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Sheen
Guest
As I said earlier, I don’t think anyone here has said they read their Bible instead of participating in Mass. If one wishes to read along with the lector as the Scriptures are proclaimed, what is wrong with that?!!
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MGEISING
Guest
I agree … I guess I am not following along … of course I am left handed, blond and over forty … maybe that has something to do with it!As I said earlier, I don’t think anyone here has said they read their Bible instead of participating in Mass. If one wishes to read along with the lector as the Scriptures are proclaimed, what is wrong with that?!!
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Deacon2006
Guest
Sure it is possible to read along from a bible but not very practical. You need the same translation as the lectionary version and you need to have the reading premarked. The sheer volume of the bible and difficultly of reading along broken with passages just makes it akward. This is why a translation of the approved roman missal is the by far the best solution.
The tendency to read other material that is before your eyes is also a very human reponse when you are looking down at the page. When that happens you are no longer partcipating at the mass you are subsistuting your ideas of what is valuable reading material to cover this mass instead of allowing the Bishops to decide.
It is a noble proposition to bring your bible but the wisdom of the church has long since fought and won this battle, that is why they approve missals for the mass.
God Bless
The tendency to read other material that is before your eyes is also a very human reponse when you are looking down at the page. When that happens you are no longer partcipating at the mass you are subsistuting your ideas of what is valuable reading material to cover this mass instead of allowing the Bishops to decide.
It is a noble proposition to bring your bible but the wisdom of the church has long since fought and won this battle, that is why they approve missals for the mass.
God Bless
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Sheen
Guest
Was there really a “battle” about this? If so, how was it actually fought? – serious question –
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MGEISING
Guest
Sheen: I think you are awesome!Was there really a “battle” about this? If so, how was it actually fought? – serious question –
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Deacon2006
Guest
I offer my thoughts in Christian charity and they don’t merit your quips in return
Use the bible if you must but please don’t make fun of others who are trying to share what the Holy Sprit has inspired the Church to create for the mass.
The missal contains the prayers, which forms the mass, which is the source and summit of our christian life. When it comes to my spiritual life I always defer to the guidance of the Holy Spirit and my Church.
God Bless
Use the bible if you must but please don’t make fun of others who are trying to share what the Holy Sprit has inspired the Church to create for the mass.
The missal contains the prayers, which forms the mass, which is the source and summit of our christian life. When it comes to my spiritual life I always defer to the guidance of the Holy Spirit and my Church.
God Bless
G
Gratias_Grace
Guest
Nothing spesially wrong! I like to read it at home and do my prayers before I leave the house for mass. I also like to do my prayers on the way to church, to prepare to meet Him. The first thing I do when I enter Church is to kneel, pray and wait for the priest to enter.Of course not???
Again, as if carrying a Bible to church is something not to be countenanced. What, pray tell, is so seriously wrong with reading God’s Word in His sacramental presence prior to Mass?
I would have felt it quite unnaturally to bring my Bible to Churhc, like a demonstration (holier than holiest).
If to read the Bible in Church before mass helps you to come closer to Christ, then this may be your personally road to God. It is not forbidden, so go on!
Blessings!
G.G.
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Sheen
Guest
Were you referring to my post wherein I asked a question about a statement you made? Because I also offer my thoughts – and yes, questions – in Christian charity as well. My questions was not a quip; it was – as I clearly indicated – a serious question.
You made a statement that
I had a question about your statement, so I asked it.
I am sincerely curious to know what kind of debate really took place and how it was decided – as you say by the Bishops – that it is better for the faithful to avoid bringing their Bibles to Mass but missals are to be allowed.
You stated that
Isn’t the use of a missal potentially as much cause for distraction?? ** serious question, not a quip.**
As do I – in all things.
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Thomas2
Guest
Ya know,
Whether you read it from your Bible or in the missalette or just plain ole heard it with your ears, today’s Readings reminded us to love our neighbor as ourselves! Ummmm…Considering this, it might be wise not to pick at each other.
Bible or missalette - it is commendable to study the Scriptures. Ignorance of Scripture is ignorance of God. Now I don’t know too many folks who can memorize the Scriptures from the Readings at Mass. Some folks are more comfortable with their Bibles than the missalettes they publish. Some folks own a Bible but can’t afford a missalette. The ones we use around here for daily Mass do not contain ANY of the Readings, just the Antiphons, Responsorial Psalm and the Alleluia verse for the day. If anyone (like me) has struggled with trying to listen to mangled, mumbled, misread and mistaken Readings by various Readers, it is wise to bring a missalette or a Bible, that way you get the Message that is meant to be convied which is the whole point of listening and following along in a missalette or a Bible.
What I like to do is go over the Readings in my Bible with my coffee in the morning before going to Mass. Then when I get there I try to follow along with what is being said. If the Reader isn’t so hot, I pick up the missalette. Sometimes I get new insights or ideas from what is read, the way it is read or perhaps points the homilist makes, so I go home and go over it again in my Bible.
