Does your parish give "pride of place" to Gregorian chant?

[VociMike]

As called for by Vatican II? Or is it at least heading in that direction? If not, why not? (if you don’t know why not, perhaps you’d like to speculate)

 

[Catholicben]

I believe our parish is working that way. We (the choir) has been doing the introit before most of the Sunday masses, in addition to little bits of chant here and there.

 

[OraLabora]

Around here? Are you kidding? It’s all but dead.

But not quite. I am an oblate of a Benedictine abbey that uses it daily (and it’s where I usually attend Sunday Mass). And I sing in a small schola that rotates around different parishes in Sherbrooke, Quebec, 1x per month and we do only Gregorian chant (with one minor exception: we do the responsorial psalm in French plainchant instead of the gradual, and we use a French antiphon on a Gregorian mode).

So while it is still used in a couple of places, it is very much on life support.

 

[corsair]

Our FSSP parish is into Gregorian chant “big time”. But our local NO parish can’t and won’t even say “et com spiritu tuo” (except at Lent). Try chant? are you serious? Just give the troops about 4 old hymns.

Even the priest is a little discouraged. I asked him, “who’s the boss aroundhere?” He is too politically correct.

 

[jpjd]

The only time I’ve heard Gregorian chant is on a CD. I’ve NEVER heard it at any Mass I’ve ever been to in my life.

 

[OraLabora]

The only time I’ve heard Gregorian chant is on a CD. I’ve NEVER heard it at any Mass I’ve ever been to in my life.

It truly breaks my heart to hear this.

If ever you come to Quebec, I know at least 4 choirs (one of which I sing in) that do use it at Mass on a regular (but not daily or weekly) basis, as well as two Benedictine abbeys (one of women, one of men) that use it daily.

I’ve also been to Masses in Italy that use it, more notably at Monte Cassino, the abbey that St. Benedict founded.

And last week I was at a funeral Mass that was an Ordinary Form Requiem Mass entirely in Latin with Gregorian Chant.

 

[Phemie]

You’re kidding, right? If I want to hear Gregorian chant I put on an album.

I don’t think we have anyone in our choir who knows enough, if anything, about Gregorian chant to be able to even introduce the concept and Fr. is certainly not going to. He thinks Carey Landry is good Mass music.

 

[Phemie]

It truly breaks my heart to hear this.

If ever you come to Quebec, I know at least 4 choirs (one of which I sing in) that do use it at Mass on a regular (but not daily or weekly) basis, as well as two Benedictine abbeys (one of women, one of men) that use it daily.

I’ve also been to Masses in Italy that use it, more notably at Monte Cassino, the abbey that St. Benedict founded.

And last week I was at a funeral Mass that was an Ordinary Form Requiem Mass entirely in Latin with Gregorian Chant.

Where in Quebec? When I travel to Ottawa I’m usually in Quebec on a Sunday so I would certainly plan to attend Mass there.

 

[OraLabora]

Where in Quebec? When I travel to Ottawa I’m usually in Quebec on a Sunday so I would certainly plan to attend Mass there.

For Mass, you can attend at Sainte-Marie-des-Deux-Montagnes, Benedictine women in Deux-Montagnes, on the outskirts of Montreal (near Oka). The women sing very well; Mass is usually presided by Dom André Saint-Cyr, a monk from Saint-Benoît-du-Lac. He sings the Mass and is very good. They use Gregorian chant every day, for the propers and Kyriale and French for the rest, but twice a week they do the entire Mass (OF) in Latin.

Saint-Benoît-du-Lac, near Magog, QC, is a Benedictine men’s abbey, and I am an oblate of there. They sing Gregorian chant (propers and kyriale) every day for Mass as well as Lauds and Vespers. The rest of the Mass is in French plainchant, and the other offices are in French plainchant except for the hymn and short responsories which are in Latin Gregorian chant.

For our choir, it varies, if ever you come to Sherbrooke, QC, I can provide you with our schedule, usually we sing at Saturday vigil Masses. Our next one is for Pentecost, next Saturday evening at 4 pm.

The choirs in Montreal, I don’t know their schedules unfortunately but can find out. There is also a choir I know in Chicoutimi.

 

[SMHW]

…and Fr. is certainly not going to. He thinks Carey Landry is good Mass music.

It’s been my experience that even musicians who like other Glory and Praise music do not care for that of Carey Landry.

 

[Phemie]

For Mass, you can attend at Sainte-Marie-des-Deux-Montagnes, Benedictine women in Deux-Montagnes, on the outskirts of Montreal (near Oka). The women sing very well; Mass is usually presided by Dom André Saint-Cyr, a monk from Saint-Benoît-du-Lac. He sings the Mass and is very good. They use Gregorian chant every day, for the propers and Kyriale and French for the rest, but twice a week they do the entire Mass (OF) in Latin.

