Does this mean I am excummunicated

[cyberwolf001]

So a close friend of mine is getting an abortion.

I didn’t see a point in arguing with her and asked her about where it was, what the facilities are like ect. As if she was just going to a new dentist to get a cavity fixed.

I wished her luck and told her to take care of herself. All the while knowing the church teachings on abortion.

So I just thought about this. I have all but told her to go do it and didn’t say a word to stop her…

Does this mean I need to make an appointment with my Bishop?

 

[1ke]

Well, it’s not too late to contact her, offer her assistance, and take her to a crisis pregnancy center. Certainly you could have and should have spoken up-- and still should. Many women are hoping someone will stop them, and when people don’t step up it confirms their sense of hopelessness.

You need to speak up.

But, no, you are not excommunicated. Excommunication requires direct participation in procuring an abortion.

If you feel you need to, mention your reluctance to speak up in your next confession.

 

[jmcrae]

If you had driven her to the appointment, you would be culpable.

But yes, you should have spoken up. She was probably telling you about it because she wanted you to talk her out of it.

If it’s not too late, call her now, and ask her if you can meet somewhere neutral to talk - you can still save that little child’s life.

 

[teachccd]

My son has a good friend (not his girlfriend) who was planning to have an abortion. I prompted him to do whatever was necessary to talk her out of it. The father was pushing for the abortion because like any jerk he just wanted this “problem” to go away. My son, like myself, is also totally against abortion and did do everything in his power to talk her out of it. I prayed and asked everyone that I knew to pray for her and the baby. She ended up not having the abortion but unfortunately lost the baby a few weeks later.

While you are not excommunicated, you still have as much a concern as you would if your friend told you that next week she would drown her two year old in the bathtub. She is murdering her child. Your relationship with this person should include her wellbeing. Almost no woman, that I’ve heard of, walks away without tremendous regrets after an abortion.

I will pray that God gives you the strength to do what you can and for her and the baby…God Bless…teachccd

 

[cyberwolf001]

Are you sure? I mean I know of the nine ways we participate in anothers sin.

An I know I am guilty of silence and counsel. As I said I did everything but say GO DO IT! As to the abortion it is a done deal.

 

[jmcrae]

Are you sure? I mean I know of the nine ways we participate in anothers sin.

An I know I am guilty of silence and counsel. As I said I did everything but say GO DO IT! As to the abortion it is a done deal.

You do need to go to Confession, for the omission to do a good act that would save someone’s life - what you originally asked was whether you are excommunicated. No, you are not. (Excommunication would mean that you have no access to the Sacraments, including Confession.)

You can still go to Confession, and be absolved of this serious sin, and you should do it as soon as possible.

 

[teachccd]

Are you sure? I mean I know of the nine ways we participate in anothers sin.

An I know I am guilty of silence and counsel. As I said I did everything but say GO DO IT! As to the abortion it is a done deal.

How do you feel about abortion? Was your intent to not “stir the pot”? Are you lukewarm regarding abortion and didn’t say anything because it didn’t matter to you one way or the other??

Does it really bother you now because a life was taken or just because you think that you incurred a sin?

What was YOUR intention for not expressing concern? These questions are valid in order for you to form a conscience that aligns with the will of God.

If you could have a “do over” what would you do??

 

[cyberwolf001]

hmm I was taught when excommunicated confession is the only sacrament you have access to. SO LONG as your there to ask forgiveness for the sin you where excommunicated for…

Now I am confessed I’ll have to speak to my priest.

 

[teachccd]

hmm I was taught when excommunicated confession is the only sacrament you have access to. SO LONG as your there to ask forgiveness for the sin you where excommunicated for…

Now I am confessed I’ll have to speak to my priest.

It’s probably best that you do. Review my questions in my previous post. It will help you discern what is necessary to discuss with your priest…teachccd

 

[jmcrae]

hmm I was taught when excommunicated confession is the only sacrament you have access to. SO LONG as your there to ask forgiveness for the sin you where excommunicated for…

Now I am confessed I’ll have to speak to my priest.

No, Confession is for when we are in mortal sin. Mortal sin is bad, but not as bad as excommunication.

Excommunication means you can no longer participate in any Sacrament whatsoever; that’s why you have to go and see the Bishop, so that he can reinstate you to the Sacraments. After that, then you go to Confession (usually with the Bishop), and then you are back into full communion with the Church.

 

[teachccd]

No, Confession is for when we are in mortal sin. Mortal sin is bad, but not as bad as excommunication.

I never quite heard it put that way before.:dts: Mortal sin is bad but not as bad as… Mortal sin is a total separation from God and if left unrepented it results in eternal hell. There’s worse than that??

 

[1ke]

I never quite heard it put that way before.:dts: Mortal sin is bad but not as bad as… Mortal sin is a total separation from God and if left unrepented it results in eternal hell. There’s worse than that??

I think that what the poster intended was to communicate that when one is in mortal sin, one can remedy it with Confession to a priest-- a fairly routine and easily accomplished task.

