Do YOU think witchcraft should be made illegal?

[Julianna]

Excuse me?!?!
But where are you getting the view that I am an extremist?

Karin…jiminy crickets…why do you even care what I think? I’m an anonymous poster on a Catholic forum who has absolutely nothing to do with your life and how you live it. You clearly follow the letter of the law. Where did I come to that conclusion…reading your posts, because that is all I know of you. But then again, isn’t that all we really know of anyone on this forum? I find no problem with your views…they are yours. Most hard core folks on here think I am a relativist and a feminist. Does that shake me or my faith? Not a bit. Nor should anything I post cause you stress. Can we leave it at that? All this rigamarole is not worth a confession, is it?

 

[Karin]

Karin…jiminy crickets…why do you even care what I think? I’m an anonymous poster on a Catholic forum who has absolutely nothing to do with your life and how you live it. You clearly follow the letter of the law. Where did I come to that conclusion…reading your posts, because that is all I know of you. But then again, isn’t that all we really know of anyone on this forum? I find no problem with your views…they are yours. Most hard core folks on here think I am a relativist and a feminist. Does that shake me or my faith? Not a bit. Nor should anything I post cause you stress. Can we leave it at that? All this rigamarole is not worth a confession, is it?

Well I guess I am an extremist if I think homosexual unions should not be allowed, abortion is murder, marriage is a sacrament, etc.
thanks juilanne…I totally agree…I am an extremist

 

[catolic]

I thought that this was the 21st Century!

 

[Other_Eric]

I challenge you to answer these three simple questions:

1. What punishment / rehabilitation do you propose for those found guilty of practicing witchcraft.
2. What does the State do with a person who refuses to renounce their Faith in witchcraft and continues to practice it?
3. Would one be guilty of an offense if they were found to have practiced witchcraft alone in their home?

The original question was one of philosophy. The OP asked whether or not witchcraft ought to be rendered illegal. I answered in the affirmative or, at least, that I would have no problem with it being made illegal. You realize, of course, that you are asking me to go beyond this original question and articulate policy. I’ll be the first to admit that I am not the best person to go to for constructing such things but I’ll indulge you this once by giving it a stab. I hasten to add that even if my particular policy proposals are problematic, as I’m sure they might very well be, that this does not change the truth of my answer to the first question, that witchcraft ought to be rendered illegal.

It seems to me that those who find witchcraft alluring find it so because it offers an alternative to Judeo-Christian morality and because it contains the promise of power over the elements and other people. Thus, it has a certain glamour that such individuals find appealing. The aim of any law should be to burst this illusion and make the practice of witchcraft an unbearable, socially repugnant thing.

I would propose rendering the practice of witchcraft, either alone or as part of a group, a felony. This would make the first-time offender eligible for public supervision by the state and remove whatever cancerous influence he may exert over the government through the voting booth. For the second-time offender, it seems to me a prison term of no less than five years might be appropriate. This would give to such an obstinate individual the kind of increased supervision needed to overcome his delusion. After the third offense, we really need to begin to talk of life in prison. Subsequent offenses while locked up can be handled by whatever disciplinary system the prison already has in place.

As for the question of rehabilitation, obviously psychologists and psychiatrists will need to be involved. The individual should also be provided with an ecumenical list of approved ministers or priests who can monitor his spiritual development. I would think that the selection of someone form that list ought to be mandatory. Freedom of religion is not the same as freedom from religion and a person who has already dabbled in witchcraft should not be permitted to go on to another error such as atheism.

Now, as I have admitted, I’m sure there are any number of holes that could be poked into this proposal of mine. Tragically, the construction of sound policy is not always one of my stronger gifts. Still, before we have that discussion, we must settle on the OP’s first question about whether to make it illegal in the first place. Once that decision has been made, how to go about implementing and enforcing it should be one best left to the politicians.

I trust I have answered your questions satisfactorily but if I have not, I would ask you to re-read this post. I’m sure there’s an endless number of follow-up questions that you might be able to come up with but, quite frankly, that discussion bores me.

 

[Mirdath]

Freedom of religion is not the same as freedom from religion and a person who has already dabbled in witchcraft should not be permitted to go on to another error such as atheism.

Did you just propose the illegalization of atheism as well as paganism? Why not throw out democracy as a whole, then, and declare this country the United Theocracy of America?

 

[Oneiron]

The original question was one of philosophy. The OP asked whether or not witchcraft ought to be rendered illegal. I answered in the affirmative or, at least, that I would have no problem with it being made illegal. You realize, of course, that you are asking me to go beyond this original question and articulate policy. I’ll be the first to admit that I am not the best person to go to for constructing such things but I’ll indulge you this once by giving it a stab. I hasten to add that even if my particular policy proposals are problematic, as I’m sure they might very well be, that this does not change the truth of my answer to the first question, that witchcraft ought to be rendered illegal.