Saint-Benoît-du-Lac, near Magog, QC, is a Benedictine men’s abbey, and I am an oblate of there. They sing Gregorian chant (propers and kyriale) every day for Mass as well as Lauds and Vespers. The rest of the Mass is in French plainchant, and the other offices are in French plainchant except for the hymn and short responsories which are in Latin Gregorian chant.

For our choir, it varies, if ever you come to Sherbrooke, QC, I can provide you with our schedule, usually we sing at Saturday vigil Masses. Our next one is for Pentecost, next Saturday evening at 4 pm.

The choirs in Montreal, I don’t know their schedules unfortunately but can find out. There is also a choir I know in Chicoutimi.

Thank you for the information, unfortunately, none of these are exactly on the way to Ottawa (from Labrador). Although a side trip might be in order.

What about Basilique Notre Dame? The last time I heard Gregorian chant in Church was there back in '78.

 

[boatbearer]

As called for by Vatican II? Or is it at least heading in that direction? If not, why not? (if you don’t know why not, perhaps you’d like to speculate)

I’m not even sure what “pride of place” means? What I do know is there is nothing wrong in the least if a Mass does not contain Gregorian Chant. It’s no better or worse if it does or does not.

 

[Phemie]

I’m not even sure what “pride of place” means?

It means that Gregorian Chant is the best choice of music for Mass. That’s what the Church teaches in the Constitution on the Sacred Liturgy: "116. The Church acknowledges Gregorian chant as specially suited to the Roman liturgy: therefore, other things being equal, it should be given pride of place in liturgical services. But other kinds of sacred music, especially polyphony, are by no means excluded from liturgical celebrations, so long as they accord with the spirit of the liturgical action, as laid down in Art. 30."

What I do know is there is nothing wrong in the least if a Mass does not contain Gregorian Chant. It’s no better or worse if it does or does not.

It may not be ‘wrong’ to not have Gregorian chant but it’s definitely better to have it than to not have it.

 

[Bluegoat]

It’s been my experience that even musicians who like other Glory and Praise music do not care for that of Carey Landry.

Perhaps this speaks to speculating on the reasons. Some people just have really bad taste in music.

 

[roadsend]

The only time I’ve heard Gregorian chant is on a CD. I’ve NEVER heard it at any Mass I’ve ever been to in my life.

With the exception of those who attended the 0830 Sunday Mass on the fourth Sunday of the month for about a one year period a few years ago, this is pretty much what the 70% of the 50 and younger crowd around these parts would say.
The other 30% would say: What is Gregorian Chant?
There is not one single church less than 100 miles away that does Gregorian Chant.

 

[Bluegoat]

I’m not even sure what “pride of place” means? What I do know is there is nothing wrong in the least if a Mass does not contain Gregorian Chant. It’s no better or worse if it does or does not.

Pride of place is giving the best seat in the house to the most important gest or person. Where the Queen would sit at an official function.

So it is saying that Gregorian chant has a special place, even above other kinds of music, in the Latin rite liturgy - it’s the queen of Latin Rite music, so to speak, and ought to be treated as such.

 

[VociMike]

I’m not even sure what “pride of place” means?

But would it be reasonable to think that it doesn’t mean “mostly or totally ignored”?

What I do know is there is nothing wrong in the least if a Mass does not contain Gregorian Chant. It’s no better or worse if it does or does not.

How do you know this? Can you cite a document? And what if a parish has no Gregorian Chant in any of its Masses?

 

[Bob_Aliano]

I have not heard Gregorian Chant in a church since I left the faith around 1961, I have since “returned home”. When I was a child singing in the boys’ choir I remember that the singing of chants required some special direction for clipping at the end of phrases and properly forming the sounds to best project proper Latin pronunciation. I’m not sure many choir leaders today have the training or experience to properly lead a chant!

In a second line of thought; it might seem a bit awkward to attempt a proper Gregorian Chant during a non-Latin service!

 

[VociMike]

In a second line of thought; it might seem a bit awkward to attempt a proper Gregorian Chant during a non-Latin service!

Well, no pope or Church document has ever made that distinction, so I don’t think it’s an issue. In fact, the selection of basic chants “Jubilate Deo” was released to the Bishops and religious orders by the Sacred Congregation for Divine Worship, as requested by Pope Paul VI, in 1974, well after the vernacular Mass had become the standard.

 

[MarkThompson]

In a second line of thought; it might seem a bit awkward to attempt a proper Gregorian Chant during a non-Latin service!

It’s not that awkward. It becomes awkward if, you know, the proper Communio is followed by some guy on a guitar singing a Haugen piece, but that’s good, because it just serves to highlight the propriety of one and impropriety of the other.