When one is excommunicated, one must be reconciled through the Bishop-- a more complex and formal process (with the exception of those places where the Bishop has delegated the power to priests to life excommunication vis a vis abortion).

 

[Joe_Kelley]

No, Confession is for when we are in mortal sin. Mortal sin is bad, but not as bad as excommunication.

Excommunication means you can no longer participate in any Sacrament whatsoever; that’s why you have to go and see the Bishop, so that he can reinstate you to the Sacraments. After that, then you go to Confession (usually with the Bishop), and then you are back into full communion with the Church.

It depends on the reason for the excommunication, some are reserved to the Pope. However, one should start with a priest in confession. In many cases, including excommunication for abortion, priests already have been delegated by the bishop to remove the excommunication. Otherwise, the confessor will send the details, under proper seal * to the proper authority [diocese or Vatican] which will delegate him to act in that specific case.*

 

[teachccd]

I think that what the poster intended was to communicate that when one is in mortal sin, one can remedy it with Confession to a priest-- a fairly routine and easily accomplished task.

When one is excommunicated, one must be reconciled through the Bishop-- a more complex and formal process (with the exception of those places where the Bishop has delegated the power to priests to life excommunication vis a vis abortion).

I know. It just came off as if mortal sin could not be as bad as it gets. But your clarification is indeed what the poster intended…God Bless…teachccd

 

[jmcrae]

I never quite heard it put that way before.:dts: Mortal sin is bad but not as bad as… Mortal sin is a total separation from God and if left unrepented it results in eternal hell. There’s worse than that??

You can come home from mortal sin more easily than you can come home from excommunication.

All sin, including venial sin, is bad.

If you die with venial sin on your soul, you will also go to Hell. But it is so easy to come home from venial sin that it is extremely unlikely that any Catholic would die with venial sin on his/her soul - one single drop of holy water washes it away.

It is less easy to come home from mortal sin, because you have to go to a priest in the Confessional.

And it is even less easy to come home from excommunication, because you have to make an appointment with the Bishop and go through several steps.

 

[jj2011]

Are you sure? I mean I know of the nine ways we participate in anothers sin.

An I know I am guilty of silence and counsel. As I said I did everything but say GO DO IT! As to the abortion it is a done deal.

It’s good that you understand the seriousness of whatever you said, but you are NOT excommunicated. Canonical penalties are very specific and narrowly interpreted, and in this case the excommunication applies to those who procure the abortion. This in no way implies that other forms of cooperation are not a serious sin.

 

[teachccd]

If you die with venial sin on your soul, you will also go to Hell. But it is so easy to come home from venial sin that it is extremely unlikely that any Catholic would die with venial sin on his/her soul - one single drop of holy water washes it away.

.

And purgatory is for ???

 

[Joe_Kelley]

. . If you die with venial sin on your soul, you will also go to Hell. . . …

Mortal sin is a radical possibility of human freedom, as is love itself. It results in the loss of charity and the privation of sanctifying grace, that is, of the state of grace. If it is not redeemed by repentance and God’s forgiveness, it causes exclusion from Christ’s kingdom and the eternal death of hell, for our freedom has the power to make choices for ever, with no turning back. However, although we can judge that an act is in itself a grave offense, we must entrust judgment of persons to the justice and mercy of God.

1862 One commits venial sin when, in a less serious matter, he does not observe the standard prescribed by the moral law, or when he disobeys the moral law in a grave matter, but without full knowledge or without complete consent.

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")">1863 Venial sin weakens charity; it manifests a disordered affection for created goods; it impedes the soul’s progress in the exercise of the virtues and the practice of the moral good; it merits temporal punishment. Deliberate and unrepented venial sin disposes us little by little to commit mortal sin. However venial sin does not break the covenant with God. With God’s grace it is humanly reparable. "Venial sin does not deprive the sinner of sanctifying grace, friendship with God, charity, and consequently eternal happiness."134

While he is in the flesh, man cannot help but have at least some light sins. But do not despise these sins which we call “light”: if you take them for light when you weigh them, tremble when you count them. A number of light objects makes a great mass; a number of drops fills a river; a number of grains makes a heap. What then is our hope? Above all, confession. . . .135

Catechism 1861-3

 

[jmcrae]

And purgatory is for ???

Healing the wounds of sin. Not sin itself - not even venial sin. All sin, of every kind, must be washed away before death. But sin leaves behind wounds, and these wounds must be healed before we can go to Heaven.

 

[revelations]

But having just venial sin does not merit a clear highway to hell. It’s straight out of the cathecism! Purgatory is to exact the cleansing that we all require before entering heaven, to pay every last penny as it were, for our fallen state and the things that are sins that we never even thought about!

From the catechism:

Mortal sin unrepented ==> Highway to hell
Venial sin ==> Temporal punishment

I always understood the venial sin was bad because it is very small sins that often lead up to a grave mortal sin. It’s the mortal sins you have to worry about fixing first. Confession and penance brings full forgiveness, but the woundedness still remains and that’s what you have to watch out for.