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ZhaneAugustine
Guest
I know it mentions the soul but does it say anywhere that it is immortal as we believe? If so where?
Does the bible ever make reference that the soul is IMMORTAL?
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GEddie
Guest
Mt 10:28, “…kill the body but cannot kill the soul”
This verse does not say immortal but it does teach that it will not die with your body.
ICXC NIKA
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Gorgias
Guest
No, this one doesn’t help in the way you’re saying it does. In fact, if you include the whole verse, it seems to refute the contention that the soul is immortal! (It doesn’t, of course – Jesus is working with the idea of what happens to a person thrown into the fire – but still, it’s figurative language.)
So, Jesus isn’t saying “the soul is immortal”, he’s saying “if all they can do is kill your body – but they don’t have the power to touch your soul – then don’t worry about them.”
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WesleyF
Guest
What is death?
Death is the separation of a composite being into its composite parts. Man can die because man is a composite being composed of body and soul (also called spirit at times). The soul is the animating principle of the body.
“for they cannot die any more, because they are equal to angels” (Luke 20:36). This means the angels cannot die. Now what are the angels? “Are they not all ministering spirits sent forth to serve, for the sake of those who are to obtain salvation? (Heb 1:14)”
So here, we see that angels, who are spirits, cannot die, which means that the spirit is immortal. And it makes sense that it is immortal, because the spirit is not “composed” of parts but is one single whole and therefore cannot be separated into its composing parts and therefore it cannot die.
Now some may argue that mortality may also refer to complete blotting out of existence. So if a spirit cannot die, perhaps it can cease to existence and in that sense “die”. However, this is also not possible.
“For the gifts and the call of God are irrevocable.” (Rom 11:29)
A gift is something good that is given to someone voluntarily out of good will and not as something that is owed. Our existence itself is God’s great gift to us. Therefore, God will not blot us out of existence, ever.
Death is the separation of a composite being into its composite parts. Man can die because man is a composite being composed of body and soul (also called spirit at times). The soul is the animating principle of the body.
“for they cannot die any more, because they are equal to angels” (Luke 20:36). This means the angels cannot die. Now what are the angels? “Are they not all ministering spirits sent forth to serve, for the sake of those who are to obtain salvation? (Heb 1:14)”
So here, we see that angels, who are spirits, cannot die, which means that the spirit is immortal. And it makes sense that it is immortal, because the spirit is not “composed” of parts but is one single whole and therefore cannot be separated into its composing parts and therefore it cannot die.
Now some may argue that mortality may also refer to complete blotting out of existence. So if a spirit cannot die, perhaps it can cease to existence and in that sense “die”. However, this is also not possible.
“For the gifts and the call of God are irrevocable.” (Rom 11:29)
A gift is something good that is given to someone voluntarily out of good will and not as something that is owed. Our existence itself is God’s great gift to us. Therefore, God will not blot us out of existence, ever.
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PJM
Guest
GREAT question!
Despite others calims not everything is fully articulated in the bible. For example the terms Catholic, bible, protestant, theology and purgatory are NOT found it the bible. Yet each exist in the present time and each has a biblical foundation if rightly understood.
Go back to **Gen. 1:26-27 **where God proclaims to make as is His RIGHT; “man in His own image” Then ask yourself just HOW [and why] God choose to do this.
“God is Spirit and truth”; pure Spirt without gender.**John 4:23 **“But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true adorers shall adore the Father in spirit and in truth. For the Father also seeketh such to adore him.”
Humanity ALONE has the ability to Love God or hate Him. It’s OUR choice.
Because humanity alone has a mind, intellect and FREEWILL permnately attached to our souls. EACH of these, similar to God are “Spiritual Things” and it is precisely in this manner that man ALONE can and does emulate our God.
WHY did God do this?
God answers this question through the Prophet Isaian about 700 years before the Birth of Christ. Isa.43 Verses 7 and 21: “every one who is called by my name, whom I created for my glory, whom I formed and made." AND the people whom I formed for myself that they might declare my praise.”
This last part is the proof you seek about “Eternal Souls”
It’s no secret that all mens bodies will die [except for Mary who was ASSUMED Body and Soul into heaven: …also not speciifc in the bible]; that our bodies die is a FACT. What then spends Eternity in Justice and Fairness of our Perfect Divine God at “the Judgemnt”?
