Documentation for Baptisms

[tamccrackine]

I am about to have my fourth child. We are military so we are in a military parish. I have never needed “proof” that who I’ve chosen for Godparents actually meet the requirements. The person I’ve chosen for the Godmother for this child is civilian and her priest has put her through the wringer. He demands parents start their Baptismal preparation 6 months before the birth of the child. In true military fashion, we are doing the Baptism within four weeks of birth due to TDY’s and classes for my DH. He has told her he refuses to send documentation of her standing because I haven’t planned this Baptism out according to his standards (I’m NOT in his parish).

Anyway… my parish does NOT require proof so I really don’t care what his standard is, yet now this civilian priest is demanding that I send information to him regarding my child and my priest for “their” records. I have a problem with having my children’s information just floating around out there, especially for records that I have no control over. This type of information has never been needed for any of my other Godparents for my other children.

I don’t feel that he does, but does a priest actually have the authority to do demand this information and can he withhold my SIL from being a Godmother if I choose to not provide it?

TIA!!

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

I am about to have my fourth child. We are military so we are in a military parish. I have never needed “proof” that who I’ve chosen for Godparents actually meet the requirements. The person I’ve chosen for the Godmother for this child is civilian and her priest has put her through the wringer. He demands parents start their Baptismal preparation 6 months before the birth of the child. In true military fashion, we are doing the Baptism within four weeks of birth due to TDY’s and classes for my DH. He has told her he refuses to send documentation of her standing because I haven’t planned this Baptism out according to his standards (I’m NOT in his parish).

Anyway… my parish does NOT require proof so I really don’t care what his standard is, yet now this civilian priest is demanding that I send information to him regarding my child and my priest for “their” records. I have a problem with having my children’s information just floating around out there, especially for records that I have no control over. This type of information has never been needed for any of my other Godparents for my other children.

I don’t feel that he does, but does a priest actually have the authority to do demand this information and can he withhold my SIL from being a Godmother if I choose to not provide it?

TIA!!

You need to speak with your pastor. Give him the information on the Godparent and their parish. Let him contact the other parish. You have tried your best to ask the Godparent to supply the needed letter.

 

[tamccrackine]

But I don’t need a letter. That’s the thing. I don’t need it but now this civilian priest is demanding that ***I ***provide information for his parish’s records and I’m not a member of that parish and I do not like my children’s information floating around out there. I just don’t understand why he’d need the information. I just want to know if he has the authority to demand this information and does he have the authority to restrict my SIL from being a Godmother if I choose to not provide it.

My SIL was very relieved when I told her I don’t need the documentation because it was a weight lifted off her shoulders. The second she asked her priest for the letter, he started harassing her as to why I hadn’t thought of this before and why am I moving so fast for a Baptism, etc. Military parishes work differently and don’t require long drawn out plans for Baptisms. Especially when the parents are active members of the parish, have more than one Baptized child and I used to teach the Pre-Baptism class at one of my previous parishes.

I hope I’m not confusing anyone about this question.

ETA: Thanks for the response though. I have already contacted my priest to ask him if what the civilian priest is asking is necessary. I’m just waiting on his response and figured I’d ask here too. Maybe someone else has experienced this as well.

 

[IrishAm]

Wow. I can’t even begin to express how appalled . . . angry . . . FURIOUS . . . positively ENRAGED . . . I am. (Working up a good head of steam here . . ) Our military families are ready to endure hardship, separation and even the injury and death of their loved ones and someone has the audacity to question the judgment of a chaplain in shepherding his military flock.

I pray regularly for those priests who guide our military men and women – especially for those who offered anointing of the sick on multiple occasions to my Marine son-in-law (who not only LIVED, but HEALED and THRIVED!); who consoled my Marine daughter after she survived the Pentagon attack on 9/11; baptized my grandbabies overseas (Air Force son-in-law; Godparents were in abstentia); and are now prepared to guide that AF son-in-law into our faith.

If I were your SIL, I’d wonder what the heck kind of records her parish was keeping. “Civilian parishes” don’t typically request that kind of information either. Very, very strange.

End of rant.

 

[SuscipeMeDomine]

Does your sister-in-law’s priest understand that she’s to be the godmother of a baby being baptized elsewhere?

I can’t imagine a parish trying to keep records for every baby baptized anywhere in the world where their parishioners are the godparents. He must have misunderstood something because that makes no sense at all.

