Does John 10:16*prove calvinism?

[whoisdiss]

In the verse Jesus says he has other lost sheep and that soon they too would become part of the flock. A calvinist told me that the sheep are only the Christians and that when Jesus says they will join the flock he told me it proves God predestines people to be saved.

 

[NextElement]

It seems like every denomination has a different meaning for this verse. Mormons say it proves that Jesus would visit the Israelites in North America to preach the Gospel to them. You decide, OP.

 

[Pilgrim_333]

It would seem Our Lord is speaking of the unification of the Jews and the Gentiles (therefore, all peoples of the world) into one fold–one Church. He is speaking of the New, Universal Covenant; one Shepherd, one Fold.

 

[tonyrey]

In the verse Jesus says he has other lost sheep and that soon they too would become part of the flock. A calvinist told me that the sheep are only the Christians and that when Jesus says they will join the flock he told me it proves God predestines people to be saved.

It proves nothing of the kind:

16"I have other sheep, which are not of this fold; I must bring them also, and they will hear My voice; and they will become one flock with one shepherd.

Jesus brings everyonewho chooses to be brought to his flock even before they have heard his voice. In other words salvation is not restricted to the select few but to Jews and Gentiles alike if they live according to what they believe to be right. It proves the doctrine of predestination is a distortion of His mission to bring universal salvation:

I am the light of the world.

John 8:12

 

[tonyrey]

It would seem Our Lord is speaking of the unification of the Jews and the Gentiles (therefore, all peoples of the world) into one fold–one Church. He is speaking of the New, Universal Covenant; one Shepherd, one Fold.

You anticipated me.

 

[po18guy]

SHOCKER!!!

The Catholic Church teaches pre-destination.

The anti-shocker: It does NOT teach double pre-destination, as Calvin concocted it.

Catechism sections 257, 600, 1007, 2012, 2782 and 2823 either address this directly, or touch on it.

Calvin introduced a uniquely European twist to Christianity, namely that God would create with the intent to destroy. Of course, this view reflected Calvin and not God.

 

[po18guy]

It would seem Our Lord is speaking of the unification of the Jews and the Gentiles (therefore, all peoples of the world) into one fold–one Church. He is speaking of the New, Universal Covenant; one Shepherd, one Fold.

Romans 11 (the natural and the grafted-in branches of the vine) addresses this exact topic. Regarding this verse, the Haydock Commentary has it thus:

One fold. In the Greek one flock. The signification is the same; that is, there shall be one church of Jews and Gentiles converted.

The “others who are not of this flock” are the Gentiles, as Jesus was addressing the Jews at that point.