Does God "worship" Mary?

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NDfan said:
Billy you are terribly misinterpreting the song of songs. In a literal sense it speaks of a man and woman moving their relationship from a courtship to the final stage which would be consummation. In a figurative sense we can apply all kinds of meanings to it. Some suggest it’s allegory with regard to the relationship of GOD to Israel. But to suggest this is Mary is gleaning something that is not there. I think you’re getting stuck on the word woman.
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I am reading the Bible directly and you seem to be adding or subtracting something. The Song of Solomon is about a couple, a Lover and beloved in ecstatic love.

It is the direct word of God in the Holy Bible. Who is the woman?
 
chris_molter said:
That’s your entirely subjective opinion.
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That seems to be God’s opinion, too. How many words does He devote to Mary in the Epistles, where the primary instruction for new Christians is? Can you count to…Zero?
 
puzzleannie said:
the most common interpretation of the Song is the call of the lover, God, to the soul using human love, married love specifically, as an allegory for the far greater divine love and union of with God.
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Regarding the title of your thread, God does worship not worship anyone.
 
codebilly said:
I am reading the Bible directly and you seem to be adding or subtracting something. The Song of Solomon is about a couple, a Lover and beloved in ecstatic love.

It is the direct word of God in the Holy Bible. Who is the woman?
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Billy I wasn’t going to be as direct as you are but yes it is about ecstatic love. We don’t know who the woman is just as we don’t know who the man is. What is interesting is the title itself implies a superlative relationship to other songs. Like saying Jesus is King of Kings. This is the Song of all Songs.
 
The Song of Solomon…Is not an allegory. it is not a discription of of God and the church. here is what it is.

It is an instruction manual. it is basically saying, Men, this is how you are to delight in your wife. Men i have told how to love her, As i love the church, this is how you delight in her. it is also saying Woman, this is how you delight in your husband. the book really is very scandalous book. but it is God’s words on how and love is supposed to be between a husband and wife. You can ask any couple right after their honey moon and ask if it was like the Song of Solomon and most of them (if they answer you ) will say it was. God the Inventor of and Love between a husband and wife, I think wanted to let us know it is ok for us as husbands to “want” your wife and delight in her, and take pleasure in her and for wives to “want” their husbands, that is not sinful or ful it is what God designed.

In our day and Age, we have removed the value of and love and placed in the trash were every one can partake and misuse, I think God let the church keep that book, in the bible to remind us, that God made and love, and this is how we are to use it.
 
Dchsknight said:
The Song of Solomon…Is not an allegory. it is not a discription of of God and the church. here is what it is.

It is an instruction manual. it is basically saying, Men, this is how you are to delight in your wife. Men i have told how to love her, As i love the church, this is how you delight in her. it is also saying Woman, this is how you delight in your husband. the book really is very scandalous book. but it is God’s words on how and love is supposed to be between a husband and wife. You can ask any couple right after their honey moon and ask if it was like the Song of Solomon and most of them (if they answer you ) will say it was. God the Inventor of and Love between a husband and wife, I think wanted to let us know it is ok for us as husbands to “want” your wife and delight in her, and take pleasure in her and for wives to “want” their husbands, that is not sinful or ful it is what God designed.

In our day and Age, we have removed the value of and love and placed in the trash were every one can partake and misuse, I think God let the church keep that book, in the bible to remind us, that God made and love, and this is how we are to use it.
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Absolutely. Good Post 👍
 
catholic_daddy said:
That seems to be God’s opinion, too. How many words does He devote to Mary in the Epistles, where the primary instruction for new Christians is? Can you count to…Zero?
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God does not have ‘opinions’, nor is his revelation confined to the written scriptures.
 
Dchsknight said:
The Song of Solomon…Is not an allegory. it is not a discription of of God and the church. here is what it is.

It is an instruction manual. it is basically saying, Men, this is how you are to delight in your wife. Men i have told how to love her, As i love the church, this is how you delight in her. it is also saying Woman, this is how you delight in your husband. the book really is very scandalous book. but it is God’s words on how and love is supposed to be between a husband and wife. You can ask any couple right after their honey moon and ask if it was like the Song of Solomon and most of them (if they answer you ) will say it was. God the Inventor of and Love between a husband and wife, I think wanted to let us know it is ok for us as husbands to “want” your wife and delight in her, and take pleasure in her and for wives to “want” their husbands, that is not sinful or ful it is what God designed.

In our day and Age, we have removed the value of and love and placed in the trash were every one can partake and misuse, I think God let the church keep that book, in the bible to remind us, that God made and love, and this is how we are to use it.
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Is that what your church teaches you? Quote some references from your church founders or leading teachers please.
 
chris_molter said:
God does not have ‘opinions’, nor is his revelation confined to the written scriptures.
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HE doesn’t? Then what would you call it then?

And no GOD’s revelation is not confined to scripture. In matters of salvation it is though. But GOD’s revelation is not confined to one person either.
 
NDfan said:
Where does it say that she is?
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I proposed a question to the forum, but you provided a matter a fact answer.

You answered the question, now back up your statement from the Bible.

