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MarkInOregon
Guest
I hope not. Should I make it to heaven I hope to escape all this mind numbing technology. I thought by definition a place stuffed full of technology was “hell.”
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Robert_Sock
Guest
This would be good news (if I make it to Heaven)! It makes a lot of sense! Does this mean that our technology here in this world comes from hell?I hope not. Should I make it to heaven I hope to escape all this mind numbing technology. I thought by definition a place stuffed full of technology was “hell.”
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Robert_Sock
Guest
This would explain why nothing quite works right.
The_Reginator
Active member
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OrdinaryMelkite
Guest
I will have to repectfully disagree with that, MarkInOregon. A “place stuffed full of technology” can STILL be a kind of Heaven----it all depends on the nature of the technology and how it is used/applied.I hope not. Should I make it to heaven I hope to escape all this mind numbing technology. I thought by definition a place stuffed full of technology was “hell.”
Not ALL technology is “Evil.” A heart monitor is not evil; neither is a Dialysis Machine.Like you said, I think what you are getting at is the technology that “numbs” us and “separates us from God,” like the technology used to do abortions or kill people, right? In which case, in THAT context, it is an OVERABUNDANCE of BAD technology that is true “Hell.”
Heaven would NOT have any type of technology like that—only technology which connects us to our Sources: God and Christ.
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Light1111
Guest
I believe that technology is consciousness, and that one of our lessons here on earth is to increase in our consciousness.
It is sometimes difficult to see the commonalities between religions and philosophies, particularly when their languages are so different from one another.
However, it appears to me that from many of the ‘prophets’ this world has known, Jesus included, we see an encouragement toward ‘knowing oneself’ and becoming pure of spirit.
One thing that always has nagged at me about the 10 Commandments and any other God-directed laws, is that it is meaningless (to me) to obey the Commandments, if one does so only out of a fear of punishment. I find it far more meaningful if one behaves right, and is kind to others, etc., out of a genuine sense of inner love for his fellow man, and out of love and respect for God.
So following laws only based on a fear of the consequences is not filled with merit, in my opinion.
That said, what could bring one to obey God’s laws without having to do so intentionally–in other words, how does one get there?
I believe that prayer, meditation, and other similar endeavors opens one up to inner peace and inner self-acceptance and understanding . . and in such a posture, one doesn’t feel compelled to sin (to the same extent, at least, as he might have in a prior, less aware state of being). Then, he is “obeying” God’s laws simply by being himself . . and he doesn’t need to continuously instruct himself to remember the laws–it’s second nature.
This is what technology is, to my way of thinking: consciousness. As our consciousness expands, we feel love for our fellow man, for the animals, and the earth itself.
Technology is nothing but man’s consciousness applied to the physical world. I see most forms of modern technology as irrelevant, unnecessary. I don’t celebrate all of Apple’s newest products! I am bored by it. I see the advent of facebook and twitter and texting as bringing us further and further apart. Still, at the same time, it’s here on the internet all of us are brought together and are able to share our ideas! So it’s certainly not all bad!
But as humans I feel we are sometimes over-wowed by these modern technologies, when a true technological advance would be for an increasing global consciousness. If more people truly felt the plight of our earth’s inhabitants, we would no longer permit their destruction. We are doing such grave harm to our earth. I hope that this sort of technology, one of an expanded heart-consciousness, and an awakened state of our souls, leads us to a new type of peace here on earth.
Peace to all.
It is sometimes difficult to see the commonalities between religions and philosophies, particularly when their languages are so different from one another.
However, it appears to me that from many of the ‘prophets’ this world has known, Jesus included, we see an encouragement toward ‘knowing oneself’ and becoming pure of spirit.
One thing that always has nagged at me about the 10 Commandments and any other God-directed laws, is that it is meaningless (to me) to obey the Commandments, if one does so only out of a fear of punishment. I find it far more meaningful if one behaves right, and is kind to others, etc., out of a genuine sense of inner love for his fellow man, and out of love and respect for God.
So following laws only based on a fear of the consequences is not filled with merit, in my opinion.
That said, what could bring one to obey God’s laws without having to do so intentionally–in other words, how does one get there?
I believe that prayer, meditation, and other similar endeavors opens one up to inner peace and inner self-acceptance and understanding . . and in such a posture, one doesn’t feel compelled to sin (to the same extent, at least, as he might have in a prior, less aware state of being). Then, he is “obeying” God’s laws simply by being himself . . and he doesn’t need to continuously instruct himself to remember the laws–it’s second nature.
This is what technology is, to my way of thinking: consciousness. As our consciousness expands, we feel love for our fellow man, for the animals, and the earth itself.