It is the “Spiritual package” that like God [emulation of God] of mind, intellect, and FREEWILL that will either suffer the consequences of our Bad choices or merit the Beatific Vision with God bcause of our Good choices.
EACH of these “spiritual things” in an absolute sense are required for God’s judgment to be completely fulfilled. Each of these “spirital things” are needed both to LOVE and to suffer. So that my friend explains the How and why ALL can know that similar to God; our “spiritual things” can neither die or be killed.
Like God they too are eternal.Let me know if you have further questions?
God Bless,
Pat
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Mystophilus
Guest
No, it doesn’t, hence some people believing in Conditional Immortality.
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Joe_Kelley
Guest
Note the Last Judgement
Matthew 25:41, 46
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Nita
Guest
Ecclesiastes 12:7 and the dust returns to the earth as it was, and** the spirit returns to God who gave it. **
2 Machabees 7:9 And when he was at the last gasp, he said thus: Thou indeed, O most wicked man, destroyest us out of this present life: but the King of the world will raise us up, who die for his laws, in** the resurrection of eternal life**.
Matthew 19:16 And behold, one came up to him, saying, “Teacher, what good deed must I do, to have** eternal life**?” … 19:29 And every one who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or children or lands, for my name’s sake, will receive a hundredfold, and inherit eternal life.
John 3:16 For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.
(See also John 3:16 and 36; 4:14 and 36; 6:27, 40, 47, and 54; 10:28; 12:25
Acts 13:48 …as many as were ordained to life everlasting, believed.
Romans 6:22 …,the return you get is sanctification and its end, eternal life.
Gal 6:8 … but he who sows to the Spirit will from the Spirit reap eternal life.
Titus 3:7 in hope of eternal life which God, who never lies, promised ages ago.
(And there are more. Just do word searches on “eternal”, “everlasting”, “forever”, etc.)
2 Machabees 7:9 And when he was at the last gasp, he said thus: Thou indeed, O most wicked man, destroyest us out of this present life: but the King of the world will raise us up, who die for his laws, in** the resurrection of eternal life**.
Matthew 19:16 And behold, one came up to him, saying, “Teacher, what good deed must I do, to have** eternal life**?” … 19:29 And every one who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or children or lands, for my name’s sake, will receive a hundredfold, and inherit eternal life.
John 3:16 For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.
(See also John 3:16 and 36; 4:14 and 36; 6:27, 40, 47, and 54; 10:28; 12:25
Acts 13:48 …as many as were ordained to life everlasting, believed.
Romans 6:22 …,the return you get is sanctification and its end, eternal life.
Gal 6:8 … but he who sows to the Spirit will from the Spirit reap eternal life.
Titus 3:7 in hope of eternal life which God, who never lies, promised ages ago.
(And there are more. Just do word searches on “eternal”, “everlasting”, “forever”, etc.)
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Mystophilus
Guest
The fire is described as eternal, and the punishment is described as eternal (which annihilation certainly is), but the soul is not. This is precisely why Justin Martyr, in his Dialogue with Trypho, 5-6, and Irenaeus, in his Against Heresies, 2.34.3, claimed that only the sanctified soul would receive the gift of eternal existence. However, their view was later ruled unorthodox.
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Nita
Guest
Re the eternity of hell:
Daniel 12:2 And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
Daniel 12:2 And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
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Mystophilus
Guest
As you say, it shows the eternity of judgement, but not the eternity of the judged.
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Nita
Guest
I disagree.
The passage speaks about what people who are judged will experience.
“many”, “some” – those pronouns refer to people, not judgements. It’s people who will experience everlasting shame and contempt. People cannot rise to experience “everlasting contempt” if they are not everlastingly there!
“…some to shame and everlasting contempt.”
The passage is speaking about what “some” will experience.
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ZhaneAugustine
Guest
Thank you for this… and I shall.GREAT question!
Despite others calims not everything is fully articulated in the bible. For example the terms Catholic, bible, protestant, theology and purgatory are NOT found it the bible. Yet each exist in the present time and each has a biblical foundation if rightly understood.
Go back to **Gen. 1:26-27 **where God proclaims to make as is His RIGHT; “man in His own image” Then ask yourself just HOW [and why] God choose to do this.
“God is Spirit and truth”; pure Spirt without gender.**John 4:23 **“But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true adorers shall adore the Father in spirit and in truth. For the Father also seeketh such to adore him.”
Humanity ALONE has the ability to Love God or hate Him. It’s OUR choice.
