Do you think that the yoga/exercise we see at gyms and in popular life are occult?

[fakename]

Do you think that the yoga/exercise we see at gyms and in popular life are occult?

That is, do you think that the exercises exhibited on tv, and in daily life in general constitute occult practices?

And come to think of it, do you think that shows like supernatural, etc. constitute it?

 

[Rosella]

Stretching, bending, flexing, twirling, twisting, etc, are not occult practices unto themselves, whether from Yoga, Tai Chi, Feldenkrais or whatever. You are doing exercise.

However, many people do these routines with some “spiritual” intent, incorporating chant, thought patterns, breath work that can induce an altered state of consciousness, foreign words or sounds that have specific meanings to other religions (“om”), etc. In that case it is still not necessarily definitely occult, but could be, depending on the intent combined with the practice.

Usually places that give lessons in Yoga or other “spiritual” practices do have some belief, although at times they are confused themselves, and some commitment to the religion (Buddhism, etc). Often there is a Buddha, QuanYin, or other figurine in the exercise room.

Still is that “occult”? It’s not invoking the devil, but it sure isn’t promoting Christianity either. Some, like Tantra or Kundalini, can be very unsettling and more dangerous that generic Yoga. After all what is the original purpose and origin of this practice? It is not just to get in shape, therefore you must examine the origin to see if it could be dangerous.

 

[Catholic90]

Do you think that the yoga/exercise we see at gyms and in popular life are occult?

That is, do you think that the exercises exhibited on tv, and in daily life in general constitute occult practices?

And come to think of it, do you think that shows like supernatural, etc. constitute it?

Nope.

 

[Blossoming]

Do you think that the yoga/exercise we see at gyms and in popular life are occult?

That is, do you think that the exercises exhibited on tv, and in daily life in general constitute occult practices?

And come to think of it, do you think that shows like supernatural, etc. constitute it?

No, yoga is not satanic, pagan or evil.

It’s good exercise and God tells us to take care of our bodies because they are temples of God. Keeping yourself in good health is good, not bad. You are showing gratitude and appreciation of the body God chose for you to worship Him and spread His word.

 

[twoangels]

I never thought it was till I went to Franciscan University and heard people insisting that Yoga and the like were dangerous. I also heard people on Catholic radio stations claim these things to be dangerous. There were a lot of stories by people who left the occult feeling they had come in contact with the devil and survived.

My opinion is now that these individuals who proclaim these “stay away from it. Its evil” ideas are superstitious. Often they’ve got really weird interpretations of the bible to support it and see angels in everyday mundane stuff that was probably just a helpful neighbor.

I don’t think Buddhists are devil worshippers or contacting evil spirits. I think what we need to do is understand what Buddhism is and what Catholicism is. Heresy has a tendency to slip in because we don’t understand our faith. We have a tendency to make a hodge podge faith where we adopt elements of different faiths without comprehending that we are denying basic Christian Truths. Yoga should not be a part of our worship, but for exercise I think its fine. I wouldn’t even say clear your mind and relaxing is dangerous. Buddhism doesn’t have gods or goddesses. It is panetheistic and thus it delves into the self to discover the divine which is considers you to be a part of. It would make sense therefore for relaxation techniques to bring about mental states that people could spiritualize. The same is true for, sorry to say it, but the supposed charismatic renewal and the experience of speaking in tongues and what not. A lot of people want to see something miraculous, but there is something telling when a gift is only experienced when you’re involved in something like a Christian pep rally.

 

[Contarini]

I don’t think Buddhists are devil worshippers or contacting evil spirits. I think what we need to do is understand what Buddhism is and what Catholicism is. Heresy has a tendency to slip in because we don’t understand our faith. We have a tendency to make a hodge podge faith where we adopt elements of different faiths without comprehending that we are denying basic Christian Truths. Yoga should not be a part of our worship, but for exercise I think its fine. I wouldn’t even say clear your mind and relaxing is dangerous. Buddhism doesn’t have gods or goddesses. It is panetheistic and thus it delves into the self to discover the divine which is considers you to be a part of.

I agree with your basic argument, but your description of “Buddhism” is actually an amalgam of Hinduism and Buddhism and doesn’t really apply to either.

Hinduism does have gods and goddesses. In fact, the author of the original Yoga Sutras, Patanjali, is thought to be an incarnation of the divine serpent on which Vishnu rests. I have been in yoga sessions where a chant to Patanjali was sung. I murmured the Jesus Prayer to myself on such occasions, and would probably not a practice of attending sessions where I knew this was going to happen (it happened occasionally–maybe three or four times total–in a period of two or three years in which I was attending yoga classes about once a week).

In spite of the serpent imagery, I don’t think that Hinduism is devil worship, and the invocation to Patanjali was arguably dulia not latria. But of course, that distinction doesn’t make much sense in Hinduism, in which any saint is liable to be seen as a divine incarnation.