Technology is nothing but man’s consciousness applied to the physical world. I see most forms of modern technology as irrelevant, unnecessary. I don’t celebrate all of Apple’s newest products! I am bored by it. I see the advent of facebook and twitter and texting as bringing us further and further apart. Still, at the same time, it’s here on the internet all of us are brought together and are able to share our ideas! So it’s certainly not all bad!
But as humans I feel we are sometimes over-wowed by these modern technologies, when a true technological advance would be for an increasing global consciousness. If more people truly felt the plight of our earth’s inhabitants, we would no longer permit their destruction. We are doing such grave harm to our earth. I hope that this sort of technology, one of an expanded heart-consciousness, and an awakened state of our souls, leads us to a new type of peace here on earth.
Peace to all.
R
Robert_Sock
Guest
Do you think that the technology to increase our consciousness would come from hell? To be successful wouldn’t we need to increase people’s belief in God prior to increasing consciousness?
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Light1111
Guest
Maybe we feel more drawn to God as consciousness increases. Maybe that’s when one spontaneously finds the true God who resides in his heart.
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JDaniel
Guest
All seriousness aside, AW, can you imagine how heaven looks from the air!?
God bless,
jd
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JDaniel
Guest
No, Lemon. The infinite spirit realm co-permeates the finite physical universe. So any material bodies, in heaven, so to speak, exist there co-permeated. Look up: hypostatic union - but, please, not in Wikipedia!
God bless,
jd
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lemondiesel
Guest
Would you mind linking me to a proper explanation, so we can be on the same page? I am just confused on how you are using “co-permeates.”
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JDaniel
Guest
Lemon:
That I will try to do, but, later, as I have to leave shortly.
What I mean is simply this: God is Infinite. As Infinite, He consumes all of known material and immaterial space and beyond, actually, beyond the farthest reaches. He consumes everything, so to speak. Now, the universe exists. But, it cannot exist as a bubble within God, or, God would not be Infinite. Nor can we exist within Him like bubbles. Thus, He permeates us. In turn, since He is within us, and, throughout us, we are also in Him.
However, this does not mean that He is in us and we in Him in the pantheistic sense, or, the panentheistic sense, as we are not any part, or piece, of Him and He is not part, or piece, of us. We merely pass through each other but our beings and essences are (and always remain) completely separate. IOW, we are not a per se mixture.
(Corrections invited.)
God bless,
jd
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paduard
Guest
“However, this does not mean that He is in us and we in Him in the pantheistic sense, or, the panentheistic sense,”
As posted by jd above.
I agree - i.e. this passage in particular.
As posted by jd above.
I agree - i.e. this passage in particular.
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Light1111
Guest
Re: the poster who said “not in the pantheistic sense or the panentheistic sense,” can you please refresh me? I was raised Catholic and attended Catholic school, but didn’t quite understand the specific beliefs in childhood.
Do Catholics believe that God is everything, everywhere, everyone? Do they believe that if you are sitting at the table with a friend eating a meal, that you are looking at God speaking as your friend speaks, and you are eating God as you eat the meal, and you are sitting at a table, that is God, and the air you are breathing is God?
I am tempted to guess the answer is “No,” judging based on the belief of the transubstantiation that takes place when the Priest blesses the Holy Communion during mass. But just to be sure, I am wondering if someone could clear this up for me. Is this type of thinking what is referred to as “pantheistic or panentheistic”?
In the Catholic doctrine, the Holy Trinity of God as the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, might be interpreted by people who did not understand as representing a religion that was “pantheistic.” This is comparable to the Hindu religion, which names various gods – say, Shiva, Vishnu, Kali – but if you asked a Hindu, they do not regard themselves as pantheistic. They look at their separate gods as representative aspects of one god – Brahmin. And this one god, to their way of thought, is too grand, too vast, to be imagined or understood by man. So, one must “break god up into little pieces” to make him comprehensible, so man prays to these ‘small gods’ who are representative aspects of their one god. If you did ask a Hindu, they’d tell you that they see this “one god” as being the same as our “one god.”
Now, I know a person who follows the Judeo-Christian traditions wouldn’t agree with the Hindu, but it puts into context what is meant by “pantheism.” Sometimes an outsider looking in would feel that a given religion is pantheistic, but the individuals participating and believing in that religion do not see it that way. People who defend their monotheism against the Church’s criticisms point out that the Holy Trinity is similar in essence and in philosophy to their own divisions in the divine realms. We do not view the Holy Trinity as constituting a pantheistic belief system, but neither do the Hindus view their divisions of smaller gods as constituting a pantheistic belief system.