It seems to me that those who find witchcraft alluring find it so because it offers an alternative to Judeo-Christian morality and because it contains the promise of power over the elements and other people. Thus, it has a certain glamour that such individuals find appealing. The aim of any law should be to burst this illusion and make the practice of witchcraft an unbearable, socially repugnant thing.

I would propose rendering the practice of witchcraft, either alone or as part of a group, a felony. This would make the first-time offender eligible for public supervision by the state and remove whatever cancerous influence he may exert over the government through the voting booth. For the second-time offender, it seems to me a prison term of no less than five years might be appropriate. This would give to such an obstinate individual the kind of increased supervision needed to overcome his delusion. After the third offense, we really need to begin to talk of life in prison. Subsequent offenses while locked up can be handled by whatever disciplinary system the prison already has in place.

As for the question of rehabilitation, obviously psychologists and psychiatrists will need to be involved. The individual should also be provided with an ecumenical list of approved ministers or priests who can monitor his spiritual development. I would think that the selection of someone form that list ought to be mandatory. Freedom of religion is not the same as freedom from religion and a person who has already dabbled in witchcraft should not be permitted to go on to another error such as atheism.

Now, as I have admitted, I’m sure there are any number of holes that could be poked into this proposal of mine. Tragically, the construction of sound policy is not always one of my stronger gifts. Still, before we have that discussion, we must settle on the OP’s first question about whether to make it illegal in the first place. Once that decision has been made, how to go about implementing and enforcing it should be one best left to the politicians.

I trust I have answered your questions satisfactorily but if I have not, I would ask you to re-read this post. I’m sure there’s an endless number of follow-up questions that you might be able to come up with but, quite frankly, that discussion bores me.

Do you even know anything about wicca (most common pagan religion simply reffered to as witchcraft ni my opinion) ? Do you know anything at all?!
To suggest that people convert because they want power is completely absurd.

 

[Oneiron]

Did you just propose the illegalization of atheism as well as paganism? Why not throw out democracy as a whole, then, and declare this country the United Theocracy of America?

All hail the new Pope of Americanism, Dubya the First!!!

 

[Julianna]

Other Eric…

A felony…prison? Ever been to Russia? Remember what happened to the Christians in Rome? Do the Pilgrims ring any bells for you?

With your theory, how do you think things are working out in the Middle East? Not good, huh?

 

[valient_Lucy]

As Christians, do you feel witchcraft should be made a punishable crime again? Standpoints from other religions appreciated to.
For the record, I don’t think it should be, 'cos if it was, I would have been jailed A LONG time ago.

No I don’t think so.

 

[RomanCrusader]

Did you just propose the illegalization of atheism as well as paganism? Why not throw out democracy as a whole, then, and declare this country the United Theocracy of America?

Atheism is the most destructive vice on this planet today. It is the cause of the majority of the worlds problems (direct cause is Satan, atheism is a tool of Satan). I think outlawing atheism would be a great idea, for the good of immortal souls.

 

[setitstraight]

Atheism is the most destructive vice on this planet today. It is the cause of the majority of the worlds problems (direct cause is Satan, atheism is a tool of Satan). I think outlawing atheism would be a great idea, for the good of immortal souls.

You cannot outlaw a system of belief that exists within the mind.

How can you call a system of belief a vice? Alcoholism is a far greater problem than Atheism. How is Atheism even a problem…we have free will to make the decision to believe whatever we want to believe.

I hope your comments are nothing more than hyperbole.

 

[RomanCrusader]

You cannot outlaw a system of belief that exists within the mind.

How can you call a system of belief a vice? Alcoholism is a far greater problem than Atheism. How is Atheism even a problem…we have free will to make the decision to believe whatever we want to believe.

I hope your comments are nothing more than hyperbole.

Alcholism is very loathsome, true. However athiesm is in a way behind alcoholism. Since atheism has no absolute morals and rather encourages hedonism, alcoholism would increase in an atheist society.

Atheism is fully or partially responsible for most problems facing the world today, including communism, abortion, euthanasia, crime, homosexuality, drugs, elitism, hedonism, abuse, anarchy, despair, and DANGER TO SOULS!

 

[setitstraight]

Alcholism is very loathsome, true.

 

[Mirdath]

Atheism is the most destructive vice on this planet today. It is the cause of the majority of the worlds problems (direct cause is Satan, atheism is a tool of Satan). I think outlawing atheism would be a great idea, for the good of immortal souls.

What immortal souls?

Going back a little bit, it’s a belief not a vice; it hasn’t caused any more problems than religion and certainly not alcoholism; atheists don’t even believe in Satan; and outlawing a system of belief completely violates the Establishment Clause.

