Does the way annulment works result in de facto divorce?

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Does anyone get remarried when the annulment doesn’t come through? I doubt it.
Sadly, yes, people get the cart before the horse (romance when they do not know if they are free to marry). They have been led to believe that the Tribunal hands out findings of nullity like “I Voted” stickers and then they find out their marriage is valid. In my experience most then marry outside of the Church and walk away from the Sacraments 😦 Prayers that all will return to the Church.
 
Very sad indeed. I realize my question was ambiguous. I was rhetorically asking if anyone gets remarried to their original spouse once they find out they have a valid marriage. But obviously almost nobody does, and that’s part of why the system doesn’t seem to help people find holiness.
 
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Phemie:
the number of those who divorce and don’t ever seek an annulment is quite high.
Yes, it is and fewer Roman Catholic couples are getting married anyway. And at the same time the number of Roman Catholic marriage annulments has skyrocketed since 1930 or since 1940 or since 1950.
There are a greater number of Catholics marrying non-Catholics. Many of those non-Catholics are divorced.

How many are also due to divorced & remarried non-Catholics wanting to become Catholic?

That’s why throwing numbers around is meaningless unless you can put those numbers in context.
 
Maybe this is a bit different, but I do recall once that someone had a question on Ask an Apologist about remarrying the spouse they had divorced. They had never applied for a declaration of nullity. They and their spouse had decided to reconcile. They wanted to know if there was anything they had to do Church-wise in this situation. The apologist advised them that the Church still considers their marriage valid as it was never proven to be otherwise. Consequently all they need is a civil marriage. The apologist suggested they may like to have a formal vow renewal in the Church, but made it clear that this was a renewal only and not a new marriage.
 
I personally, in real life, know two couples where this happened.
 
I don’t usually have to spend much time on it since basically nobody says they didn’t understand that marriage is a permanent relationship or says they couldn’t comprehend what it meant to be in a permanent relationship (permanence, as you note, is not the same as indissolubility).

Be that as it may, I’d say something like this.

Speaking of “maturity to discern” puts us squarely in the terms of canon 1095.2 which says those who suffer from a grave lack of discretion of judgment concerning the essential, matrimonial rights and obligations which are to be mutually given and accepted are incapable of marriage. Like I said earlier, this means that a person who is not able to discern about a choice of marriage cannot marry. It is not a matter of discerning wrongly. It’s a matter of not being able to carry out even a rudimentary examination of what it would mean to be married to so-and-so. Concerning permanence, the person has to be aware of the permanent nature of marriage (i.e., it’s not a temporary relationship with a predetermined expiration date, (cf. c. 1096) and be able to comprehend what it would mean to be in stable relationship with this other person.

If a person is unable to enter into even the basics of this consideration, then he can’t marry. If he has a plan of being in a “marriage relationship” for only a certain length of time, then he was necessarily able to evaluate and discern regarding permanence. So, in such a case, something other than a lack of discretion is going on.

Due to fallen human nature, people act contrary to marital obligations all the time, sometimes in light matters and sometimes in weighty ones. People commit adultery. People restrict the ius in corpus. People separate and divorce. They aren’t necessarily unable to be married, though. As John Paul II said in the 1987 address to the Rota: “Moreover, the breakdown of such a marriage union is never in itself proof of such incapacity on the part of the contracting parties. … (The parties) may have failed to accept the inevitable limitations and burdens of married life, either because of blocks of an unconscious nature or because of slight pathological disturbances which leave substantially intact human freedom, or finally because of failures of the moral order.”

Such actions can be symptoms of a marital incapacity, yes, but that can be symptoms of other defects of consent, too (such as simulation). The determining factor is whether or not the person was suffering from a psychic disorder that made it impossible for him to marry. That happens but is gravely abnormal (both in itself and in comparison to the general population).

Something like that.

Dan
 
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Partners who approach a tribunal for annulment should only do so if they believe the marriage never was one, consider it to have irrevocably failed, left it (and likely remarried).

They surely wouldnt they change their mind it they cannot have that recognised. They may still be right about the invalid marriage… they just cannot provide the high level of evidence needed. This is exactly what the last 2 or 3 Popes have lamented and which Francis went a long way to remediate.
 
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Partners who approach a tribunal for annulment should only do so if they believe the marriage never was one, consider it to have irrevocably failed
I used to agree with this. Then I found myself in a situation where civil divorce was the only option (wife donated hundreds of thousands to the church and tried to kill our young children to return them to Jesus).

