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Good_Daughter
Guest
I am in a discussion with a Mormon on another thread who uses 2 Samuel 12:7-8 as a proof text for God’s approval of polygamy in some cases.
What do you think?
What do you think?
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NotWorthy
Guest
2nd Samuel 12:7-8:
Why does your friend look to God’s word in the Old Testament and not God’s word in the New Testament?
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ROBAUTEN
Guest
Well perhaps God allowed the patriarchs and Israelite kings to have multiple wives, as was the culture of the day, just as God allowed Moses to permit divorce during the time of the Old Covenant. But neither was God’s original design or His perfect will. Neither is therfore permitted since the inauguration of the New Covenant.
God’s revelation about marriage relations is on a trajectory of development. In heaven there will be no marrying or giving in marriage but I’ll bet we will know and love each other more than ever. For the Mormons to go back to what God allowed in the days before he gave his final Word of revelation in sending us His Son, is to go backward and not forward, to regress instead of to progress. Besides, hasn’t the Mormon church reversed itself on this issue and now says that polygamy is not allowed?
God’s revelation about marriage relations is on a trajectory of development. In heaven there will be no marrying or giving in marriage but I’ll bet we will know and love each other more than ever. For the Mormons to go back to what God allowed in the days before he gave his final Word of revelation in sending us His Son, is to go backward and not forward, to regress instead of to progress. Besides, hasn’t the Mormon church reversed itself on this issue and now says that polygamy is not allowed?
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ROBAUTEN
Guest
Well perhaps God allowed the patriarchs and Israelite kings to have multiple wives, as was the culture of the day, just as God allowed Moses to permit divorce during the time of the Old Covenant. But neither was God’s original design or His perfect will. Neither is therfore permitted since the inauguration of the New Covenant.
God’s revelation about marriage relations is on a trajectory of development. In heaven there will be no marrying or giving in marriage but I’ll bet we will know and love each other more than ever. For the Mormons to go back to what God allowed in the days before he gave his final Word of revelation in sending us His Son, is to go backward and not forward, to regress instead of to progress. Besides, hasn’t the Mormon church reversed itself on this issue and now says that polygamy is not allowed?
God’s revelation about marriage relations is on a trajectory of development. In heaven there will be no marrying or giving in marriage but I’ll bet we will know and love each other more than ever. For the Mormons to go back to what God allowed in the days before he gave his final Word of revelation in sending us His Son, is to go backward and not forward, to regress instead of to progress. Besides, hasn’t the Mormon church reversed itself on this issue and now says that polygamy is not allowed?
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Nita
Guest
David was disregarding the following regulation God had previously given through Moses:
Deut.17:15 you may indeed set as king over you him whom the LORD your God will choose. One from among your brethren you shall set as king over you; …17:17 And he shall not multiply wives for himself, lest his heart turn away;
Nita
Deut.17:15 you may indeed set as king over you him whom the LORD your God will choose. One from among your brethren you shall set as king over you; …17:17 And he shall not multiply wives for himself, lest his heart turn away;
Nita
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Fidelis
Guest
Just because something is mentioned in the Bible does not mean that God approves of it. The Bible is much more subtle that that.
Polygamy was something that was widely practiced by the peoples surrounding Israel, whom God warned them against imitating. Vitually everytime a polygamous union is mentioned in the Bible, evil always results, even if it is years later. Thus we see antagonism in the Bible between the sons of Jacob (born of multiple wives), rivalry between David’s sons for their father’s throne, Solomons pagan wives leading him to idolatry, the list goes on and on.
The clear lesson is that polygamy leads to grief, discord, and idolatry.
Polygamy was something that was widely practiced by the peoples surrounding Israel, whom God warned them against imitating. Vitually everytime a polygamous union is mentioned in the Bible, evil always results, even if it is years later. Thus we see antagonism in the Bible between the sons of Jacob (born of multiple wives), rivalry between David’s sons for their father’s throne, Solomons pagan wives leading him to idolatry, the list goes on and on.
The clear lesson is that polygamy leads to grief, discord, and idolatry.
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Good_Daughter
Guest
NotWorthy: Mormons believe that monogamy is God’s standing law but he has authorized exceptions in cases like OT Patriarchs and the early days of the LDS Church. Nothing in the NT will conivnce them polygamy is always despised by God, not even 1 Cor 7:2, “…because of cases of immorality every man should have his own wife, and every woman her own husband.” Mormon thinking here is that Paul’s words were for a specific audience whose problem was divorce, therefore polygamy wasn’t on Paul’s agenda.
ROBAUTEN: Mormons contend that while God merely allowed divorce, he approved polygamy by explicitly giving Saul’s wives to David in 2 Samuel 12. They (Mormons) stopped polygamy long ago, presumably when God stopped “calling” them to the practice.
Nita: I quoted Deut 17:15 to this Mormon. The reply was that multiplying wives was forbidden, but adding was not.
ROBAUTEN: Mormons contend that while God merely allowed divorce, he approved polygamy by explicitly giving Saul’s wives to David in 2 Samuel 12. They (Mormons) stopped polygamy long ago, presumably when God stopped “calling” them to the practice.
Nita: I quoted Deut 17:15 to this Mormon. The reply was that multiplying wives was forbidden, but adding was not.
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Nita
Guest
*Matt 19:4 He answered, “Have you not read that he who made them from the beginning made them male and female, 19:5 and said, For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’? 19:6 So they are no longer two but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let not man put asunder.” *
You might try a discussion around the above passage. When one becomes “one flesh” with a single spouse, how can he/she ever be united to another person also? In what sense could they be still “one flesh”? (eg. of what I’m getting at: would they now be “two fleshes” - or reduced to “1/2 flesh” with each spouse?) Get some discussion going on what “one flesh” would all encompass.
Also, point out (as Pope John Paul II did on a catechesis on this passage) - that Jesus refers to this lifelong union being God’s will “from the beginning” . It is not something He only desired in NT times.
Nita
You might try a discussion around the above passage. When one becomes “one flesh” with a single spouse, how can he/she ever be united to another person also? In what sense could they be still “one flesh”? (eg. of what I’m getting at: would they now be “two fleshes” - or reduced to “1/2 flesh” with each spouse?) Get some discussion going on what “one flesh” would all encompass.
Also, point out (as Pope John Paul II did on a catechesis on this passage) - that Jesus refers to this lifelong union being God’s will “from the beginning” . It is not something He only desired in NT times.
Nita
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ellieone
Guest
I wrote a graduate research paper on this topic and was interviewed on a TV station in Utah. You can see the show here: youtube.com/watch?v=zz8ja04FDTA and message me if you would like a copy of the paper.
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Mintaka
Guest
Jesus says that “In the beginning it was not so,” and that divorce was only permitted by Moses “because of the hardness of their hearts.”
So I think it’s pretty clear that polygamy is also a case of human fear and human hardness of heart going against God’s natural law, which is written on everyone’s heart.
So I think it’s pretty clear that polygamy is also a case of human fear and human hardness of heart going against God’s natural law, which is written on everyone’s heart.
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ericc
Guest
Wives were regarded as property in those days. They can be bought (marriage contract), captured in war, divorced (via writing a bill of divorce and putting it in her hands and sending her out of the house). Is polygamy in the Mormon context similar to that of Biblical times? I think not.
Why would anyone in the right mind want to have multiple sets of in-laws? One is already too many!
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