Does What Some Catholics Believe About Genesis Keep You From Converting?

[Steve40]

In recent years many within the Church hierarchy and within the Catholic Church general have compromised on a secular view of the interpretation of Genesis chapter 1 through 3. This concerns me because I believe it is an inaccurate view and hinders thinking individuals from converting to the Catholic faith.

There are many, and the numbers are growing, that believe there is no reason not to take a literal view of Genesis Chapters 1 through 3. This understanding is rooted in the Catholic guidance on the study of Sacred Scripture given to us by St. Augustine and reiterated by Pope Leo XIII in an Encyclical letter Providencious Deus. Unless it is proven otherwise, Catholics must believe what the Bible says. No alternate view of Creation has been proven so by this direction Catholics actually have to believe in a literal Creation in the Bible.

God can cutoff the modernists and graft on the Creation believing Protestants. Please come on in and don’t check your Creationism at the door. Those who came before you into the Catholic faith are helping to bring about this renewal within the Church and you can help too.

 

[Delta2]

Creationism vs Evolucionism

I quote the Pope Benedict XVI :

They are presented as alternatives that exclude each other," the Pope said. “This clash is an absurdity because on one hand there is much scientific proof in favour of evolution, which appears as a reality that we must see and which enriches our understanding of life and being as such.”

But he said evolution did not answer all the questions. “Above all it does not answer the great philosophical question ‘where does everything come from?’”

Source

I have the same thoughts

Religion and Science doesn’t have to be incompatible

COLLINS, Francis

The Scientist responsible of the Human Genome Project, In his book, The Language of God

Defended that type of view

I’m no trouble to fit Genesis in Evolucionism, but of course I don’t interpret it literally

I thing believing in a TREE and a APPLE, literally, is a complete nonsense.

What I think, and believe in in the theory of Intelligent Design

====
This theory says :

The Evolutionism and Natural Selection, could be true, and if it is really true, THEN ALL ACTIONS IN THAT MATTER were not casual, they didn’t occurred only by change

• The science didn’t answered all the questions about the ADN or RNA molecules being a spontaneous creation of nature

The odds of accidentally forming that first single DNA strand is a billion trillion, whatever…a number something astronomic and almost impossible to occur only by chance and accident

Was God who determined and guided the Evolucionism in a single direction : create the man as His image

APPLE AND TREE, is just a analogy of a SIN MADE BY DISOBEDIENCE

The first man or woman, could have been a homo sapiens tribe with few members, the precursors of all modern humans, somehow disobeyed God

Perhaps they wanted to do something that there were not ready to do because of being immature, challenging God

 

[Steve40]

Creationism vs Evolucionism

I quote the Pope Benedict XVI :

They are presented as alternatives that exclude each other," the Pope said. “This clash is an absurdity because on one hand there is much scientific proof in favour of evolution, which appears as a reality that we must see and which enriches our understanding of life and being as such.”

But he said evolution did not answer all the questions. “Above all it does not answer the great philosophical question ‘where does everything come from?’”

Source

I didn’t want to mention names within the Church hierarchy but what Bible believing Catholics and Christians need to understand is that this is in no way an infallible statement and I would say it is out right false. Notice how the Pope failed to mention what the evidence of evolution is. This is the Pope’s personal opinion and Catholics are not bound to it. Because the Pope believes evolution is proven he thinks he is within the guidance of St. Augustine and Pope Leo XIII. We can and must not base our view of Scripture upon theory which is here today and gone tomorrow.

If you are Protestant and this statement from the Pope troubles you. Take heart in that the Holy Spirit has guided you to the truth and perhaps He is calling you into the Catholic Church to help the Holy Pontiff understand the true meaning of the beginning of Sacred Scripture
.

 

[swariffin]

Dear all,

Do you believe that the first human in just one single human only, called Adam? And the second human would be a single human similar to the first but has different sex called Eve? I am afraid that the creation story in the Genesis does not necessarily means that the creation went exactly as described. The Creation story in the Genesis is a reflection of the mind of ancient people who has no access of modern science and technology. The creation story is the reflection of their Theology (not scientific or technology) about the love of God who created everything for human.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

In recent years many within the Church hierarchy and within the Catholic Church general have compromised on a secular view of the interpretation of Genesis chapter 1 through 3. This concerns me because I believe it is an inaccurate view and hinders thinking individuals from converting to the Catholic faith.

There are many, and the numbers are growing, that believe there is no reason not to take a literal view of Genesis Chapters 1 through 3. This understanding is rooted in the Catholic guidance on the study of Sacred Scripture given to us by St. Augustine and reiterated by Pope Leo XIII in an Encyclical letter Providencious Deus. Unless it is proven otherwise, Catholics must believe what the Bible says. No alternate view of Creation has been proven so by this direction Catholics actually have to believe in a literal Creation in the Bible.