Buddhists do believe in gods and goddesses, though they don’t believe they can grant salvation (they are closer, perhaps, to what we think of as angels, or perhaps just powerful alien beings). Some forms of Mahayana/Vajrayana Buddhism do have what look very much like deities in the form of Buddhas/Bodhisattvas, though. Theravada Buddhism is definitely not panentheistic. Hinduism is, and arguably Mahayana Buddhism is with its idea of “Buddha nature,” though the question is ocmplicated.

Edwin

 

[1inICXC]

No, yoga is not satanic, pagan or evil.

It’s good exercise and God tells us to take care of our bodies because they are temples of God. Keeping yourself in good health is good, not bad. You are showing gratitude and appreciation of the body God chose for you to worship Him and spread His word.

Are you sure about this? Exorists have been speaking out againat the occultism in yoga, tai chi and the rest. What spiritual state are you enduced in and how about the people teaching it? I’dnrather not plsy with fire. Aerobics and regular work outs are just fine!

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

Are you sure about this? Exorists have been speaking out againat the occultism in yoga, tai chi and the rest. What spiritual state are you enduced in and how about the people teaching it? I’dnrather not plsy with fire. Aerobics and regular work outs are just fine!

Exorcists aren’t infallible and from my experience on this site, being one or even just referencing one is far more likely to commit the fallacy of appealing to authority than backing up one’s argument.

If there was something inherently demonic about certain body stances then either me or some of my other siblings would be possessed by now granted that we mimic Tai Chi movements by pretending to be Waterbenders for the lulz.

 

[manualman]

As is often the case, defining words clearly helps tremendously in resolving arguments. Yoga, as originally defined, is NOT merely stretching and relaxing. It is an outgrowth of a spiritual worldview incompatible with catholicism.

Stretch all you want. Use relaxation techniques all you want in conjunction with stretching. But if you don’t buy into the myticism of the Eastern religious roots of Yoga, don’t call it Yoga.

And if you DO believe in the supernatural elements of Yoga, please go and review the first commandment.

 

[RPRPsych]

As is often the case, defining words clearly helps tremendously in resolving arguments. Yoga, as originally defined, is NOT merely stretching and relaxing. It is an outgrowth of a spiritual worldview incompatible with catholicism.

Stretch all you want. Use relaxation techniques all you want in conjunction with stretching. But if you don’t buy into the myticism of the Eastern religious roots of Yoga, don’t call it Yoga.

And if you DO believe in the supernatural elements of Yoga, please go and review the first commandment.

Very well said. The word “yoga” (which is cognate with the English “yoke”, strangely enough), essentially means union, and broadly refers to an ancient Indian system of philosophy whose aim is to achieve a state of “one-ness” with “God”. “Hatha yoga” (and certain other variants) are physical disciplines, but their philosophical goal is the same. Some of these, such as “Sudharshan Kriya Yoga”, have a cult-like following and have been marketed rather aggressively in some of the places I’ve been to.

That sounds harmless enough, until you remember that the concept of “God” and the “religion” or philosophy being considered here is absolutely nothing like what the Church, or the Bible, teaches.

I’ve been reviewing literature in this field for some time (I work in the medical field, and am periodically asked about the health benefits of yoga, etc.), and am pretty much convinced that ordinary exercise - which can be bending, stretching, running, walking, gymnastics or any colour you like - is just as physically and psychologically beneficial as any form of pseudo-philosophical “union”.

If anyone were to ask me, I’d say “Exercise alone is good enough, without any heterodox baggage attached. Otherwise, you may just find yourself on a slippery slope.”

 

[jmjconder]

Do you think that the yoga/exercise we see at gyms and in popular life are occult?

That is, do you think that the exercises exhibited on tv, and in daily life in general constitute occult practices?

And come to think of it, do you think that shows like supernatural, etc. constitute it?

**For me the main clue it what is the title. Yoga (and other titles) is a philosophy and a way of seeing how one relates to the divine.

If I wanted a class that includes stetching and relaxation - I would not** look to any class that names itself with an eastern thought practice.

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

Very well said. The word “yoga” (which is cognate with the English “yoke”, strangely enough), essentially means union, and broadly refers to an ancient Indian system of philosophy whose aim is to achieve a state of “one-ness” with “God”.

As an English Major, I hate to break this to you but the original meaning of a word does not make it THE universal meaning of said word. A surprising example would be the derogatory word for homosexuals which was originally used to describe a bunch of kindle.

A person defining the word ‘yoga’ as the original Hindu practice hoohah is no more playing with semantics than someone defining ‘yoga’ as the common understanding today that is bending your body like an Indian pretzel.

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

I would not look to any class that names itself with an eastern thought practice.

Best tell kids to stay away from Kung Fu then because the origins of that word have Eastern philosophical ties as well.

 

[RPRPsych]

As an English Major, I hate to break this to you but the original meaning of a word does not make it THE universal meaning of said word. A surprising example would be the derogatory word for homosexuals which was originally used to describe a bunch of kindle.

A good point, and I agree that the meaning of a word can change over time.