Civil divorce is the only mechanism to protect assets and children. The church encouraged and supported this step. The church went on to encourage me to pursue a decree of nullity even though I shared that I believed our long-term marriage to be valid. A few thousand dollars and many months later, and a decree is issued by the tribunal based on statements made while she was manic about a time that dated back to a period more than 20 years prior. I would do absolutely anything for my wife and wish more than anything we could again be married. A deceee of nullity does not mean one stops loving or caring
 
I used to agree with this. Then I found myself in a situation where civil divorce was the only option (wife donated hundreds of thousands to the church and tried to kill our young children to return them to Jesus).

Civil divorce is the only mechanism to protect assets and children. The church encouraged and supported this step. The church went on to encourage me to pursue a decree of nullity even though I shared that I believed our long-term marriage to be valid.
Sorry to hear about this tragic past situation.

Not quite sure why you are disagreeing with me?
If you believe your marriage was valid it is surely immoral for you to directly personally and knowingly seek that it be annulled. Why would you let anybody else convince you to do so re your own marriage that they never lived and cannot possibly understand as well as you do.

In any case what was the point? You may civilly divorce without an annulment for the very reasons you stated. Catholics call that Separation not a “Church Divorce”.

If your wife sought the annulment and you cooperated (though advising all that you considered the marriage valid) that is acceptable. The marriage may indeed have been objectively invalid and your view is mistaken. However you must act personally on your own view and not seek an annulment for yourself if you firmly believe it was valid.

Perhaps I have missed something…
It sounds like the Priest was wanting you to regularise your subsequent new marriage that you havent mentioned perhaps?
 
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No subsequent marriage (though I’m now free to do so). Just acknowledging that there are situations where an annulment can be sought and received even after knowing a spouse for their entire life. There are technicalities that many people raise when seeking a decree of nullity that are wholly unrelated to the demise of a marriage. In my case, my wife (or whatever I’m now to call her) who believes she is pregnant with the next coming of Jesus, hasn’t stepped foot outside her house in a year but isn’t sick enough to meet the involuntary commitment criteria of being an ‘imminent risk to herself or orhers’. From my lens, the Catholic annulment process represents a mechanism to regularize divorce in unusual circumstances.

I’m very close with her siblings and parents who want me to move on to seek out love again. Time will tell
 
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So apart from being told by a priest to seek an annulment why did you do so when a civil Divorce did all that was required and you did not believe your marriage was invalid?
 
Because anyone could be afflicted by a terrible illness; it could have been me and that’s what I would’ve wanted her to have done.To have another chance at having a partner, a parent for our children, love. Without an annulment, none of those things are possible
 
If you believe your marriage was valid it is surely immoral for you to directly personally and knowingly seek that it be annulled. Why would you let anybody else convince you to do so re your own marriage that they never lived and cannot possibly understand as well as you do.
For the same reason that we do not diagnose ourselves with illness from reading symptoms in a book or online.

The Tribunal is people who are well trained, experienced, objective, who undertake a thankless and emotionally difficult job.
 
You originally stated your marriage, despite needing to divorce civilly, to be valid before God.
Now you say you needed “experts” to make that decision for you.

Sorry, but if you believed your marriage was valid, and the civil divorce protected you and the kids…then it does seem you went too far in amputating the leg as well when it wasnt actually necessary and you personally felt it was intrinsically non gangrenous to boot.
One should not approach a surgeon for removal if your own experience tells you that your present medical interventions worked and no further harm would come…despite the more remote “advice” of experts. That is spiritual mutilation it seems to me.
 
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Continuing to cast dispersions on the authority of a Competent Tribunal is a slippery slope. Either God gave the authority to the Bishops or he did not.
 
I do not believe God gave fallible tribunals the confessional authority you seem to credit it with.

If you firmly believe you were validly married before then you may not marry again even if a tribunal comes to that decision. The new one may be a valid marriage technically but you would be violating your own conscience and so malicing God. This is basic moral theology.
 
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Continuing to cast dispersions on the authority of a Competent Tribunal is a slippery slope. Either God gave the authority to the Bishops or he did not.
The Eastern Orthodox believe that they have the authority to grant a divorce under certain conditions. Generally, they don’t use the annulment process.
 
Are you saying that there’s a scenario where the tribunal would issue a decree of nullity, says you’re free to marry, but that you’re never free to marry because you felt your marriage was sacramental?
 
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If the EO and Rome agreed on everything, the Schism would end 🙂

The EO teaches that authority is given to the Church, it is simply administered in a different manner.

Seems that one poster here denies that the Church universal has any authority with regard to the validity of marriages.
 
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