Does participating in a Mass with Liturgical irregularities harm our Immortal Souls?l

[Paul_W]

There are only a handful of “irregularities” that prevent Jesus from being present on the altar. (e.g. wrong words / invalid matter.)

One can lose the positive effects of grace by worrying about all the other irregularities, to the point of ignoring His true presence.

Yes, we should follow the GIRM as faithfully as possible. Yes, if there are recurring errors, they should be rectified. But if we turn into the Girm Police, looking for every little human mistake, we’re missing the point of being there.

 

[Toni]

Annunciata:

Quite honestly, I couldn’t vote on the choices given because my reason and everyone’s reason for attending Mass should be for the love of God and eyes and heart directed to the Holy Sacrifice.
I’ve been noticing lately that I’ve been guilty of “policing” at Mass and I don’t like myself for that…
As previous posters have said, “I’m checking the GIRM at the door” from now on… and I’m just going to have to pray harder for things to come together for the good for those who love God…:clapping:.

We get out of Mass what we put into it. If we are concerned about the speck in the priest’s eye then pray for them instead of letting that destroy the Mass for you.
If I only ever had to deal with the new GIRM issues in my church I would be in my glory, there are far bigger fish in the pan than that right now. But as frustrated as I get about all of it, I do try to pray and put all my heart and soul into the Mass, even if it takes plugging my ears during some of the awful music I endure. I have seen children playing with the Eucharist in their mouths at church and looked at them to plead with them, I have even quietly and lovingly said oh that is our Lord.
But I must remain focused and put all I have into the sacrifice of the Mass for my own soul. It is far to dangerous for me to think about all the corruption because on Sunday’s I probably would not even attend any longer. But I do know better and keep trying to fight the good fight. Thanks for letting me give my opinion on this matter!

 

[csr]

One of the most wonderful books I have read about the “formative” aspects (as a previous poster put it) of the liturgy is Liturgy and Personality by Dietrich Von Hildebrand. Liturgy forms us by directly involving us in the response to value. God is the value. We respond to that value, or fail to.
tru_devotion:

I simply cannot disobey my priest and introduce something that he has no desire for. If he sends me to purify the vessels I have to purify the vessels. If he sends me to get the chalice from the Tabernacle, I have to get the chalice from the tabernacle. If he sends me to distribute Holy Communion and tells a co-celebrating priest to sit it out, I have to go and distribute Holy Communion.

Take note of Apoc 13:4:

And they adored the dragon, which gave power to the beast: and they adored the beast, saying: Who is like to the beast? and who shall be able to fight with him?

Note the acquiescence, the weakness: who can fight it? what can we do?. This may be a paradigm that gives some credibility to the foreboding you feel about doing certain kinds of things, that feel awkward to you.

 

[pnewton]

I voted for the fourth choice primarily because of the word “irregularities”. While I would refrain from a Mass that had an invalid Sacrament or is totally out of communion with the church, I have to agree with Paul W that the grace of the Holy Eucharist is not negated by any other external circumstance.

I do understand that there is a time to report abuses in the liturgy, I also think we are best served by praying for these holy men who have given there life to the Church and asking Mary to intercede. Instead of talking to the priest, the bishop, then the nuncio, go tell their mother on them first.

 

[robertaf]

pnewton:

I voted for the fourth choice primarily because of the word “irregularities”. While I would refrain from a Mass that had an invalid Sacrament or is totally out of communion with the church, I have to agree with Paul W that the grace of the Holy Eucharist is not negated by any other external circumstance.

I do understand that there is a time to report abuses in the liturgy, I also think we are best served by praying for these holy men who have given there life to the Church and asking Mary to intercede. Instead of talking to the priest, the bishop, then the nuncio, go tell their mother on them first.

AMEN!
pnewton, you are becoming a continuing inspiration to me. You appear to be a wonderfully balanced and loving Catholic.
You make me wish, more and more for the return of the rating system.
Anyway, I can say it here, publically for all to see.
Please keep up your fine postings.

smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/11/11_12_11.gif

 

[rwoehmke]

tru_dvotion:

I LOVE YOU brother or sister, who ever you are in Christ! THANK YOU so much! But it is a little different when an extraordinary minister of the Eucharist has to participate in ways direct opposition to what the Holy See requires from us. When one serves at the altar, one has to follow the directives of the celebrant.

You all who are in these ministries as EMHC etc. have an option. You are not being forced to participate in these ministries. One can drop out of ministry until problems are corrected. As a member at large of trhe congregation you can participate in the Mass to the best of your ability and leave the “jobs” to others who may not be quite as scrupulous(sic). You may be dropping out for your lifetime, but that is better than going against what you know is right.

 

[MackerelSnapper]

You know, liturgical abuse goes way back. Yep, it existed prior to V2.

Back in the '50s we had a curate who was a real liturgical spead demon. He would start his bow when he began the confiteor. Wherever he was in the confiteor when he completed the bow, the next word out of his mouth was “Amen”.

I suppose my imortal soul is in big trouble.

 

[porthos11]

There is an old axiom: “lex orandi, lex credendi”, literally, “law of prayer, law of belief.” I place no particular order between the two but Pope Pius XII interprets the axiom as “let the law of belief determine the law of prayer.” Essentially, this is an important principle in liturgical prayer: we pray as we believe. Liturgy is not just any mere private prayer, it is also a means to evangelize and share the faith.

Abuses, therefore, however small, ruptures the link between the lex orandi and the lex credendi, by giving the wrong message and harming the liturgy’s evangelistic function:

For example: if the laity recite along with the priest the Words of Consecration, what message is put across? Well, (1) It means that there is little or no distinction between the priesthood of the ordained and the common priesthood of the faithful. (2) It gives across the idea that the Holy Eucharst comes about through the action of the congregation rather than the priest in persona Christi. Both are serious theological errors.

Or what if someone starts the Mass with High Fives rather than the sign of the Cross? (Yes, I had to endure this once). Well, this essentially tells others that it’s good to find entertainment at Mass rather than come into the life of the Trinity. Rather than professing our belief in Christianity’s core doctrine, we profess how important it is to have fun.

Just some examples. As you can see, neither of them invalidate the Mass. But they do disrupt the relationship between the lex orandi and the lex credendi, essential in liturgical prayer.