Because humanity alone has a mind, intellect and FREEWILL permnately attached to our souls. EACH of these, similar to God are “Spiritual Things” and it is precisely in this manner that man ALONE can and does emulate our God.
WHY did God do this?
God answers this question through the Prophet Isaian about 700 years before the Birth of Christ. Isa.43 Verses 7 and 21: “every one who is called by my name, whom I created for my glory, whom I formed and made." AND the people whom I formed for myself that they might declare my praise.”
This last part is the proof you seek about “Eternal Souls”
It’s no secret that all mens bodies will die [except for Mary who was ASSUMED Body and Soul into heaven: …also not speciifc in the bible]; that our bodies die is a FACT. What then spends Eternity in Justice and Fairness of our Perfect Divine God at “the Judgemnt”?
It is the “Spiritual package” that like God [emulation of God] of mind, intellect, and FREEWILL that will either suffer the consequences of our Bad choices or merit the Beatific Vision with God bcause of our Good choices.
EACH of these “spiritual things” in an absolute sense are required for God’s judgment to be completely fulfilled. Each of these “spirital things” are needed both to LOVE and to suffer. So that my friend explains the How and why ALL can know that similar to God; our “spiritual things” can neither die or be killed.
Let me know if you have further questions?
God Bless,
Pat
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Mystophilus
Guest
Yes, it is talking about people, but it does not say that they will everlastingly experience everlasting contempt; instead, it identifies the contempt, and not the people, as being everlasting.
They can indeed rise to face “everlasting contempt” if they are not everlastingly there. You can have contempt for someone who is unaware of the contempt, is absent, or is dead and gone. Their behaviour can likewise be described as shameful, irrespective of whether they know that or how they feel about it.
Their continued existence is not logically necessitated by that passage.
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Pitcharan
Guest
For God created man incorruptible, and to the image of his own likeness he made him. But by the envy of the devil, death came into the world: And they follow him that are of his side. But the souls of the just are in the hand of God, and the torment of death shall not touch them. In the sight of the unwise they seemed to die: and their departure was taken for misery: And their going away from us, for utter destruction: but they are in peace. And though in the sight of men they suffered torments, their hope is full of immortality. Afflicted in few things, in many they shall be well rewarded: because God hath tried them, and found them worthy of himself. (Wis 2:23-3:5)
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PJM
Guest
YOUR VERY welcome
Pat
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ZhaneAugustine
Guest
Thank you this has been most helpful!
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Protector
Guest
Hello Zhane, that is a good question, and the topic is one that has caused controversy to run hot in the Christian world for many years. The following link puts the topic in the form of a Bible study, and although it is not a Roman Catholic site the material presented has many Scriptural quotes in order to corroborate its’ assertions.
However, my own belief is that the soul is not immortal, based on the following:
***“And the Lord God formed man of the slime of the earth: and breathed into his face the breath of life, and man became a living soul.”
*** Genesis 2:7
This verse, to my way of thinking, presupposes that if man became a living soul when God “breathed into his face the breath of life”, when God subsequently, in the passage of time, removed the breath of life again then the man/soul died, and as our Lord says many times,
"And this is the will of my Father that sent me: that every one who seeth the Son, and believeth in him, may have life everlasting, and I will raise him up in the last day."
So then, it appears that it is only those who, ***" see the Son, and believe in him,…" ***that ***“may have life everlasting” ***(D-R) John 6:40
Code:
[www.mcdonaldroad.org/bible/study/lm-soul.htm](www.mcdonaldroad.org/bible/study/lm-soul.htm)
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mkamoski1
Guest
FWIW, the Catechism Of The Catholic Church (CCC) says the following…
CCC 1703 Endowed with “a spiritual and immortal” soul, the human person is “the only creature on earth that God has willed for its own sake.” From his conception, he is destined for eternal beatitude.
scborromeo.org/ccc/para/1703.htm
…so that is worth noting.
I know the original poster asked about the Bible in particular, but the CCC is also a good resource.
HTH.
God bless you.
– Mark Kamoski
CCC 1703 Endowed with “a spiritual and immortal” soul, the human person is “the only creature on earth that God has willed for its own sake.” From his conception, he is destined for eternal beatitude.
scborromeo.org/ccc/para/1703.htm
…so that is worth noting.
I know the original poster asked about the Bible in particular, but the CCC is also a good resource.
HTH.
God bless you.
– Mark Kamoski
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