Does the Church Attract (Sexual) Divergents?

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switalabe

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Hi CA Community,

I had the opportunity yesterday to discuss religion with a friend. To my dismay, he thinks that religion attracts divergents – really I think he meant “sexual deviants” – and that the Church probably contains a higher percentage of such people than the population at large. He also thinks that the sexual lifestyle prescribed by the Church, i.e. chastity in particular celibate chastity of priests, tends to lead people to sexual deviation, e.g. molestation of minors.

I’m sure this has been discussed quite a bit before, but could I ask for help on answering these claims?

Thanks
Ben
 
He is wrong to think that chastity leads to sexual deviancy. Chastity is guarded by prayer and the grace received in the sacraments.

Some married men are known to be pedophiles.
 
switalabe said:
Hi CA Community,

I had the opportunity yesterday to discuss religion with a friend. To my dismay, he thinks that religion attracts divergents – really I think he meant “sexual deviants” – and that the Church probably contains a higher percentage of such people than the population at large. He also thinks that the sexual lifestyle prescribed by the Church, i.e. chastity in particular celibate chastity of priests, tends to lead people to sexual deviation, e.g. molestation of minors.

I’m sure this has been discussed quite a bit before, but could I ask for help on answering these claims?

Thanks
Ben
Click to expand...
This will probably be moved since it isn’t a news piece (maybe to apologetics) so be aware of that.

There seems to be two separate claims here: that organized religion attracts sexual deviants and that organized religion produces organized deviants.

I don’t think that the former really needs to be answered. I think organized religion attracts all kinds of broken people, and that isn’t a bad thing. In theory (sadly, often not in practice), Christians might be the only people in society that can show people the unconditional love that they deserve as children of God. If you’ve been rejected by everyone else in society, of course you’ll gravitate towards the only people willing to treat you as one of their own. As long as Church’s aren’t encourage their behavior or protecting them if those inclinations lead them to harm others, I think that this is a good thing.

The second claim is more damaging albeit easy to refute. It’s true that the Catholic clergy has had problems with sexual abuse. Those problems don’t appear to be any more severe than experienced by other professions working with children. You’ll have to do the digging, or perhaps someone else has them on hand, but statistically you aren’t in any greater danger in the hands of a Catholic priest than anyone else. Actually, in many case you might be safer.

It’s also worth noting that most sexual abuse happens within the family structure where the perpetrator likely has regular sexual activity (be that through sexual intercourse or masturbation). Furthermore, one of the hotbeds of sexual assaults is the university campus. University students aren’t known for their dedication to chastity, and yet abuse is rampant. This would also suggest that access to sex is not the problem.

I suspect even your friend doesn’t really believe what he’s saying. Are we to believe that any individual not engaged in a sexual relationship is in danger of molesting people? Sure, many Catholics abstain from sex by choice, but what about those individuals who wish they had access to sex but can’t find a partner. Should we lock them in a cell until they find a partner lest his lack of sex transform him into a predator?
 
Well, the Church is a hospital for sinners…and “deviants” are sinners. So if one feels inclined to start the healing process, then I guess the Church attracts “deviants”…🤷
 
MacBP said:
This will probably be moved since it isn’t a news piece (maybe to apologetics) so be aware of that.

There seems to be two separate claims here: that organized religion attracts sexual deviants and that organized religion produces organized deviants.

I don’t think that the former really needs to be answered. I think organized religion attracts all kinds of broken people, and that isn’t a bad thing. In theory (sadly, often not in practice), Christians might be the only people in society that can show people the unconditional love that they deserve as children of God. If you’ve been rejected by everyone else in society, of course you’ll gravitate towards the only people willing to treat you as one of their own. As long as Church’s aren’t encourage their behavior or protecting them if those inclinations lead them to harm others, I think that this is a good thing.

The second claim is more damaging albeit easy to refute. It’s true that the Catholic clergy has had problems with sexual abuse. Those problems don’t appear to be any more severe than experienced by other professions working with children. You’ll have to do the digging, or perhaps someone else has them on hand, but statistically you aren’t in any greater danger in the hands of a Catholic priest than anyone else. Actually, in many case you might be safer.

It’s also worth noting that most sexual abuse happens within the family structure where the perpetrator likely has regular sexual activity (be that through sexual intercourse or masturbation). Furthermore, one of the hotbeds of sexual assaults is the university campus. University students aren’t known for their dedication to chastity, and yet abuse is rampant. This would also suggest that access to sex is not the problem.

I suspect even your friend doesn’t really believe what he’s saying. Are we to believe that any individual not engaged in a sexual relationship is in danger of molesting people? Sure, many Catholics abstain from sex by choice, but what about those individuals who wish they had access to sex but can’t find a partner. Should we lock them in a cell until they find a partner lest his lack of sex transform him into a predator?
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Yes, might as well arrest all the single chaste people, me included, lest we all turn to child molesters.

Conversely, let all the convicted child molesters get married. After all they should be “cured” of their pedophilia.

If some people really believed that, than they should have no problems with a married convicted pedophile being around their children. After all he is married, he should be cured.:rolleyes: Right.
 