 

[Cathryn]

Be sure to let us know how this turns out. It sounds like a misunderstanding. I wouldn’t want my child’s personal information floating around either. There also is no need for it.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

But I don’t need a letter. That’s the thing. I don’t need it but now this civilian priest is demanding that ***I ***provide information for his parish’s records and I’m not a member of that parish and I do not like my children’s information floating around out there. I just don’t understand why he’d need the information. I just want to know if he has the authority to demand this information and does he have the authority to restrict my SIL from being a Godmother if I choose to not provide it.

My SIL was very relieved when I told her I don’t need the documentation because it was a weight lifted off her shoulders. The second she asked her priest for the letter, he started harassing her as to why I hadn’t thought of this before and why am I moving so fast for a Baptism, etc. Military parishes work differently and don’t require long drawn out plans for Baptisms. Especially when the parents are active members of the parish, have more than one Baptized child and I used to teach the Pre-Baptism class at one of my previous parishes.

I hope I’m not confusing anyone about this question.

ETA: Thanks for the response though. I have already contacted my priest to ask him if what the civilian priest is asking is necessary. I’m just waiting on his response and figured I’d ask here too. Maybe someone else has experienced this as well.

You need to speak with your pastor and let him handle it. he is the one who is responsible for your childs Baptism. He is the one who determins if the Godparent is qualified. He may do so on his own or may choose to request information from the Godparents parish, that is up to him. The priest at the Godparents parish has no authority over anything related to your childs Baptism. Your Pastor does however.

 

[tamccrackine]

You need to speak with your pastor and let him handle it. he is the one who is responsible for your childs Baptism. He is the one who determins if the Godparent is qualified. He may do so on his own or may choose to request information from the Godparents parish, that is up to him. The priest at the Godparents parish has no authority over anything related to your childs Baptism. Your Pastor does however.

My priest isn’t the one that determines if a Godparent is qualified. I think it’s pretty simple to read what Canon law states as to what determines a “qualified Godparent”. I’ve taught the class enough to know . Some parishes require a letter from the Godparents parish to say “yep, they’re in good standing.” while others do not. That’s not mandatory for Baptism. MY parish doesn’t require such a letter from the Godparent’s parish.

I have contacted my priest and informed him of what’s going on. He agrees that the civilian priest has no jurisdiction to be asking for this information. If the civilian priest will not respect my firm “No, you’re not getting the information.” then my priest will step in. I’m hoping, though, that her priest will just respect my stance on it and leave it alone.

I have asked my SIL why her priest is asking for this though and I’ll be interested to find out why he wants it.

 

[SMHW]

Did your SIL tell her priest that she was to be a Godparent? I am wondering how he even knows if your parish doesn’t require some form of validation that she is a Catholic in good standing?

Or does your parish perhaps request a verbal verification?

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

My priest isn’t the one that determines if a Godparent is qualified. I think it’s pretty simple to read what Canon law states as to what determines a “qualified Godparent”. I’ve taught the class enough to know . Some parishes require a letter from the Godparents parish to say “yep, they’re in good standing.” while others do not. That’s not mandatory for Baptism. MY parish doesn’t require such a letter from the Godparent’s parish.

I have contacted my priest and informed him of what’s going on. He agrees that the civilian priest has no jurisdiction to be asking for this information. If the civilian priest will not respect my firm “No, you’re not getting the information.” then my priest will step in. I’m hoping, though, that her priest will just respect my stance on it and leave it alone.

I have asked my SIL why her priest is asking for this though and I’ll be interested to find out why he wants it.

Maybe I’m not reading this correctly. I thought that your SIL is the Godparent to your child and your SIL’s priest is refusing to provide her with a qualifying letter to be the Godparent.

You said that your pastor isn’t the one who determines if the Godparent is qualified. He is if your child is being Baptized in his parish.

 

[IrishAm]

tam, I know I am high-jacking the thread a bit here, but please remember we do not have “military priests” and “civilian priests” – we just have priests. I agree I could think of a number of adjective about your SIL’s parish priest – all of which would probably be deleted by the moderators of the board – but “civilian” isn’t one of them.

When you think of it – almost all our ordained shepherds are “military,” they are fighting for our souls.

Back to the topic at hand . . .

 

[tamccrackine]

Did your SIL tell her priest that she was to be a Godparent? I am wondering how he even knows if your parish doesn’t require some form of validation that she is a Catholic in good standing?

Or does your parish perhaps request a verbal verification?