Just a thought!
Also please, I do still have that question about whether Catholics believe that all objects and living beings are God.
Thank you and peace!
Light1111
Do Catholics believe that God is everything, everywhere, everyone? Do they believe that if you are sitting at the table with a friend eating a meal, that you are looking at God speaking as your friend speaks, and you are eating God as you eat the meal, and you are sitting at a table, that is God, and the air you are breathing is God?
I am tempted to guess the answer is “No,” judging based on the belief of the transubstantiation that takes place when the Priest blesses the Holy Communion during mass. But just to be sure, I am wondering if someone could clear this up for me. Is this type of thinking what is referred to as “pantheistic or panentheistic”?
In the Catholic doctrine, the Holy Trinity of God as the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, might be interpreted by people who did not understand as representing a religion that was “pantheistic.” This is comparable to the Hindu religion, which names various gods – say, Shiva, Vishnu, Kali – but if you asked a Hindu, they do not regard themselves as pantheistic. They look at their separate gods as representative aspects of one god – Brahmin. And this one god, to their way of thought, is too grand, too vast, to be imagined or understood by man. So, one must “break god up into little pieces” to make him comprehensible, so man prays to these ‘small gods’ who are representative aspects of their one god. If you did ask a Hindu, they’d tell you that they see this “one god” as being the same as our “one god.”
Now, I know a person who follows the Judeo-Christian traditions wouldn’t agree with the Hindu, but it puts into context what is meant by “pantheism.” Sometimes an outsider looking in would feel that a given religion is pantheistic, but the individuals participating and believing in that religion do not see it that way. People who defend their monotheism against the Church’s criticisms point out that the Holy Trinity is similar in essence and in philosophy to their own divisions in the divine realms. We do not view the Holy Trinity as constituting a pantheistic belief system, but neither do the Hindus view their divisions of smaller gods as constituting a pantheistic belief system.
Just a thought!
Also please, I do still have that question about whether Catholics believe that all objects and living beings are God.
Thank you and peace!
Light1111
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paduard
Guest
Pending a reply by others, perhaps this might help you.
Pantheism - - - Panentheism - - - Omnipresence - - - Semi-Deism - - - Deism
The left side represents “immmanence”, the right “trancendence”.
At the far left, Pantheism so stresses the immanence of God as to identify Him with the cosmos. Panentheism tries to postulate a partial identification with the cosmos, but still weighs too heavily on the “immanence” side of the equation.
At the far right, Deism overemphasizes the Divine transcendence, leaving us with a God not the least bit immanent. “Semi-Deism” imagines an anthropomorphic “old man in the clouds” who is only partially involved in the history of the world.
In the middle stands Omnipresence, the view which perfectly balances both extremes. In a certain sense, the Christian concept fulfils the needs expressed by each of the other four concepts.
Like the “God” of Deism, the one true God is exalted, sovereign and majestic, (yet not distant and unconcerned).
Like the “God” of Semi-Deism, the one true God hears prayers and performs miracles (yet is present constantly, not just occasionally).
Like the “God” of Panentheism, the one true God is united to part of creation by the Incarnation (yet not to all of it; nor is He in any way “limited” by the universe).
And finally, the one true God is intimately close to creation, which cannot exist without His constant sustaining power. He also desires to dwell within us by grace, and even give us a share in His own Divine Life (without violating out individuality, however). This is somewhat like the “God” of Pantheism, though not exactly, for the One God is a personal Being who desires a personal relationship with us, and who is distinct from us and the rest of creation. Yet it does seem to speak to the longings of the heart which lead some souls to embrace Pantheism.
One cannot have a personal relationship with the cosmos, but one can have such a relationship with its Omnipresent Creator, Who is both God Most High and “God with us”. This is the One True God, revealed to us through Holy Mother Church.
I have highlighted Catholic Doctrine. Which is His Omnipresence.
Hope this helps in some small way. See further if you visit Catechism of Catholic Church.
Regards.
L
Light1111
Guest
Thank you so much for spelling all of that out! I enjoyed reading it and it’s given me much to think about! And I will follow up on your advice for further reading.
