Does God Give us Babies?

[PaulinVA]

Okay, here’s the question.

We are told that children are a blessing from God.

We are told that we are co-creators of life, together with God.

People on these forums talk about “letting God decide” or “God gave us a child”.

Now, I’m middle aged and have four children, so I know how this works on the physical level. The above comments lead one to think that some believe that the purely physical act of fertilization does not follow the laws of nature. The laws of nature are that if you have sex during the fertile period, and the “swimmers” make contact with the egg and, well, you know.

So, does God interfere with that, intervene in that? Does he mediate that? Does God decide?

I can’t believe that’s true. Now, I know God can do whatever He wants, but what does the Church say about this? It’s obviously part of the larger question of how much does God intervene in this world.

So, does God decide which eggs gets fertilized or is it a purely physical act that follows the laws of nature?

 

[RWMorris]

I think it is a bit of both. You can’t deny that biology plays a part, but who is to say that God doesn’t also play a part?

 

[paperwight]

The trouble with that line of reasoning is that we are saying that God ‘gives’ babies to drug addicts, prostitutes, alcoholics, the mentally-ill and potentially-violent as well. All of which children running the risk of poor health and being hurt or neglected.
Or are we saying that God only ‘gives’ babies to church-goers, whereas the other babies are purely the result of biology, and God isn’t involved directly?
We can’t have it both ways.

 

[Sure]

Okay, here’s the question.

We are told that children are a blessing from God.

We are told that we are co-creators of life, together with God.

People on these forums talk about “letting God decide” or “God gave us a child”.

Now, I’m middle aged and have four children, so I know how this works on the physical level. The above comments lead one to think that some believe that the purely physical act of fertilization does not follow the laws of nature. The laws of nature are that if you have sex during the fertile period, and the “swimmers” make contact with the egg and, well, you know.

So, does God interfere with that, intervene in that? Does he mediate that? Does God decide?

I can’t believe that’s true. Now, I know God can do whatever He wants, but what does the Church say about this? It’s obviously part of the larger question of how much does God intervene in this world.

So, does God decide which eggs gets fertilized or is it a purely physical act that follows the laws of nature?

All good that happens is caused by God. All good that you do is done by God. Your existence and your wife’s existence are caused by God. You and your wife come together, it is God who makes that happen. God causes the egg and the sperm come together. God causes the conception to occur. God causes the child to live. All good is caused by God. God is not a watchmaker who created the world and then set it running. He is the prime mover and the cause of Nature.

 

[Sure]

The trouble with that line of reasoning is that we are saying that God ‘gives’ babies to drug addicts, prostitutes, alcoholics, the mentally-ill and potentially-violent as well. All of which children running the risk of poor health and being hurt or neglected.
Or are we saying that God only ‘gives’ babies to church-goers, whereas the other babies are purely the result of biology, and God isn’t involved directly?
We can’t have it both ways.

Those babies are good. All good, all existence in those occurences comes from God. Those same children of drug-addicts, in addition to having a chance of being hurt, have a chance of being with God in Heaven in ultimate happiness.

 

[PaulinVA]

God is not a watchmaker who created the world and then set it running. He is the prime mover and the cause of Nature.

I understand that. But, at the same time, there is a very good chance of pregnancy occurring if a couple hits the fertile time just right, and a zero chance of pregnancy if it’s the last day of a cycle.

So, God created nature. Does he regularly intervene? Did he decide to create my children, or were my wife and I cooperative with Him by doing our best to hit the fertile time so that nature (God’s created rules) could do the rest?

 

[Em_in_FL]

I don’t think the two ideas conflict.
God CREATED the “laws of nature”…

The “co-creation” requires man and woman to make a choice to engage in sexual intimacy.

Often (very often) in this world the “procreative” side of intercourse is ignored… people aren’t having sex with the PURPOSE of “co-creating”, but God’s “laws of nature” are always in place (if a sperm and egg are hangin’ out, chances are high conception will occur).

It’s not GOD vs NATURE…
It’s GOD put NATURE into motion… created the very laws… intertwined completely.

 

[Em_in_FL]

So, God created nature. Does he regularly intervene? Did he decide to create my children, or were my wife and I cooperative with Him by doing our best to hit the fertile time so that nature (God’s created rules) could do the rest?

“Regularly intervene”?
Maybe, maybe not… we won’t know for sure in this life!

 

[Sure]

I understand that. But, at the same time, there is a very good chance of pregnancy occurring if a couple hits the fertile time just right, and a zero chance of pregnancy if it’s the last day of a cycle.

So, God created nature. Does he regularly intervene? Did he decide to create my children, or were my wife and I cooperative with Him by doing our best to hit the fertile time so that nature (God’s created rules) could do the rest?

By intervening it would seem you mean manipulating or going againts the natural system that he has already created. In that sense, no. But he wills you and your wife to the marital act and wills the conception or not. Your wife and you “cooperate” in the creation insofar as you follow his will that you should be together in the marital act.

 

[CalmDownWisWins]

I understand that. But, at the same time, there is a very good chance of pregnancy occurring if a couple hits the fertile time just right, and a zero chance of pregnancy if it’s the last day of a cycle.

So, God created nature. Does he regularly intervene? Did he decide to create my children, or were my wife and I cooperative with Him by doing our best to hit the fertile time so that nature (God’s created rules) could do the rest?

God “intervenes” at the creation of every person, being a being with a body and soul.