The whole concept of recommending marriage to “cure” people or help people control their pedophilia desires is absolutely ludicrous and illogical.
Is this person actually recommending that the church should encourage people who have pedophile desires to enter into marriage instead of helping them live in chastity? What woman would ever desire to be married to a man who is a pedophile? And how can anyone recommend that an adult women should willingly enter into marriage and have intercourse with a pedophile to help cure them of their pedophilia? And don’t these people realize that if the pedophile does enter into marriage that they will likely breed and have children of their own to live with? For a valid marriage to take place wouldn’t it be necessary for a pedophile to disclose his pedophilia desires to his potential marriage partner in order for her to make an informed decision about marrying him? How would this conversation go “hey potential wife, I have impure desires for small children…will you please marry me so that we can have intercourse together, to help me control my impulses?”
Like I said that argument to recommend marriage for pedophiles is ludicrous…the church is wise to recommend celibacy
 
No, but it does get the lion’s share of press. Because there are people out there who would love to see the Church or any good group discredited. It gives them an excuse, and also a license to do as they please. People rebel against legitimate authority on any number of issues, not just being chaste, or being faithful to your spouse, etc. Sin is not confined or specific to any one group of people.
But there are those, most notably, the prince of lies, who would like to see the Church be discredited through this idea.
 
Millie123 – Sarcelle, I hope you don’t mind if I respond to Millie123’s posting for you. Millie123, I believe that Sarcelle was speaking sarcastically in order to prove the same point that you’re advocating (both of which I agree with).

MacBP, thank you for your explanation of why this posting might/will get moved – I thought that this kind of thing is closely related enough to the various news article about sexual abuses in the Church.
 
How do we factor in the claim by Commie-turned-Catholic Bella Dodd that she recruited 1,100 unfit souls to be seminarians? Was the Church pre-loaded? Did the Church “fall” or was she pushed? Dunno. 😊 Pray and fast for our mighty priests to stay faithful and true.
 
switalabe said:
MacBP, thank you for your explanation of why this posting might/will get moved – I thought that this kind of thing is closely related enough to the various news article about sexual abuses in the Church.
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To add to MacBP’s explanation, per the forum guidelines, threads in both news sections must have a title that is the headline of a news article, as well as a link within the original post to said news article. See the sticky at the top of the news section for more info.
 
The Church is a big target. Unfortunately the pedophilia (past and present) is a real and serious problem that rightfully got a ton of press and media attention. IMO it was necessary, to start the healing process. I love the Church but I’m not blind. It’s a horrible scandal and I hope the worst of it is over and I pray that the people who were victimized are healing.

I truly think Pope Benedict XVI stepped down because he learned of even worse things to which the general public will never be privy. He wasn’t prepared for the administration side of being Pope; he was (is) a theologian and didn’t want to be pope anyway, so I always felt bad for him, he was in his 80’s and only wanted to retire and live out his life peacefully. He did so much for the Church and I hope God blesses him for it. I know people think he had a part in covering up some sex scandals, only God knows for sure, but I remember how it was in our own society, in our own families when/if there was a pedophile. WE (society) ALSO covered it up. Molesters were rarely arrested, the adults told us kids to stay away from certain people. And society didn’t have counseling for molestering victims, either, that is fairly new for the past 20-30 years, anyway. So, the Church reacted slowly and inappropriately and I trust God will take care of the ones most culpable.

Pope Francis seems to be cleaning house, I sure hope he is thoroughly successful. I used to not think much of him, but the more history I learn regarding the sex and money scandals, from reliable sources, the more I understand him and the things he says. We’ve never heard a pope say such things! I pray for vocations to religious life and for holy priests, also.
 
switalabe said:
Hi CA Community,

I had the opportunity yesterday to discuss religion with a friend. To my dismay, he thinks that religion attracts divergents – really I think he meant “sexual deviants” – and that the Church probably contains a higher percentage of such people than the population at large. He also thinks that the sexual lifestyle prescribed by the Church, i.e. chastity in particular celibate chastity of priests, tends to lead people to sexual deviation, e.g. molestation of minors.

I’m sure this has been discussed quite a bit before, but could I ask for help on answering these claims?

Thanks
Ben
Click to expand...
He’s the one making the claim. Did you ask him for his proof?
 
Hi Agnes Therese,

No, I didn’t ask him for proof, although in the same conversation this person claimed that he only believes things that have empirical evidence.
 
I think part of the difficulty with this issue is that it involves gathering a lot of data in a scientifically worthy way. I don’t think many people have the education to actually do the research to determine rates of sexual deviations among any particular group of people, so for most people it kind of comes down to putting our faith in scientific authorities. That’s just my figuring.

On the other hand, the Gospel is a little easier to verify – people were around in Israel at the time of Christ, they saw Him, they heard Him, they saw His Miracles. And those people told others about the Gospel, and some people wrote down what had happened. So now we have the evidence of Sacred Scripture and Sacred Tradition, and the Magesterium of the Church, as our evidence for Christ’s life. Again, this is just my own reckoning.

Finally – as my friend used the word “divergent”, and mindful of Veronica Roth’s popular series of books – sure, we can be Divergent! (The Divergent were sort of the “good guys” or heroes of the Divergent series). 😃 😃 😃

(of course I’m pretty sure that my friend meant “deviant” and not “Divergent”)
 
EIF5A said:
Well, the Church is a hospital for sinners…and “deviants” are sinners. So if one feels inclined to start the healing process, then I guess the Church attracts “deviants”…🤷
Click to expand...
I guess my line of thinking was similar to yours. I was thinking this way: shouldn’t the church attract sinners? But then I started reading the conversation thread. Always interesting how a question can be seen in a multifaceted way.
 
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