Peace to you,
Light1111
Peace to you,
Light1111
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jumlove
Guest
Many people assume that heaven and its inhabitants are non-material, non-physical. That is not so. Heaven is very much physical, and its inhabitants are very much physical. After all Jesus ascended to heaven in physical form 40 days after His resurrection. Christians will be transformed into supernatural beings with new bodies. (see 1 Corinthians 15:35-48 and 1 Corinthians 15:51-53). On earth we are natural beings, in heaven we will be supernatural beings. The natural aspect of existence has to do with the commonality of the environment we live in. We are natural on earth because our earthly bodies naturally interact with this earth which God created for these bodies. Since heaven is superior to earth our bodies in heaven must be superior (supernatural) to naturally interact with heaven. God created us in His image and in His likeness; it stands to reason that God created an environment for us to live in that is in the image and likeness of His environment. Although sin has corrupted this earthly environment to the nth degree, the principles and patterns of God’s creations (heaven and earth) remain consistent. We know this because God does not change. In design earth is a microcosm of the macrocosm called heaven.
Will there be technology in heaven. DEFINITELY. It will not be the computers or the I-pads as we know them because the technology of heaven is extremely superior to our technology. We have only utilized electricity for a couple of hundreds of years, we have not even scratched the surface of electronic technology. The technology of heaven is eternal, just imagine the possibilities. There are streets of gold, what types of vehicles might travel on those streets? Certainly all machinery will be powered by God’s glory, but controlled by us individually in response to our will. What ever we operate will become one with the operator, as long as we are utilizing that particular equipment. Read Ezekiel chapter 10. It appears that the cherubim was riding upon, or perhaps even had become one with, some sort of machinery.
When we get to heaven we will see even as we are seen. We will see and experience first had many new forms and levels of technology. It will be REMARKABLE. Think about this. Through electronics we send and receive video and audio signals. We create, send, and store all types of information. We have all types of transmitters and receivers. Our natural body’s also create, send, and store electronic signals inside and outside of itself. Just because we have not discovered the technology required to capture the electronic energy (signals) that our every thought, feeling and/or motive produces does not mean that those signals can not be captured. The scriptures teach us that our lives will be judged, therefore our lives are recorded somewhere. In the bible it says that it was written on a book, but writing in books was the technology of that day. Surely heaven’s sophistication is not limited to the written word in a book. The information of all the lives of every individual who has ever lived is stored in a very efficient and superior way. As a matter of fact, our very thoughts, words, motives, etc. are transmitted and received by God through a form of technology. We have to stop thinking about God in the limited confines of our minds. Yes God is Holy, pure, perfect. Yes God is Spirit and God is truth. But God is wise beyond description. If He allows us foolish mortals this level of technology, just imagine, IMAGINE, what He has going on in the world where He has prepared a place for us.
Will there be technology in heaven. DEFINITELY. It will not be the computers or the I-pads as we know them because the technology of heaven is extremely superior to our technology. We have only utilized electricity for a couple of hundreds of years, we have not even scratched the surface of electronic technology. The technology of heaven is eternal, just imagine the possibilities. There are streets of gold, what types of vehicles might travel on those streets? Certainly all machinery will be powered by God’s glory, but controlled by us individually in response to our will. What ever we operate will become one with the operator, as long as we are utilizing that particular equipment. Read Ezekiel chapter 10. It appears that the cherubim was riding upon, or perhaps even had become one with, some sort of machinery.
When we get to heaven we will see even as we are seen. We will see and experience first had many new forms and levels of technology. It will be REMARKABLE. Think about this. Through electronics we send and receive video and audio signals. We create, send, and store all types of information. We have all types of transmitters and receivers. Our natural body’s also create, send, and store electronic signals inside and outside of itself. Just because we have not discovered the technology required to capture the electronic energy (signals) that our every thought, feeling and/or motive produces does not mean that those signals can not be captured. The scriptures teach us that our lives will be judged, therefore our lives are recorded somewhere. In the bible it says that it was written on a book, but writing in books was the technology of that day. Surely heaven’s sophistication is not limited to the written word in a book. The information of all the lives of every individual who has ever lived is stored in a very efficient and superior way. As a matter of fact, our very thoughts, words, motives, etc. are transmitted and received by God through a form of technology. We have to stop thinking about God in the limited confines of our minds. Yes God is Holy, pure, perfect. Yes God is Spirit and God is truth. But God is wise beyond description. If He allows us foolish mortals this level of technology, just imagine, IMAGINE, what He has going on in the world where He has prepared a place for us.
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tonyrey
Guest
It is a mistake to think of heaven as solely a place of rest and contemplation. Love is creative, dynamic and an endless source of joy and delight. Even in this life the most fertile and active part of our being is our mind - unless we let ourselves be dragged down by a quest for nothing but physical pleasure…
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Robert_Sock
Guest
From where does our earthly technology come from? It’s a mistake to think it comes from our innate wit.
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tonyrey
Guest
Even in science there is a role for intuition, inspiration and creativity - which do not have a mechanistic origin!
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