God can cutoff the modernists and graft on the Creation believing Protestants. Please come on in and don’t check your Creationism at the door. Those who came before you into the Catholic faith are helping to bring about this renewal within the Church and you can help too.

HMMMM–this was never an issuee for me with the CC. I have always believed Genesis 1-3 as literal. Even when I was a non-believer I still believed this really happened the way God sais it did. Funny HUH
Actually doesnt the CC have2-3 ways caths are permitted to interpret creation?

 

[Ted_in_Charlott]

I would use the account of Genesis as a way to convert those that believe Sola Scriptura. The universe is a wonderfully complex thing, so God created the Church to interpet the Bible. At the time of Bible writings, men were vastly limited in ways to describe things, analize things and understand things. As knowledge and wisdom increase, Catholics are not limited to a few verses in Genesis to describe every little nuance. Some people want to hear about quarks, black holes, super strings and quantum theories, so the Church can give guidance to all these incredible things as we discover more and more. However, the first verse “In the beginning, God…” is all alot of people need to know. And the Church can help them too.

Another stumbling block about Genesis is, IMHO, it was not ever intended to be a science textbook, but “God’s redemption story” with some history to back it up. We can assume there are no material errors, but descriptions that were more pertinent to men at the time of it’s writing. Phrases, expressions, lingo of the times are even today misinterpeted by some, that’s another reason to use the Church to interpet the Bible.

 

[Yerusalyim]

In recent years many within the Church hierarchy and within the Catholic Church general have compromised on a secular view of the interpretation of Genesis chapter 1 through 3. This concerns me because I believe it is an inaccurate view and hinders thinking individuals from converting to the Catholic faith.

There are many, and the numbers are growing, that believe there is no reason not to take a literal view of Genesis Chapters 1 through 3. This understanding is rooted in the Catholic guidance on the study of Sacred Scripture given to us by St. Augustine and reiterated by Pope Leo XIII in an Encyclical letter Providencious Deus. Unless it is proven otherwise, Catholics must believe what the Bible says. No alternate view of Creation has been proven so by this direction Catholics actually have to believe in a literal Creation in the Bible.

God can cutoff the modernists and graft on the Creation believing Protestants. Please come on in and don’t check your Creationism at the door. Those who came before you into the Catholic faith are helping to bring about this renewal within the Church and you can help too.

A Catholic is quite free to believe a Creationist understanding of Genesis if they so desire and be good Catholics. Further, Catholics are free to believe in creationary evolution as well and still be good Catholics. If you let that fact of freedom stop you from joining the Church you have other issues as well.

 

[ralphinal]

I would use the account of Genesis as a way to convert those that believe Sola Scriptura. The universe is a wonderfully complex thing, so God created the Church to interpet the Bible. At the time of Bible writings, men were vastly limited in ways to describe things, analize things and understand things. As knowledge and wisdom increase, Catholics are not limited to a few verses in Genesis to describe every little nuance. Some people want to hear about quarks, black holes, super strings and quantum theories, so the Church can give guidance to all these incredible things as we discover more and more. However, the first verse “In the beginning, God…” is all alot of people need to know. And the Church can help them too.

Another stumbling block about Genesis is, IMHO, it was not ever intended to be a science textbook, but “God’s redemption story” with some history to back it up. We can assume there are no material errors, but descriptions that were more pertinent to men at the time of it’s writing. Phrases, expressions, lingo of the times are even today misinterpeted by some, that’s another reason to use the Church to interpet the Bible.

Excellent post.

 

[Contarini]

In recent years many within the Church hierarchy and within the Catholic Church general have compromised on a secular view of the interpretation of Genesis chapter 1 through 3. This concerns me because I believe it is an inaccurate view and hinders thinking individuals from converting to the Catholic faith.

It is not my experience that people who take a literal view of Genesis are more likely to be “thinking individuals” than those who do not. Creationist Protestants are generally characterized by intellectual shallowness if not downright anti-intellectualism. I will grant you that there are thinking people who take a very conservative (not a knee-jerk literal) view of Genesis. But the Catholic Church’s position does not by and large hinder thinking people from converting. It hinders people attached to blind literalism from converting. That may not be a bad thing.

For me, the Catholic Church’s stance on biblical scholarship–thoughtfully conservative without resorting to knee-jerk fundamentalism–is a huge attraction. But perhaps I am not a “thinking individual”?