But in general, when I see yoga being used - both here in India and in the West - it’s not just a matter of gymnastics or contortions, but a system of beliefs (though nebulously defined at times) attached to it as well. That’s what makes me a bit wary of the practice.

If the exercise is all there is to it, then there’s not much point in calling it “yoga” - might as well call it exercise and be done with it.

 

[Blossoming]

Are you sure about this? Exorists have been speaking out againat the occultism in yoga, tai chi and the rest. What spiritual state are you enduced in and how about the people teaching it? I’dnrather not plsy with fire. Aerobics and regular work outs are just fine!

I’m quite sure.

If this subject is important to you because you wish to take up yoga as a practicing Catholic, feel free to ask your priest. Then you will have the official answer, not some posts by anonymous strangers. You can even “ask an Apologist” here.

If it is not important to you because you have no desire to practice this form of exercise, then you might wish to ask yourself what is the driving motive behind that. Is it to judge others that keep themselves in shape out of anger or depression? To make excuses not to take care of your own temple? Is it a form of OCD/scrupulosity?

Any person can make choices that suit themselves, sinful or not, and we do that all the time anyway. And you certainly have a right to do yoga, not to do yoga, to believe what you want about it and even to post opinions on it publicly for dubious reasons.

This does not mean other people have to take your views over that of official doctrine or their own good judgement.

I suggest that with your opinion on yoga, clearly it’s not the exercise for you.

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

If the exercise is all there is to it, then there’s not much point in calling it “yoga” - might as well call it exercise and be done with it.

Sorry but this is a naive and simplistic line of reasoning. If we were to go along this, you’ll have to rid yourself of terms such as Savate and Muay Thai and simply just call it all kick-boxing. Even without the spiritual and religious aspects, Yoga is its own unique form of exercise.

 

[manualman]

Sorry but this is a naive and simplistic line of reasoning. If we were to go along this, you’ll have to rid yourself of terms such as Savate and Muay Thai and simply just call it all kick-boxing. Even without the spiritual and religious aspects, Yoga is its own unique form of exercise.

No it isn’t. Yoga is a spiritual/physical union born of an eastern religion utterly different than catholicism. Taking its physical excercise forms and severing out the eastern religious content and still calling it Yoga is both dishonest and disrespectful to those from that eastern religious tradition.

Most catholics I know would get cranked if some crackpot started offering “rosary” course where the rosary beads were used, but new age meditations were substituted for the prayers and christian meditations. That would be the same thing as stripping Yoga down to merely excercise, but still insisting on calling it Yoga.

It’s inaccurate, its disrespectful and it’s arrogant to presume the right and authority to redefine words that have meaning to other people.

 

[Ahimsa]

No it isn’t. Yoga is a spiritual/physical union born of an eastern religion utterly different than catholicism.

The Eastern religions are not “utterly” different from Catholicism; if they were, they would have no element of Truth in them whatsoever. According to Nostra Aetate, the Eastern religions do have elements of Truth in them:
The Catholic Church rejects nothing that is true and holy in these religions. She regards with sincere reverence those ways of conduct and of life, those precepts and teachings which, though differing in many aspects from the ones she holds and sets forth, nonetheless often reflect a ray of that Truth which enlightens all men.

 

[manualman]

The document you cite refers to the instruction to christians to discern what is good and reject only that which is evil and/or erroneous. As usual since Vatican II, the focus is heavily on identifying that which is good, possibly since the predominating focus prior to then was on weeding out the error. The true catholic understanding, is to comprehend the entirely of catholic teaching, not merely select favored documents to bolster one’s favored notions.

Where eastern religions instruct their believers to turn away from selfishness and towards charity and humility, it is true we have no quarrel or disagreement. But where eastern religions promise an ability for the mind to supernaturally manipulate matter, catholics MUST properly identify this as a violation of the first commandment (He’s God, we’re not) and reject it.

While there IS much that is good and virtuous in the eastern religions, there are also very dangerous ideas. One of THE most dangerous (IMO) is the tendency in many of them to attempt to envelope other faiths and paper over differences so that people don’t notice. It simply isn’t reconcilable to believe in the death/resurrection revelation of christianity and the reincarnation of many eastern faiths. It isn’t reconcilable to grant that God is the only source of supernatural power and attempt to use one’s mind to alter the physical world. God is either a personal being or he isn’t. And so on.

My apologies if my words sounded like I was claiming that there was utterly nothing of virtue or esteeem present in eastern faiths. My intent was to point out that there are fundamental differences that must be recognized.

 

[Ahimsa]

But where eastern religions promise an ability for the mind to supernaturally manipulate matter, catholics MUST properly identify this as a violation of the first commandment (He’s God, we’re not) and reject it.

Where do Eastern religions make this promise?

It simply isn’t reconcilable to believe in the death/resurrection revelation of christianity and the reincarnation of many eastern faiths.

That’s funny. Hasidic Jews have managed to incorporate both reincarnation and resurrection into their theology.