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T.A.Stobie_SFO
Guest
Do you feel that granting amnesty to current illegal immigrants would help the illegal immigration problem?
Do you feel offering Amnesty would help the illegal immigration problem?
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LCMS_No_More
Guest
Since none of the plans are amnesty, the question is unfair. I believe that the Senate’s comprehensive immigration reform plan is a good idea.
By the way, there are amendments on the table to the comprehensive plan that say that until ICE has implemented the border security portion, the reform portions won’t take effect…which would mean that Bush doesn’t have to do anything and the entire package dies. This would be a really good test to see if he’s really serious about doing his job.
I know this because I watch CSPAN and try to get my information from primary sources.
By the way, there are amendments on the table to the comprehensive plan that say that until ICE has implemented the border security portion, the reform portions won’t take effect…which would mean that Bush doesn’t have to do anything and the entire package dies. This would be a really good test to see if he’s really serious about doing his job.
I know this because I watch CSPAN and try to get my information from primary sources.
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gilliam
Guest
We have tried amnesty before. The net effect was that more came over illegally because they figured sooner or later we would offer it again.
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mary_bobo
Guest
True, I think that happened during the Reagan administration. Until we secure the border, amnesty will only encourage more to come.
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davy39
Guest
mary bobo:
There you go! As I said on another thread, until we have secure borders, they might as well recess and go home. I haven’t heard any workable suggestions for enforcing the border laws yet.
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Geldain
Guest
mary bobo:
I agree 100%!
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Crumpy
Guest
The recent immigration crisis is being managed as a political problem, both parties trying to avoid offending a large section of the American electorate.
The first problem is with the American news media itself, which is focusing on the politics, more than they are on Mexico’s inability to sustain an economy where its citizens should want to stay.
Second, there doesn’t seem to be any momentum for the U.S. to get anything from Mexico, like more democratic reforms, or more civil treatment of U.S. citizens in Mexico, in exchange for the damage the Mexican invasion is creating in this country.
Third, the media and the politicians are hardly focusing on the fact that the President is not fulfilling his constitutional responsibilities to protect the U.S. borders.
Fourth, the immigration problem only underscores our porous borders and that there are so many illegal drugs in this country. We should have secured our borders for that reason alone, while we had the chance.
Fifth, amnesty is a reward for illegal activity, and it is ridiculous from the outset. Yes, most U.S. citizens are immigrants or descendents of immigrants, but most came here legally.
Sixth, U.S. citizens of hispanic origin understandably would want a very lenient policy towards immigration. Perhaps they would simply favor that idea put forth by Mexican President Vincente Fox, that the borders be totally open borders, so that the Mexican citizens can, to put it bluntly, simply invade and exploit the U.S. every way they want.
The U.S. should send Mexico a copy of our constitution and bill of rights, and suggest that they look it over seriously. First, it might give them some ideas on how to run a country, and second, it might suggest that we are a nation of laws, when we are at our best. We are not a nation of influence peddling and payoffs, as is the reputation of Mexican government.
No one wants to deal with any reality except the most immediate one, surprise, we’re here.
Give me a break. It’s one thing that these people are here illegally, and now they want to demand citizenship, when they got here by breaking the laws. What are we getting in return, I and mean, not just the people?
The first problem is with the American news media itself, which is focusing on the politics, more than they are on Mexico’s inability to sustain an economy where its citizens should want to stay.
Second, there doesn’t seem to be any momentum for the U.S. to get anything from Mexico, like more democratic reforms, or more civil treatment of U.S. citizens in Mexico, in exchange for the damage the Mexican invasion is creating in this country.
Third, the media and the politicians are hardly focusing on the fact that the President is not fulfilling his constitutional responsibilities to protect the U.S. borders.
Fourth, the immigration problem only underscores our porous borders and that there are so many illegal drugs in this country. We should have secured our borders for that reason alone, while we had the chance.
Fifth, amnesty is a reward for illegal activity, and it is ridiculous from the outset. Yes, most U.S. citizens are immigrants or descendents of immigrants, but most came here legally.
Sixth, U.S. citizens of hispanic origin understandably would want a very lenient policy towards immigration. Perhaps they would simply favor that idea put forth by Mexican President Vincente Fox, that the borders be totally open borders, so that the Mexican citizens can, to put it bluntly, simply invade and exploit the U.S. every way they want.
The U.S. should send Mexico a copy of our constitution and bill of rights, and suggest that they look it over seriously. First, it might give them some ideas on how to run a country, and second, it might suggest that we are a nation of laws, when we are at our best. We are not a nation of influence peddling and payoffs, as is the reputation of Mexican government.
No one wants to deal with any reality except the most immediate one, surprise, we’re here.
Give me a break. It’s one thing that these people are here illegally, and now they want to demand citizenship, when they got here by breaking the laws. What are we getting in return, I and mean, not just the people?
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Joe_Kelley
Guest
Depends on what you mean by Help. Man at the store told me that this powder was good for ants. He was right; I used it and now I have twice as many.