Edwin

 

[Steve40]

Dear all,

Do you believe that the first human in just one single human only, called Adam? And the second human would be a single human similar to the first but has different sex called Eve? I am afraid that the creation story in the Genesis does not necessarily means that the creation went exactly as described. The Creation story in the Genesis is a reflection of the mind of ancient people who has no access of modern science and technology. The creation story is the reflection of their Theology (not scientific or technology) about the love of God who created everything for human.

You bring up some good points as to why the Catholic Faith is not compatible with evolution. Those who believe in Creation as described in the Bible can take heart. As a Catholic we are dogmatically required to believe that Eve physically came from Adam and all humanity physically came from Adam and Eve. The Church has condemned the heresy of polygeism that says humanity came from multiple parents.

The dogma of all humanity coming from Adam and Eve is scientifically not compatible with the evolutionary model. For this reason all Catholics should not be so quick to reconcile the Faith with an unproven scientific theory.

I believe that Protestant converts can help break the hold that modernism and a false naturalistic secular view have gained upon the Church. The gates of Hell shall not prevail against Her.

 

[Steve40]

HMMMM–this was never an issuee for me with the CC. I have always believed Genesis 1-3 as literal. Even when I was a non-believer I still believed this really happened the way God sais it did. Funny HUH
Actually doesnt the CC have2-3 ways caths are permitted to interpret creation?

I’m glad it was never an issue for you. Thank you for joining the Church.

Steve

 

[Trinitarian]

I didn’t want to mention names within the Church hierarchy but what Bible believing Catholics and Christians need to understand is that this is in no way an infallible statement and I would say it is out right false. Notice how the Pope failed to mention what the evidence of evolution is. This is the Pope’s personal opinion and Catholics are not bound to it. Because the Pope believes evolution is proven he thinks he is within the guidance of St. Augustine and Pope Leo XIII. We can and must not base our view of Scripture upon theory which is here today and gone tomorrow.

If you are Protestant and this statement from the Pope troubles you. Take heart in that the Holy Spirit has guided you to the truth and perhaps He is calling you into the Catholic Church to help the Holy Pontiff understand the true meaning of the beginning of Sacred Scripture
.

Wow! What a cutting remark about the Holy Father.

To preface my response, I am a convert and part of my conversion is based on the level of education and understanding of scripture our priest and bishops demonstrate, not to mention the athority of the church to define the faith without error!

Firstly, it is no disrespect to Sacred Scripture to read the books for their meaning and not for a rigidly literal interpretation which teaches ideas that were never intended. The text is not a scientific theses on or even a history of creation. It is more like a set of beautiful stories meant to be a homily about God’s ordered, care-filled and personal operation in creation.

Also, the literal interpretation is not needed to support the validity of scripture. The Holy Father would be the first to explain that scripture is without error but that testifies only to the truth of scripture. The bible is Truth but it need not to be completely factual. Case in point, the two creation stories tell two different stories. Chapter 1- 2:5 tells one story and 2:6 begins a second story. The facts of these two tells are different. In one Man is created last, in the other Man is created then the animals are created. The fact is Man cannot be the last creation and be created before the animals. It is better to see what theology each story tells about God, man and the nature of sin.

My final thought has far less to do with evolution and far more to do with Apostolic Succession. If you are a protestant and want to join the Holy Church, then good for you and us. We welcome all who would join us in faith, but the Church is the pillar and foundation of truth, if you are looking to correct the Holy Father’s interpretation of scripture then you do not understand the Church or scripture. It is a great pride indeed to think you understand scripture better then Pope Benedict.

 

[HashemEchad]

This is one area I’m not sure about when it comes to Catholic theology.

I was always under the impression that traditional Catholicism believes, as does Orthodox Judaism, that the universe was created ex nihilo (out of nothing).

Has Vatican II changed any of that? What IS the ACTUAL TRADITIONAL Catholic view on evolution as Darwin taught it?

Although I’m Jewish, I use (for convenience,financial and other reasons) a Traditional Catholic homeschool curriculum, just omitting the religious books---- olvs.org and their view seems to fit with mine, that Intelligent Design is right, and Darwinism is wrong.

 

[Contarini]

This is one area I’m not sure about when it comes to Catholic theology.

I was always under the impression that traditional Catholicism believes, as does Orthodox Judaism, that the universe was created ex nihilo (out of nothing).

Has Vatican II changed any of that? What IS the ACTUAL TRADITIONAL Catholic view on evolution as Darwin taught it?

What does creation ex nihilo have to do with Darwinism? Darwinism is about how one life form develops from another. It has nothing to do with how the universe was created in the first place.

