No, I am not catholic nor do I accept everything the catholic church teaches.
Sola scriptura, at least as defined during the reformation, does not exclude or eliminate the authority of the church, study guides, creeds, teachers, etc. I don’t believe any of the reformers taught anything akin to what I see some catholic apologists trying to sell as sola scriptura which could best be described as the “me and my bible alone under a tree” mentality.
In the passage that this thread is supposed to be dedicated to we find Paul giving Timothy advice. Paul did not say turn to the magesterium or the bishop of Rome. He told Timothy to turn to the scriptures. During a time of crisis we have Paul, under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, advising Timothy to turn to the scriptures, not the magesterium.
Let’s look at our choices. You can accept scripture as the sole infallible rule of faith or you can place your trust in the RCC (magesterium + scripture + tradition (supposedly apostolic)).
Scripture, not tradition, is described as “theopneustos” or God-breathed, i.e. inspired by God. This is the only time this term is used in the Bible. With the scriptures you have something that isn’t just breathed upon by God (such as the apostles) but breathed out by God, or inspired by God.
In general terms, tradition isn’t looked on to favorably throughout the NT. Of course we have 2Thess2:15 but your church with it’s rich history can’t tell anyone what exactly Paul meant by “traditions” in this text.
Your church claims infallibility but that dies the death of a 1,000 qualificiations. None of you are sure what has been defined infallibly and what hasn’t. Doctrine can’t “change” but it can “develop”. Well, your church develops it to such a degree so as to be unrecognizeable from one time period to another.
Your church currently seem to take a very liberal view of “outside the church there is no salvation” but that hasn’t always been the case.
Your church used to be pretty clear that the Mosaic covenant had ended but now it seems your church now teaches that the Jews have a covenant that is salvific.
The point being, your “tradition” seems to change so as to suit the times.
So, in the end, we have two views.
One that believes scripture (which is inspired by God) and scripture alone is the sole infallible rule of faith and the view that somehow the Roman church + scripture + tradition (much of which can’t be traced back to the apostles but is supposed to be apostolic in nature) is what the faith should be based on.
We obviously have come to different conclusions.
There are several non-sequiturs in your post.
“The Magisterium” you are talking about was walking among them, the Apostles and the first Christians. Obviously, Timothy was talking with, listening to, consulting with these good folks of the ‘magisterium’.
I don’t see anything in 2Tim that contradicts the existence of a teaching Magisterium.
BTW, what Scriptures was Paul referring to? Was Timothy carrying his own Bible around?
And, the Bishop of Rome? He was even there yet. And there were plenty of other bishops around to consult.
Listening to some of your fellow Protestant posters on this thread, they seem to be advocating taking the Bible under the tree, and forget this Church that even the Reformers accepted.
You can accept the Scriptures, as infallibly interpreted by the Church Jesus founded, or you can accept millions of private interpretations of Scriptures by individuals. Take your choice.
What do you mean that Tradition changes. Do you read the Scriptures in the same way, with the same meaning as John Calvin? I dare say not!
As far as ‘outside the church there is no salvation’, I think it is being defined in the same way today as it was in 1403 in Unam Sanctam. My knowledge doesn’t go beyond that period, but I am sure there are patristic fathers who held the same. That is why the Church has always insisted on the Evangelism of the whole world.
How do you know the Scriptures were inspired by God. Which books, which parts. Who told you this? Try to respond without circular reasoning.
You got real holes in your arguments. Pick one, and run with it.
Tks. I’d love to hear from you.
Peace