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Fitz
Guest
When everyone that has come here illegally is granted citizenship, then an entire new group of people will come here illegally to take low paying jobs that the new citizens won’t do because now they qualify for higher wages, and so the cycle continues.
We need a better legal route for people to become citizens. We need secure borders for many reasons, so securig the borders should be the first consideration. Next, if there are people that merely want to come to work for part of the year, then we need a very good guest worker program that screened people for police records before they participate.
We need a better legal route for people to become citizens. We need secure borders for many reasons, so securig the borders should be the first consideration. Next, if there are people that merely want to come to work for part of the year, then we need a very good guest worker program that screened people for police records before they participate.
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richbansha
Guest
Shame on the bunch of you! We are talking about our brothers and sisters not our enemies. I agree with Fox. Going from Sonora to Arizona should be the same as going from Manhattan to Brooklyn. I’ll even do Fox one better, Mexican citizens should have the right to vote in local elections. Crazy? Tell that to the EU. If a Turkish Cypriot can live, work and vote in Spain what is our excuse for racism?
Don’t give me any ot that economic and political burden nonsense. If the EU can absorb Estonia and Latvia, recently Communist countries and economies that were far worse than Mexico’s, there is nothing to stop us from adopting Mexico and Canada too for that matter.
Border Security my dainty little foot! Why don’t you take a good look at what is really going on. Every move that congress and the administration has made since 9-11 has been designed to keep Americans IN not illegals out. We are going into a nationwide lock-down. Be afraid of that. Never mind the Mexican illegals.
Don’t give me any ot that economic and political burden nonsense. If the EU can absorb Estonia and Latvia, recently Communist countries and economies that were far worse than Mexico’s, there is nothing to stop us from adopting Mexico and Canada too for that matter.
Border Security my dainty little foot! Why don’t you take a good look at what is really going on. Every move that congress and the administration has made since 9-11 has been designed to keep Americans IN not illegals out. We are going into a nationwide lock-down. Be afraid of that. Never mind the Mexican illegals.
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LRThunder
Guest
Huh?
EU absorbing Estonia and Latvia is not a valid comparison. The EU is not an independent, sovereign nation, but a collection of nations. Why should we adopt Mexico and Canada?
As for that last bit, I agree border security doesn’t exist and the move against illegal immigrants doesn’t seem top priority for the government right now, but keeping Americans in? Where did you get that idea?
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Geldain
Guest
Give us an example of this please
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richbansha
Guest
Easy… As of Dec 2006 a passport will be required to visit Toronto on commerical airlines. As of Dec 2007, you will need a passport to walk across the bridge at Niagra Falls. That is LAW now.
Another little tidbit, that doesn’t seem to get much press, is that many passport applications are being denied administratively without reference to any law. National security they say. Yeah right! I guess it is in the national interest to keep all of the terrorists here rather than let them go someplace else.
Another little tidbit, that doesn’t seem to get much press, is that many passport applications are being denied administratively without reference to any law. National security they say. Yeah right! I guess it is in the national interest to keep all of the terrorists here rather than let them go someplace else.
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Geldain
Guest
This keeps people IN the US? Not hardly. Passport in hand, and you are good to go. What’s hard about that?
Got a link to validate your assertion?
So all the terrorists are in the US?
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LRThunder
Guest
Are you sure that’s US law and not Canadian law? Besides, one pretty much needs a passport when visiting other countries, even if it’s to step one foot in Canada or Mexico.
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richbansha
Guest
ytravelc.com/NewPassportRules2005.htm
P.S. I made a mistake in the origional post. It is a 3 year time frame not 2. Still, it is a restriction none the less.
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Irene
Guest
IMHO, in the long term the best solution is doing what we can to encourage/cajole Mexico to develop and alleviate the severe socio-economic inequalities that motivate immigration in the first place. Now, that’s **very **long term, but its the root of the issue.
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Pug
Guest
T.A.Stobie:
Problem? From whose perspective, that of the illegal immigrants? Or the government (which one)? Or the jobless? Or employers? Or the politicians? Or homeowner’s associations? Or hospital emergency rooms? Or displaced parishioners? Etc?
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LCMS_No_More
Guest
No one cares about that…even though it a major contributing root cause for the issue.
Funny that. Congress also isn’t doing its job of authorizing and funding enough border patrol agents and the technology to do the job effectively.
Agreed.
Yes, it is. That’s why there are no amnesty plans on the table.
SLAM!
That was the door closing behind the “citizen immigrants and descendentss of immigrants.” Well, wishful thinking anyway.
Poppycock! Please back that up with mainstream sources.
I’m one of those wierd people who credit the fall of the PRI about five years ago to the fact that there used to be a pattern of circular immigration between the US and Mexico and people taking our ideas of a constitutional democratic republic back. Reform takes time, especially when it involved a major part of the zeitgeist of a country.
Question: Do yo think that any of the reform plans on the table will result in anyone becoming an instant US citizen?
Second question: Have you read any of the proposals yourself?
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