My experience in RCIA was this - I wanted to bring my Bible to Mass simply because the Readings for the day weren’t there and it was hard to follow along without a visual aid. I was MISTAKENLY given the impression that bringing a Bible to Mass was somehow wrong. This simply isn’t so.
My elderly neighbor who I help to get to Mass brings a missalette of her own on Sundays. She is hard of hearing and needs it to follow the Readings. If she chose to bring her own Bible, I certainly wouldn’t discourage her.
Peace and all good,
Thomas2
Whether you read it from your Bible or in the missalette or just plain ole heard it with your ears, today’s Readings reminded us to love our neighbor as ourselves! Ummmm…Considering this, it might be wise not to pick at each other.
Bible or missalette - it is commendable to study the Scriptures. Ignorance of Scripture is ignorance of God. Now I don’t know too many folks who can memorize the Scriptures from the Readings at Mass. Some folks are more comfortable with their Bibles than the missalettes they publish. Some folks own a Bible but can’t afford a missalette. The ones we use around here for daily Mass do not contain ANY of the Readings, just the Antiphons, Responsorial Psalm and the Alleluia verse for the day. If anyone (like me) has struggled with trying to listen to mangled, mumbled, misread and mistaken Readings by various Readers, it is wise to bring a missalette or a Bible, that way you get the Message that is meant to be convied which is the whole point of listening and following along in a missalette or a Bible.
What I like to do is go over the Readings in my Bible with my coffee in the morning before going to Mass. Then when I get there I try to follow along with what is being said. If the Reader isn’t so hot, I pick up the missalette. Sometimes I get new insights or ideas from what is read, the way it is read or perhaps points the homilist makes, so I go home and go over it again in my Bible.
My experience in RCIA was this - I wanted to bring my Bible to Mass simply because the Readings for the day weren’t there and it was hard to follow along without a visual aid. I was MISTAKENLY given the impression that bringing a Bible to Mass was somehow wrong. This simply isn’t so.
My elderly neighbor who I help to get to Mass brings a missalette of her own on Sundays. She is hard of hearing and needs it to follow the Readings. If she chose to bring her own Bible, I certainly wouldn’t discourage her.
Peace and all good,
Thomas2
J
JimG
Guest
Our parish has missalettes in every pew which contain all the readings for each day. I didn’t realize that there were misalettes without the readings!
JimG
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Prometheum_x
Guest
The Scripture found in the missal(ette) is just as much “the Bible” as bound and printed matter labeled “The Bible”. It may not be *all *of Scripture, but it is Scripture nevertheless. Therefore, when you read Scripture from the missal(ette), you are effectively reading from the Bible.
It seems clear to me that the reasons one would take their Bible to Mass (other than simply having it with them for some purpose such as a Bible study outside of Mass) are either that a) they want to read other portions of Scripture in addition to (or in place of) the readings for the day or that b) there is a certain attachment to having the complete collection of Scriptures, perhaps as an expression of one’s devotion and honor for the Word of God.
It seems clear to me that the reasons one would take their Bible to Mass (other than simply having it with them for some purpose such as a Bible study outside of Mass) are either that a) they want to read other portions of Scripture in addition to (or in place of) the readings for the day or that b) there is a certain attachment to having the complete collection of Scriptures, perhaps as an expression of one’s devotion and honor for the Word of God.
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EENS
Guest
How is it wrong, Deacon2006, to pray the Rosary during Mass when 2 pious Popes have both suggested that laymen do so? God bless.
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MGEISING
Guest
Prometheum_x said:
Prometheum_xSo eloquently put (both points) … I like it!
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system
Guest
Sheen
The mass has a document that defines the liturgry it is called the Roman Missal. It is manifestly superior to use the correct liturgical texts when particpating at mass. Does the priest use the bible during mass or what about the bishop? The answer is a resounding NO.:banghead:
Your arguements in favor of the bible are peevey, pompish and snide. Everyone has told you it is okay to use the bible, but they recommend the use of the missal because it is the mind of the church.
Since apparently no one can convince you that there might be a better text for use at the mass then the bible I suggest you bring a big jewel encrusted bible with gold lined pages and silk ribbons. Take great pains to ensure everyone around you can see you turn the pages to following along with the readings. I’m sure they all will give you appreciative glancess and you can leave mass thinking that once again you are not just an average catholic but SUPER CATHOLIC
.
Cut out the polly annish routine, only the most insincere person would coutniue misrepresenting the sentiment of those posters who are not ciritising your use of the bible but offereing the superior text approved for mass by the bishops.
One last time the missal is the approved text of the mass and bible is not. A man of humility always tries to align himself with the church but you do what you want…
Because you’re SUPER CATHOLIC:bowdown: .
The mass has a document that defines the liturgry it is called the Roman Missal. It is manifestly superior to use the correct liturgical texts when particpating at mass. Does the priest use the bible during mass or what about the bishop? The answer is a resounding NO.:banghead:
Your arguements in favor of the bible are peevey, pompish and snide. Everyone has told you it is okay to use the bible, but they recommend the use of the missal because it is the mind of the church.
