Do you know much about marriage tribunals.. (that can nullify a previous marriage)?

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i would like to know more about how the Catholic Church nullifies a marriage (basically saying there was no marriage in the 1st place).

I know that if a couple is married by Justice of the P, they are not married in eyes of God…

But what are some other times when marriage is not valid?

I have heard people say that the Catholic Church’s ways of nullifying marriages is just another way of granting divorces… :rolleyes:

thanks…
 
I have an anullment of over 20 years standing. I had been ‘married’ for 15years. I think it took about 6 years for it to come through and prior to applying my ‘ex husband’ had legally divorced me. The reason it was granted is very personal and does not concern me but my ex-husband and I’d rather not make it public on the internet but it was very serious grounds for annulment.

I had to write my whole life story to the current date, and once I submitted it, I was told that it did not contain enough detail (six pages!!!) and I had to re write it and it was an agonizing process for me to have to go into all details of my life even my interior life - to share what was quite personal. My parents were witnesses and my ex husband (very surprisingly) also agreed to give evidence. I, of course, also had to give evidence. It was a very painful procedure as I had two adult sons. I was advised by a priest to seek annulment. Prior to that it had never crossed my mind.

An annulment is not simply a Cathoic divorce, an anullment examines and determines whether a sacramental marriage took place initially and if not, then there was no marriage in The Church (though one was married in a Catholic Church by a priest)in the first place and an annulment simply declares this officially.

Sacrament of Marriage:
newadvent.org/cathen/09707a.htm

Defender of the Matrimonial Tie (re process of annulment)
newadvent.org/cathen/04675a.htm

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You just may have better answers to your questions in the Apologetics Forum. I can only speak from personal experience over 25 years ago now when I first applied, not from a general knowledge of The Church’s teachings on annulments and the process involved.

Here is an article answering 10 questions on Annulment of Marriage:
americancatholic.org/newsletters/cu/ac1002.asp

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distracted said:
i would like to know more about how the Catholic Church nullifies a marriage (basically saying there was no marriage in the 1st place).

I k

thanks…
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not true, no power on earth can nullify a valid marriage. What the Catholic Church does have, based on the binding and loosing judgment granted by Christ himself, is the authority to investigate the circumstances which pertained at the time of the marriage (not afterward) and determine if the contract was valid from its inception. If the canon law tribunal does find such evidence, it issues a decree of nullity–a declaration that the marriage is invalid. It does not “nullify” a valid marriage.

No it is not Catholic divorce.

If you would like to read more including about grounds search the dozens of threads on the topic on the proper forum liturgy and sacraments
 
BarbaraTherese said:
I have an anullment of over 20 years standing. I had been ‘married’ for 15years. I think it took about 6 years for it to come through and prior to applying my ‘ex husband’ had legally divorced me. The reason it was granted is very personal and does not concern me but my ex-husband and I’d rather not make it public on the internet but it was very serious grounds for annulment.

I had to write my whole life story to the current date, and once I submitted it, I was told that it did not contain enough detail (six pages!!!) and I had to re write it and it was an agonizing process for me to have to go into all details of my life even my interior life - to share what was quite personal. My parents were witnesses and my ex husband (very surprisingly) also agreed to give evidence. I, of course, also had to give evidence. It was a very painful procedure as I had two adult sons. I was advised by a priest to seek annulment. Prior to that it had never crossed my mind.

An annulment is not simply a Cathoic divorce, an anullment examines and determines whether a sacramental marriage took place initially and if not, then there was no marriage in The Church (though one was married in a Catholic Church by a priest)in the first place and an annulment simply declares this officially.

Sacrament of Marriage:
newadvent.org/cathen/09707a.htm

Defender of the Matrimonial Tie (re process of annulment)
newadvent.org/cathen/04675a.htm

.
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i had no idea it was like that. I never did think annulment ws just “Catholic divorce” but that is what Protestants & those who dont understand say… wanted to be able to refute tht.

so you are saying you sought an annulment but by that time your husband had filed for legal divorce?

this brings up another question: how does the Church view legal divorces? I assume they are invalid if no church annulment?

I guess i need the book (which probably doesn’t exist?) Annulments for Dummies… :eek: 😃

I think it is an excellent idea to write out one’s whole life story… (though i am sorry it caused you pain. It causes me a lot of pain also…to do that… but as they say No pain, no gain…:ouch: :hypno: :newidea: )

thanks for the info…

all i really know is that one reason for annulment would be if one of the parties was having an affair t the time of the wedding… that would prove didn’t know about commitment…

I would like to know of other situations that could invalidate a marriage… like what if a catholic marries a non-Catholic in a non-Catholic church (because s/he doesn’t value Catholic faith?

thanks again… 🙂
 
BarbaraTherese said:
Happy to help!🙂
Deo Gratius.

You just might have better luck if you still have questions in the Sacraments forum or Apologetics.