Edwin

 

[Trinitarian]

I was always under the impression that traditional Catholicism believes, as does Orthodox Judaism, that the universe was created ex nihilo

That is the official teaching. That fact is what every Catholic is bound to believe. The Church has no doctrine past that point, except that the creation of man was exceptional in some way so that he reflects God’s image. The specifics are not a matter of the faith.

 

[HashemEchad]

What does creation ex nihilo have to do with Darwinism? Darwinism is about how one life form develops from another. It has nothing to do with how the universe was created in the first place.

Edwin

What does the traditional RCC believe then, about BOTH the creation of the world and how old it is, and Darwinism?

Because the impression I have gotten from Traditionalist Cathollics is that their view is the same as mine, whereas the impression I’ve gotten from post-V2 Catholics is more in line with a theistic evolutionary belief.

 

[Namesake]

In recent years many within the Church hierarchy and within the Catholic Church general have compromised on a secular view of the interpretation of Genesis chapter 1 through 3. This concerns me because I believe it is an inaccurate view and hinders thinking individuals from converting to the Catholic faith.

There are many, and the numbers are growing, that believe there is no reason not to take a literal view of Genesis Chapters 1 through 3. This understanding is rooted in the Catholic guidance on the study of Sacred Scripture given to us by St. Augustine and reiterated by Pope Leo XIII in an Encyclical letter Providencious Deus. Unless it is proven otherwise, Catholics must believe what the Bible says. No alternate view of Creation has been proven so by this direction Catholics actually have to believe in a literal Creation in the Bible.

God can cutoff the modernists and graft on the Creation believing Protestants. Please come on in and don’t check your Creationism at the door. Those who came before you into the Catholic faith are helping to bring about this renewal within the Church and you can help too.

Are you also a geocentrist?

 

[josephdaniel29]

In recent years many within the Church hierarchy and within the Catholic Church general have compromised on a secular view of the interpretation of Genesis chapter 1 through 3. This concerns me because I believe it is an inaccurate view and hinders thinking individuals from converting to the Catholic faith.

There are many, and the numbers are growing, that believe there is no reason not to take a literal view of Genesis Chapters 1 through 3. This understanding is rooted in the Catholic guidance on the study of Sacred Scripture given to us by St. Augustine and reiterated by Pope Leo XIII in an Encyclical letter Providencious Deus. Unless it is proven otherwise, Catholics must believe what the Bible says. No alternate view of Creation has been proven so by this direction Catholics actually have to believe in a literal Creation in the Bible.

God can cutoff the modernists and graft on the Creation believing Protestants. Please come on in and don’t check your Creationism at the door. Those who came before you into the Catholic faith are helping to bring about this renewal within the Church and you can help too.

I only have one question…what does any of that have to do with your salvation?

 

[mozart-250]

In recent years many within the Church hierarchy and within the Catholic Church general have compromised on a secular view of the interpretation of Genesis chapter 1 through 3. This concerns me because I believe it is an inaccurate view and hinders thinking individuals from converting to the Catholic faith.

There are many, and the numbers are growing, that believe there is no reason not to take a literal view of Genesis Chapters 1 through 3. This understanding is rooted in the Catholic guidance on the study of Sacred Scripture given to us by St. Augustine and reiterated by Pope Leo XIII in an Encyclical letter Providencious Deus. Unless it is proven otherwise, Catholics must believe what the Bible says. No alternate view of Creation has been proven so by this direction Catholics actually have to believe in a literal Creation in the Bible.

God can cutoff the modernists and graft on the Creation believing Protestants. Please come on in and don’t check your Creationism at the door. Those who came before you into the Catholic faith are helping to bring about this renewal within the Church and you can help too.

Is my understanding on the position of the Catholic church correct…that it does not take an issue on the specifics of creation…that the only item that it is dogmatic about is that Adam and Eve were literal people and that the fall of man in the garden was a literal event.

If my understanding here is correct, then I don’t have any issues here. I’m somewhere between a progressive old-earth creationist (or maybe even gap theory) and a theological evolutionist myself. In short, I’m not sure of the specifics myself.

But perhaps this is my closet liberal that is coming out here and the most literal interpretation of the Bible in respect to origins is correct…that being of course a flat earth.

 

[MelanieAnne]

What does creation ex nihilo have to do with Darwinism? Darwinism is about how one life form develops from another. It has nothing to do with how the universe was created in the first place.

Edwin

Unfortunately, too many people don’t know/understand this. It always seems to be a choice between “descended from apes” and “creationism”. Both are problematic when it comes to understanding the origins of life. Reconciling that understanding (whatever it is) to the scriptures just adds to the problem. And at least when it comes to Darwinism, “descended from apes” is not accurate.

It’s presented as a bit of a joke, but the trailer for Ben Stein’s most recent movie makes a valid point…