Yes, she told her priest she was going to be the Godmother and that’s when she asked for the validation letter. When he started giving her hell about it (why I didn’t ask for it sooner, etc) (and before anyone even asks… we’re military, found out we were pregnant on a cross country move and haven’t been in our current location more than six months) she asked me for information. I told her I’d confirm if we needed it or not, but I was pretty certain we didn’t need it. I did confirm we didn’t need it, she was relieved, then I got an email from her asking for information for her priest for HIS records. I did not, nor do not, feel comfortable with him having that type of information as I’m not in his parish and I just wanted to know if he had a right to ask for that. My parish does not require validation of Godparents in good standing beyond a verbal verification.

Maybe I’m not reading this correctly. I thought that your SIL is the Godparent to your child and your SIL’s priest is refusing to provide her with a qualifying letter to be the Godparent.

He’d not refusing to give her a letter. Because it’s not needed, that’s not the problem. The problem is me providing personal information to him for HIS records.

You said that your pastor isn’t the one who determines if the Godparent is qualified. He is if your child is being Baptized in his parish.

Only if he questions my verification. I’ve never had my Godparents verification as to the validity of their good standing questioned by any of my military priests and I’ve had three children Baptized. I’ve yet to meet a priest that would question the parents word when they say “Yes, they’re in good standing” (although I’ve met some parents that would lie to a priest )

tam, I know I am high-jacking the thread a bit here, but please remember we do not have “military priests” and “civilian priests” – we just have priests. I agree I could think of a number of adjective about your SIL’s parish priest – all of which would probably be deleted by the moderators of the board – but “civilian” isn’t one of them.

When you think of it – almost all our ordained shepherds are “military,” they are fighting for our souls.

Back to the topic at hand . . .

Yep, that’s a hi-jack. I’m fully aware of how a priest fights for our souls but there is a huge difference between a military priest and a civilian priest. I don’t use the adjective to denigrate either of their services, I use the adjective to identify what type of parish they have. And trust me… there is a HUGE difference between the two and how they operate.

Thanks to those that answered. I did get an answer from a Canon lawyer this morning that was of most help with directly answering my question. So to that person… again, thank you from the bottom of my heart. I appreciate it!

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Yes, she told her priest she was going to be the Godmother and that’s when she asked for the validation letter. When he started giving her hell about it (why I didn’t ask for it sooner, etc) (and before anyone even asks… we’re military, found out we were pregnant on a cross country move and haven’t been in our current location more than six months) she asked me for information. I told her I’d confirm if we needed it or not, but I was pretty certain we didn’t need it. I did confirm we didn’t need it, she was relieved, then I got an email from her asking for information for her priest for HIS records. I did not, nor do not, feel comfortable with him having that type of information as I’m not in his parish and I just wanted to know if he had a right to ask for that. My parish does not require validation of Godparents in good standing beyond a verbal verification.

He’d not refusing to give her a letter. Because it’s not needed, that’s not the problem. The problem is me providing personal information to him for HIS records.

Only if he questions my verification. I’ve never had my Godparents verification as to the validity of their good standing questioned by any of my military priests and I’ve had three children Baptized. I’ve yet to meet a priest that would question the parents word when they say “Yes, they’re in good standing” (although I’ve met some parents that would lie to a priest )

Yep, that’s a hi-jack. I’m fully aware of how a priest fights for our souls but there is a huge difference between a military priest and a civilian priest. I don’t use the adjective to denigrate either of their services, I use the adjective to identify what type of parish they have. And trust me… there is a HUGE difference between the two and how they operate.

Thanks to those that answered. I did get an answer from a Canon lawyer this morning that was of most help with directly answering my question. So to that person… again, thank you from the bottom of my heart. I appreciate it!

You owe her priest no information about the Baptism. Your Pastor is the only one who needs to record it in his parish records. The Godparents parish does not record any information. Many parishes are now requesting a letter from each Godparents parish. Many people name Godparents today that do not qualify. Many don’t attend Sunday Mass, many are in “second” or “third” Marriages, use ABC, have never been Confirmed, etc. All of which disqualifies them as Godparents.

 

[OutinChgoburbs]

If you have time, seeing how you are still settling into your new home, giving birth, and getting harassed by a civilian priest, you might want to drop an email or letter into the civilian priest’s bishop’s mailbox. I would CC it to Bishop Higgins at the Archdiocese for the Military.

 

[drafdog]

All I can conclude from the original post is that the priest from the off-base parish is laboring under the misapprehension that the couple intends to have the child baptized in his parish. She needs to contact the priest and tell him that she lives in another archdiocese (Military Archdiocese of the US) and is having the baptism done in her home parish.

Another poster wrote that there are not military priests. Nothing could be further from the truth. Catholic priests serving as chaplains in the military services of the US hold ranks as officers in the various services in which they serve. Insofar as they are officers in the service they are military personnel who are priests: military priests.

Matthew