Alcholism is very loathsome, true. However athiesm is in a way behind alcoholism. Since atheism has no absolute morals and rather encourages hedonism, alcoholism would increase in an atheist society.

Just wait till you or someone you love gets surgery and comes out addicted to painkillers. Addiction is not loathsome, it’s unfortunate and very painful.

Atheism has no absolute source of morals. People can generally agree murder, theft, and rape are wrong and bad for society and should be punished. It’s called social contract theory; check out John Locke. Additionally many atheists have their own moral structures and ethical senses; and everyone has a conscience, or as Freud (an atheist) put it superego.

Atheism is fully or partially responsible for most problems facing the world today, including communism, abortion, euthanasia, crime, homosexuality, drugs, elitism, hedonism, abuse, anarchy, despair, and DANGER TO SOULS!

Problems and causes (though really everyone’s partially responsible):
Communism: caused by oppression of the working class (who were not universally religious or atheist) by the aristocracy (who were not universally religious or atheist). And it’s also mostly gone, there are Wal-Marts in China now.

Abortion: caused by people (who are not universally religious or atheist) having babies when they don’t want them or cannot care for or bear them to term. I believe I’ve seen a statistic quoted here that 30% of abortions are performed on Christian women.

Euthanasia: I actually support this.

Crime: has been with us as long as we’ve existed. Considering we’re not living in the world of The Warriors I’d have to say the advent of atheism hasn’t caused it to get out of hand.

Homosexuality: has also been with us as long as we’ve existed and I don’t see it as a problem either.

Drugs: are fun. Don’t you drink wine? Or do you refuse the cup at communion? I’d leave it at that but I have to say here that they have also been with us as long as we have existed and while certain users may be non-theists many are religious like the Rastafarians, the Hashishin, and whichever Native American tribes (I forget the names) that uses peyote in their rituals.

Elitism: are you even listening to yourself? hahahahaha

Hedonism: also fun. By dictionary definition, no less.

Abuse: of whom? Children? Neither religious nor irreligious. Of women? Again not necessarily affiliated, though many argue that various religions have repressed women for millennia.

Anarchy: No connection, back this one up please?

Despair: Many atheists and non-theists I know are happier than the religious people I know.

DANGER TO SOULS: Again, what souls?

 

[Mirdath]

How are Atheists, a tiny percentage of the worlds population able to wield such power as to influence everything under the sun. They must be a powerful group, and they don’t even believe in God.

Non-theists are the new Elders of Zion

Romancrusader…I have to be blunt, if you mean what you write…you have a frightening view of the world.

uhyeah…

 

[kellie]

I saw this on a bumper sticker…and laughed…

despite what others think, and I am a Catholic too

 

[kellie]

Atheism is fully or partially responsible for most problems facing the world today, including communism, abortion, euthanasia, crime, homosexuality, drugs, elitism, hedonism, abuse, anarchy, despair, and DANGER TO SOULS!

Ummm, I know many people who have partaken in the above sins, and they have been followers of Christ.

No atheist influenced them.

Atheists did not invent these sins, and that is why they simply are, sins.

You honestly think if the world had never had atheism in it, we would be free of these things?

 

[Bruised_Reed]

To answer the OP’s question: No, I don’t.

 

[LilyM]

Atheism is the most destructive vice on this planet today. It is the cause of the majority of the worlds problems (direct cause is Satan, atheism is a tool of Satan). I think outlawing atheism would be a great idea, for the good of immortal souls.

Roman Crusader - it is literally impossible to outlaw a belief system or mandate a series of beliefs - as the Romans found to their cost when they tried to outlaw Christianity and mandate worship of the Emperors and Roman Gods.

The best you can do is force someone, against their will, to attend church and perhaps receive sacraments. If they do so without believing, it will in no way save their immortal souls. And it won’t make them any more likely to believe at some point in the future either.

Any more than forcing someone to sit in school saves them from ignorance if they don’t believe that education has any value. And it doesn’t make them more likely to want to learn at some future point either.

 

[Kristopher]

I gave some thought to comments posted by others about making witchcraft illegal on the basis of it being destabilizing to society, and I think that most anything and everything anyone of any religion, philosophy, or belief system that is destructive, or destabilizing to society is already illegal: murder, rape, various dosages and types of drugs, theft, slander, libel, treason, etc. at least, within the US.

The whole approach of making some philosophy, or some religion illegal is absurd: just as it is absurd to make illegal a form of government, such as Communism: to the extent a person could make Communism illegal; would be a precedent of essentially making a republican government illegal–a republican government being guaranteed by our US Constitution, which in turn is a specific characteristic of a democracy; a democracy being a government run by a population greater than one or two persons of voting age, at the least, or not.

It seems what is a specific criminal behavior should be made illegal, an actual act against self, against others, should be illegal–things more objectifiable.