theology; but that does not imply that the scientific realm of devoted scientists is ignored.
The actual Catholic teachings on human nature, you and me, include the scientific (material) realm of scientists (our anatomies decompose) and the spiritual world of God and theologians starting with St. Paul. Our human goal is heaven and the Beatific Vision.
When there is a free moment, readers should check out CCC 355-356. Better yet, readers should continue reading the following paragraphs. We have a unique nature (Genesis 1: 26-27) which includes the spiritual and material worlds. In *CCC *365, readers will learn that spirit and matter in man are not two separate natures. It is their union which forms a single nature.
Therefore, we cannot ignore the presence of the material realm or domain of science.
Unfortunately the next sentence,
“When science over-reaches to propose theology, then the Church addresses it.” is a tad misleading. Authentic scientists, God bless them, are not in the business of proposing theology.
What really happens, is that a proposal by a scientist can intersect with a Catholic doctrine. Going back to the fact that we are body and soul, spirit and matter, material and immaterial, it should be easy to understand that a proposal based in the material world has the possibility of intersecting with the spiritual principle in a human person. Unfortunately, this is not so easy to understand because of all the sound bites about science and religion. For example: “The Catholic Church is concerned with theology, not science.”
Because the Catholic Church is concerned about the human person, the Catholic Church is deeply involved when certain scientific proposals deny basic Catholic doctrines flowing from the first three chapters of Genesis. Yes, I know all the gossip about the stupid author of those chapters. Sorry, human expectations cannot change Divine Revelation as taught by the Catholic Church.
I will answer questions because the two realms, material and spiritual, have to be completely understood when there are objections to the Catholic teaching that only Adam and Eve, not a population in the thousands, are the true progenitors of humanity.
Links to the universal Catechism of the Catholic Church, Second Edition
usccb.org/beliefs-and-teachings/what-we-believe/catechism/catechism-of-the-catholic-church/
scborromeo.org/ccc.htm
I want to express my appreciation for your gift of researching and sharing all the information I have read that you posted about Adam and Eve. It certainly clarifies a lot of misunderstandings. God bless you!
Dorothy
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