You “set the stage”, as is your job as a human person, for an ovum and sperm to get together, and once they do get together so as to start the whole “construct a physical human person” God “intervenes” and gives that matter life as a human person (body and soul).

Any further questions?

 

[Kinjion]

So, God created nature. Does he regularly intervene? Did he decide to create my children, or were my wife and I cooperative with Him by doing our best to hit the fertile time so that nature (God’s created rules) could do the rest?

Every time a human soul is created, it is created from nothing. Your body is the product of the combination of your mother’s body (in the form of the egg) and your father’s body (in the form of the sperm), but your soul is not the product of the union of their souls. Instead, human souls are created directly by God at conception, a miracle of that cannot be performed by anything other than God (since only God can bring something from nothing). Therefore, God directly intervenes at the start of every life at least by the special creation of the soul.

 

[KCT]

When a sperm and egg meet, God infuses a soul. We do our part, He does His —KCT

 

[Feedmysheep]

I’m going to trust what the Bible says:
Children are a blessing from the Lord
And the fruit of the womb a reward (Psalm 127)

So yes, God give us the babies. He also gave us the ability for rational thought, which allows us to understand how our biology works. Ask any couple struggling with infertility or an unexpected pregnancy if knowledge alone sufficed.

As for WHY does God bless some people with children and not others, that’s God’s business, I suppose.

FMS

 

[drafdog]

In the beginning…
God set in motion the universe, and all that is in it proceeds naturally from that initial impulse, whatever that may have been. God gives us children in the same way that He gives us colds. It is a natural consequence of the universe that He created. He does very little to “control” the behavior of the universe, otherwise there would have been no point in physical laws.

Matthew

 

[homewardbound]

The trouble with that line of reasoning is that we are saying that God ‘gives’ babies to drug addicts, prostitutes, alcoholics, the mentally-ill and potentially-violent as well. All of which children running the risk of poor health and being hurt or neglected.
Or are we saying that God only ‘gives’ babies to church-goers, whereas the other babies are purely the result of biology, and God isn’t involved directly?
We can’t have it both ways.

I’m a child of all of the above adjectives listed there. Was I not a gift from God? Maybe not to my worthless parents, but my grandparents who adopted me would probably beg to differ:shrug:

 

[CalmDownWisWins]

The trouble with that line of reasoning is that we are saying that God ‘gives’ babies to drug addicts, prostitutes, alcoholics, the mentally-ill and potentially-violent as well. All of which children running the risk of poor health and being hurt or neglected.
Or are we saying that God only ‘gives’ babies to church-goers, whereas the other babies are purely the result of biology, and God isn’t involved directly?
We can’t have it both ways.

So, do you now believe that God gives us ALL babies, even those who have bad parents?

I can’t bear not knowing whether you understand this point, as anyone holding the idea that some babies are from God and other’s aren’t holds so grave an error that they very much need our help in the extreme to see that that is not the case.

 

[PaulinVA]

Okay, I’ve been reading this for a few days to see where the discussion would go. Let me say that this question is part of a larger question that I have of how much God actually “has a plan for our lives” and does things to effect that plan.

We know that God created the biology that allows sperm and egg to meet and become fertilized and become a person, and that God imbues the creation of new life with a soul. So, we are co creators of new life with God.

We are told that children are a gift from God. I wonder, is this a generic gift (we did the biological part, and God did his part), or is it a specific gift to a specific couple at a specific time? Does God “help” the little swimmers reach the egg for some couples?

Posters seem to be split on that last question.

 

[CalmDownWisWins]

…
We are told that children are a gift from God. I wonder, is this a generic gift (we did the biological part, and God did his part), or is it a specific gift to a specific couple at a specific time? Does God “help” the little swimmers reach the egg for some couples?

Posters seem to be split on that last question.

Everything is a gift from God, so that’s the OVERALL answer.

All gifts are “specific” to those whom God gives them. Does that answer your question?

What do you mean by, “Does God ‘help’ the little swimmers…?” That one has me a little confused.

 

[PaulinVA]

Everything is a gift from God, so that’s the OVERALL answer.

All gifts are “specific” to those whom God gives them. Does that answer your question?

What do you mean by, “Does God ‘help’ the little swimmers…?” That one has me a little confused.

Everything is a gift from God is an answer, but, as I’ve said, I have a hard time believing that. God is actually deciding if I should lose my job today, if my wife and I should conceive, if I do or don’t get in an accident on the way home from work? Where is free will in that? That’s sort of Calvinist, isn’t it?

Little swimmers = sperm. You know, they “swim” towards the egg?

 

[CalmDownWisWins]

Everything is a gift from God is an answer, but, as I’ve said, I have a hard time believing that. God is actually deciding if I should lose my job today, if my wife and I should conceive, if I do or don’t get in an accident on the way home from work? Where is free will in that? That’s sort of Calvinist, isn’t it?

Little swimmers = sperm. You know, they “swim” towards the egg?

Ah! Now I get it!

You have free will from God, so you’ve been GIVEN the ability to make your own choices, one of which is whether to cooperate with Him in creating a baby.

The mystery of how free will and God’s omnipotence (where He can and does do ANYTHING, and everything is effected through Him according to HIS eternal plan) can exist simultaneously is not a solvable thing in human terms. You must simply accept that the two things are in fact true at the same time, and the “reconciliation” of this mystery we’ll find out when it’s time for us to do so (heaven and hell).

The “Calvinist” actually tries to “solve” the mystery by denying free will, while Catholics let the mystery stand and don’t try to “solve” it (because the resultant thought process runs up it’s own youknowwhat).