Are you proposing that your answer:
  • “She (Mary) is not (the bride of God))” *
is true because you have stated it so.
 
codebilly said:
Just answer the question … Is Mary the bride of God?
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Let’s see if I can explain:

We believe in a triune God, Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

God the Father is the Father and creator of us all, including Mary.

God the Son, Jesus, is the son of Mary. The reason that we refer to Mary as the “Mother of God” is to show that Jesus is God

The Holy Spirit is sometimes refereed to as Mary’s spouse.

Now, Jesus was a Jew, and he was a perfect Jew, who kept the ten commandments in the most perfect way. Honor thy father and mother, is one of the commandments. Obviously, Jesus honors his mother, in a perfect way…but honor doesn’t mean worship. The same way, we don’t worship our earthly parents, we love and honor them.

Finally, a very simple description of Catholics love for Mary is this comparison to navigation. The north star, was traditionally used to guide sailors to where they needed to go. The sailors were not going up into the sky to the North Star, but following it as a marker. As Catholics we see Mary as a way to guide us to Jesus, similarly as the North Star. Mary’s example, and love for us is important to us, but she doesn’t replace God, or take an equivalent place to God. She shows us the way to him.
 
Dchsknight said:
The Song of Solomon…Is not an allegory. it is not a discription of of God and the church. here is what it is.

It is an instruction manual. it is basically saying, Men, this is how you are to delight in your wife. Men i have told how to love her, As i love the church, this is how you delight in her. it is also saying Woman, this is how you delight in your husband.** the book really is very scandalous book. but it is God’s words** on how and love is supposed to be between a husband and wife. You can ask any couple right after their honey moon and ask if it was like the Song of Solomon and most of them (if they answer you ) will say it was. God the Inventor of and Love between a husband and wife, I think wanted to let us know it is ok for us as husbands to “want” your wife and delight in her, and take pleasure in her and for wives to “want” their husbands, that is not sinful or ful it is what God designed.

In our day and Age, we have removed the value of and love and placed in the trash were every one can partake and misuse, I think God let the church keep that book, in the bible to remind us, that God made and love, and this is how we are to use it.
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God’s word is “very scandalous”? God is perfect. What exactly do you mean?

At the beginning of your post, you state “** here is what it is. **”

Later in your post you say " I think wanted to let us know it is ok"

What is it again ??? :confused:
 
NDfan said:
HE doesn’t? Then what would you call it then?
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We cannot know how God’s ‘thought processes’ work. The word opinion implies something arbitrary and changeable.
And no GOD’s revelation is not confined to scripture. In matters of salvation it is though. But GOD’s revelation is not confined to one person either.
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Well sure, now you just have to interpret it correctly. Which is why we rely on the Church and have done so for 2000 years.
 
codebilly said:
I proposed a question to the forum, but you provided a matter a fact answer.

You answered the question, now back up your statement from the Bible.

Are you proposing that your answer:
  • “She (Mary) is not (the bride of God))” *
is true because you have stated it so.
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Billy here are your original questions:

Q - Who is the Lover in Solomon’s Canticle of Canticles (Song of Songs, Song of Solomon)?

A - The answer is the work does not reference a specific man and woman just the relationship between A man and woman as it progresses from courtship to consummation. Some suggest it’s a guide to how a woman treats her husband and vice verse. From a Jewish perspective it’s viewed as GOD’s relationship with Israel.

Q - Is God “the Lover” in the book of Canticles?

From a Jewish perspective allegorically speaking yes. From a literal perspective no.

Q - If God is the Lover, who is the beloved?

The nation of Israel.

Q - If the beloved is Mary, can it be said that God “worships” her?

No because the work does not speak of worship.

I answered that Mary was not the bride of GOD because scripture never states that she is. She is stated as being the bride of Joseph. If you claim she is the bride of GOD then please back it up from scripture.

PEACE
 
chris_molter said:
We cannot know how God’s ‘thought processes’ work. The word opinion implies something arbitrary and changeable.
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Ok Chris I see where you are coming from. I thought that’s what you were referring to and would agree I wouldn’t call GOD’s thoughts opinions. GOD’s thoughts are perfect therefore if anything they are fact, or they are commands.
Well sure, now you just have to interpret it correctly. Which is why we rely on the Church and have done so for 2000 years.
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Yes we rely on the church to help us understand scripture and GOD’s revelations.
 
NDfan said:
I answered that Mary was not the bride of GOD because scripture never states that she is.
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Since you say, she is not the bride of God, then how is it, that she bears God’s son?
 
NDfan said:
I answered that Mary was not the bride of GOD because scripture never states that she is. She is stated as being the bride of Joseph. If you claim she is the bride of GOD then please back it up from scripture.
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*Behold, you will conceive in your womb and bear a son, and you shall name him Jesus. He will be great and will be called Son of the Most High, and the Lord God will give him the throne of David his father, and he will rule over the house of Jacob forever, and of his kingdom there will be no end."

But Mary said to the angel, “How can this be, since I have no relations with a man?”

And the angel said to her in reply, "The holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. Therefore the child to be born will be called holy, the Son of God.* - Luke 1:31-35

Does God’s word teach and support that the covenant of marriage is prerequisite for having children?
 
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