Blessings and my regards…Barb:)
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If a Catholic doesn’t officialy give up his religion but yet marries in a Christian church other than Catholic… like, say Baptist… w/o pries’ts permission… is the marriage automatically invalid? Or does the person have to go through the tribunal??
 
distracted said:
If a Catholic doesn’t officialy give up his religion but yet marries in a Christian church other than Catholic… like, say Baptist… w/o pries’ts permission… is the marriage automatically invalid? Or does the person have to go through the tribunal??
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Hi again Distracted…you are asking someone who is not at all confident in some areas. However, a Catholic, to my knowledge, cannot marry in any Faith Profession but The Catholic Church. If one marries outside The Church, in the eyes of The Church the marriage is invalid to my knowledge. My own marriage was in The Church to a non Catholic. But I urge you out of a desire to get informed and educated information to probably try Apologetics…I have learnt an aweful lot from that Forum and also Ask An Apologist and often run through these Forums lurking and picking up wondrous bits of education in The Faith.
If I have questions myself about things, I most often put a thread into Apologetics and my queries have always been resolved happily.
Another means of resolving re annulment, is to ring your diocesan offices and ask to speak with someone who can inform you re marriage outside The Church, annulment etc. I find this a very helpful resource point too.

I did a Search and if you go to this link you will find many threads on annulment. You may like to search through these for information:
forums.catholic-questions.org/search.php?searchid=2033432

God’s blessings on you and yours, Distracted…and I hope you will find the answers you seek…Barb:)
 
distracted said:
If a Catholic doesn’t officialy give up his religion but yet marries in a Christian church other than Catholic… like, say Baptist… w/o pries’ts permission… is the marriage automatically invalid? Or does the person have to go through the tribunal??
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A Catholic is bound by Canon Law to marry in the Catholic Church. If he/she is marrying a non-Catholic then a dispensation may be granted by the bishop for the marriage to take place somewhere else. If the marriage takes place outside the Catholic Church, without a dispensation, the marriage is invalid due to 'Lack of Canonical Form."

It depends on the diocese whether this marriage is submitted to the Tribunal but even if it is, with all the documentation in place it’s a very short process, a few weeks at most.
 
distracted said:
i had no idea it was like that. I never did think annulment ws just “Catholic divorce” but that is what Protestants & those who dont understand say… wanted to be able to refute tht.

so you are saying you sought an annulment but by that time your husband had filed for legal divorce?

The couple must be already divorced in order to petition for an annulment (decree of nullity).

this brings up another question: how does the Church view legal divorces? I assume they are invalid if no church annulment?

The Church sees divorce as a sad but sometimes necessary step to protect spouse, children, inheritance, etc.

all i really know is that one reason for annulment would be if one of the parties was having an affair t the time of the wedding… that would prove didn’t know about commitment…

I would like to know of other situations that could invalidate a marriage… like what if a catholic marries a non-Catholic in a non-Catholic church (because s/he doesn’t value Catholic faith?

Marrying with the intention to never have children, or to divorce ‘if things don’t work out’, or to not be faithful, etc. Those can render a marriage invalid.

Lack of consent is another thing that could make the marriage invalid. Let’s say you know you are incapable of having kids and don’t reveal it to your fiancé. You let her believe you’ll have children. Without that knowledge she isn’t capable of giving informed consent. Maybe if she knew the situation she wouldn’t want to marry you.

Hiding homosexuality is another thing that could lead to lack of consent. I know several couples who broke up when it became known that one of the spouses was gay. Some had several kids by that time. If your fiancé knows these things and decides to marry you anyway, (like my uncle did with my aunt who had had a hysterectomy in her teens) then they can’t claim lack of consent. If the condition is only discovered by the couple after the wedding, then one would expect the marriage to be valid, at least where consent is concerned.
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Phemie:
weird… How can you be gay and yet get married & have children?

so much for being born gay… never did believe in that hog-wash… :rolleyes:
 
distracted said:
weird… How can you be gay and yet get married & have children?

so much for being born gay… never did believe in that hog-wash… :rolleyes:
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In truth, I feel sorry for them. Being a sufferer of mental illness, I know what it is to be socially distasteful, to be pushed onto the outside and incidentally in The Church too, despite all the nice words I read. I know what it is to be a minority forced onto the fringes. I still do not understand the why’s and wherefore’s of same gender sexual attraction and so I withhold a Yay or Nay on that aspect…they are just people. I dont think even science can give an explanation, the jury is still out…and if it proves to be some kind of disorder, then the full consent aspect of sin is diminished.
Of course same gender sexually attracted attracted women can in some places be artificially inseminated. And even ssa men can adopt. I cannot agree with this as I think that a child deserves a mother and father as role models for one. I cannot agree with marriage for ssa people either. Marriage per se means a man and a woman.
I think personally the reason the so called “homosexual lobby” here in Australia is so powerful is that fear drives it…and fear of many social matters and even perhaps moral matters connected to religion. Here in Australia the “prostitution lobby” is also very powerful…and likewise I am convinced, fear driven. Oh for the day when we oft fear driven sufferers of MI develop a very powerful lobby…and not just considered as the diseased needing treatment.
Like cancer it seems to be a modern problem still with no answer with much research occurring…the same with mental illness. It is not easy to accept that a part of you that is intrinsically part of you…is a pathology to be researched and hopefully treated and eradicated. Not easy at all.