Since apparently no one can convince you that there might be a better text for use at the mass then the bible I suggest you bring a big jewel encrusted bible with gold lined pages and silk ribbons. Take great pains to ensure everyone around you can see you turn the pages to following along with the readings. I’m sure they all will give you appreciative glancess and you can leave mass thinking that once again you are not just an average catholic but SUPER CATHOLIC
.Cut out the polly annish routine, only the most insincere person would coutniue misrepresenting the sentiment of those posters who are not ciritising your use of the bible but offereing the superior text approved for mass by the bishops.
One last time the missal is the approved text of the mass and bible is not. A man of humility always tries to align himself with the church but you do what you want…
Because you’re SUPER CATHOLIC:bowdown: .
D
Deacon2006
Guest
I live in the year 2004 and my Pope wants everyone to fully particpate(mind, body soul) in the mass. I obediently comply with his wisdom.
God Bless
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EENS
Guest
Nevertheless, if you chose to do that, you cannot call praying the Rosary wrong when two Popes have endorsed it (and this Pope has not forbidden it, and even if he did, it would not be infallible, for if it is infallibly a sin to pray the Rosary at Mass, these two Popes were absolutely wrong). God bless.
O
OhioBob
Guest
NorthernBrother:
If you had bothered to READ the posts Sheen has made on this thread you would have learned the following:
She enjoys reflecting on the Mass readings by reading them in her Bible BEFORE Mass;
She follows the readings as they are read for numerous reasons (I won’t repeat her blonde comment
) however when she does, she follows along in the missalette (apparently because she agrees that it is “manifestly superior” for use during Mass);
She never once proposed using the bible DURING Mass (which I think you already know);
While she might be a "closet fundamentalist
" her remarks are never “peevey, pompish and snide”.
She doesn’t have a snazzy bible case. I doubt that “a big jewel encrusted bible with gold lined pages and silk ribbons” would fit in her cheapo bible bag. Thus your proposal could be a problem for her unless she has real strong arms;
She apparently has more humility than you do (at least than you exhibit in the tone of your post);
As to whether she is “Super Catholic” or not, I doubt it. You seem to have staked out that position for yourself. :bowdown:
Blessings anyway.
Not that Sheen needs defending (I’m sure she can more than adequately defend herself), but what the heck (who said chivalry is dead)…
If you had bothered to READ the posts Sheen has made on this thread you would have learned the following:
She enjoys reflecting on the Mass readings by reading them in her Bible BEFORE Mass;
She follows the readings as they are read for numerous reasons (I won’t repeat her blonde comment
) however when she does, she follows along in the missalette (apparently because she agrees that it is “manifestly superior” for use during Mass);She never once proposed using the bible DURING Mass (which I think you already know);
While she might be a "closet fundamentalist
" her remarks are never “peevey, pompish and snide”.She doesn’t have a snazzy bible case. I doubt that “a big jewel encrusted bible with gold lined pages and silk ribbons” would fit in her cheapo bible bag. Thus your proposal could be a problem for her unless she has real strong arms;
She apparently has more humility than you do (at least than you exhibit in the tone of your post);
As to whether she is “Super Catholic” or not, I doubt it. You seem to have staked out that position for yourself. :bowdown:
Blessings anyway.
M
MGEISING
Guest
Not to generalize Deacon2006 … but if you obediently comply with our Holy Father’s wisdom … I take my hat off to you … because I left our latest parish - because we had the most liberal deacon you ever would meet and I have only heard/seen one deacon that I thought was obedient to the Holy Father. Again, I certainly don’t want to generalize … but I haven’t been exposed to many Holy Deacons … although I am sure there a many! Amen.
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tee_eff_em
Guest
Apparently, I “must spread some Reputation around before giving it to OhioBob again.” (I thought I’d been spreading it around pretty good – Dunno when I last offered any to OhioBob? Anyway: )
Instead, I’ll just have to say :clapping: :tiphat:
Instead, I’ll just have to say :clapping: :tiphat:
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Deacon2006
Guest
My mistake I see now that I am dealing with someone who loves legalistic arguments by citing dated anonymous sources out of context.
- Since the mass does not include a gesture of pulling out a rosary in its rubrics then you must have added it to the mass. To change the liturgy is a grave abuse. It is clear that if you pray the rosary then you are not praying the Mass and as lawyers like to say you can’t suck and blow at the same time. This is why I pray the rosary before the mass.
- Obedience to the pope is a matter of religious assent that all Catholics are expected to adhere to even if the pope does not use the infallible formula (LG25 and CCC892)
While this post is not specifically about the missal or the bible debate raging here the principle is still relevant.
The pope has not recommended the bible as the liturgical document for the mass he does recommend the missal. Catholics are then definitively expected to embrace the missal for mass. This is a matter of our faith.
In general I don’t like the tone this thread is taking. The faithful should never be put in a position were so many feel that to if you defend the Church’s teachings then you are attacking Mary or the Bible. You can never defend the honor of Mary and the Bible by attacking the Pope or the Magisterium.
God Bless
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