Compassion with insight.

God bless us all. Amen.

Cacha on the rounds, Distracted…warm regards…barb:)
Oouch 3am on the knocker here…I am celebrating term break. But boy will I pay for it after a couple of hours sleep only to face the ‘new day’???😃
 
distracted said:
weird… How can you be gay and yet get married & have children?

so much for being born gay… never did believe in that hog-wash… :rolleyes:
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One of my friends knew he was gay long before he got married, yet he converted to Judaism, with all that that entails (no pun intended) and married to fit in and didn’t want to face what he was. He says he knew it was the worst thing he could possibly do but he still went through with it. Naturally the marriage failed, although he tried his best. He has two lovely grown up daughters and now 2 beautiful grandchildren.

Looking back at my brother, it was obvious that something was different from the time he was 5 or 6. He knew he didn’t feel like other boys when he was school aged but he didn’t really face up to his homosexuality until he was in his mid 30s.
 
Phemie said:
One of my friends knew he was gay long before he got married, yet he converted to Judaism, with all that that entails (no pun intended) and married to fit in and didn’t want to face what he was. He says he knew it was the worst thing he could possibly do but he still went through with it. Naturally the marriage failed, although he tried his best. He has two lovely grown up daughters and now 2 beautiful grandchildren.

Looking back at my brother, it was obvious that something was different from the time he was 5 or 6. He knew he didn’t feel like other boys when he was school aged but he didn’t really face up to his homosexuality until he was in his mid 30s.
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i don’t believe anyone is born gay and even if a person is inclined to be effeminant or what have you, he can still change… and adjust to being straight… because that is how God made men (& women)… to be heterosexual. Just the fact taht he “knew it was the worst thing he could possibly do” and did it anyway… shows me something about… not only him but other gays as well… I am sorry, but what i mean is that they go against nature… and going against nature is going against God… & anyone who does that is perverted… (duh) They have crossed a line… Only those who have crossed such a line would go so far as to call themselves “born gay”… It is just an excuse… so they escape culpability…

But it doesn’t work with me…
 
BarbaraTherese said:
In truth, I feel sorry for them. Being a sufferer of mental illness, I know what it is to be socially distasteful, to be pushed onto the outside and incidentally in The Church too, despite all the nice words I read. D
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i have felt the same way… In fact, i have been to churches recently where… some members just act like i am nuts… because i like to spend time alone with Jesus (a lot!!)… Since no one else in the parish seems to wnat to do that, thye think i have some kind of mental illness (I THINK they think that… I guess, technically, i don’t know… but i think it because of their behavior… some of them…). Actually, i suppose, technically, i do have a “mental illness” but i don’t like tht term. You probably don’t either? I think it conjures up a very bad image… and as i have said b4 on these forums, i believe (know) that everyone has a mental illness … Everyone is human, everyone is a sinner… No one had perfect parents… no one has a perfect life (though some, obviously are doing better, it seems, than others…:confused: 🤷 ). Anyway, all this = “mental illness”…

I think that to give in to sin, to reject Christ, is the absolute worst mental illness there is… and by that definition, there are a lot of crazy people running around… 😃

i have ptsd but any normal person who went through what i went throuhg (that caused it) would have it… So, i am “normal” to have ptsd…

Normal is another word i don’t like… doesn’t mean much…

Anyway… it is “groovy” 😃 (Is that word coming back into fashion?) to meet someone who has walked in my shoes… to some extent… (makes me feel less alone)… but i do pray for you…

God bless… 🙂
 
There have probably been dozens of threads on this topic but all I can say is that the unhappy gay people I’ve known would not have ‘chosen’ that. Who would choose to be reviled by their families and beaten by passersby?

They do have the same option as anyone else, stay celibate and chaste. Not having sex doesn’t make them any less gay.
 
Phemie said:
They do have the same option as anyone else, stay celibate and chaste. Not having sex doesn’t make them any less gay.
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not trying to be rude… but if i can speak my mind…

this is what i was thinking…

Do you believe everything people tell you? I mean, if i told you i was able to leap tall buildings in a single bound… and have been able to do that since birht, would you believe that too???
 
distracted said:
not trying to be rude… but if i can speak my mind…

this is what i was thinking…

Do you believe everything people tell you? I mean, if i told you i was able to leap tall buildings in a single bound… and have been able to do that since birht, would you believe that too???
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What did I write that warrants these questions?
 
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