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pnewton
Guest
Well done. That was funny.
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Well done. That was funny.
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pnewton
Guest
Bacon adds a good flavor.
(brussel sprouts need something to drown out the brussel sprout flavor)
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Tamsulosin
Guest
Distracted, I had to come back while the soup is on the stove.
What you are telling a fellow Catholic is very unkind.One can be fighting for more than one good cause.
The problem is that this particular thread is ABOUT ANIMALS
Start an anti abortion thread and I will meet you there, agreeing with you.
So will most likely the posters you are misrepresenting.
Love your neighbor and your enemy .It is a mandate for us Catholics.
What you are telling a fellow Catholic is very unkind.One can be fighting for more than one good cause.
The problem is that this particular thread is ABOUT ANIMALS
Start an anti abortion thread and I will meet you there, agreeing with you.
So will most likely the posters you are misrepresenting.
Love your neighbor and your enemy .It is a mandate for us Catholics.
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pnewton
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I mention St. Thomas because Pope John Paul II was brought up. If we are to look at the latters comment about animal souls, we can not do so without considering the originator of that thought, St. Thomas, whether we like him or not. He is actually one of my favorite, but that is because of the orderly way in which he thinks, not because of anything to do with this topic.
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pnewton
Guest
I think PETA gets a bad reputation because the more extreme things they do get all the press. They do not hold to a Catholic distinction that allows people to benefit from animals. Instead, they tend to treat humans as just another animal, only more intelligent.
Consider their tenets:
peta.org/
Animals Are Not Ours to Eat
Animals Are Not Ours to Wear
Animals Are Not Ours to Experiment On
Obviously this flies in the face of Catholic teaching.
Also, I do not catch squirrles. The only sqirrels I eat are those killed on the road. Lately, armadillos have been turning up more than squirrels.
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4elise
Guest
Oh my… poor armadillos!
Thanks again pnewton for being so respectful in this discussion! Isn’t it wonderful to know that we can disagree without being disagreeable!
P.S.- I can show you how to add flavor to those brussell sprouts without the bacon!
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4elise
Guest
very well said.
… that dessert sounds good by the way — come on over to the Catholic Vegetarians and Vegans group and share that recipe!
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severus68
Guest
I just read an article of his. He is a Jesuit priest. He and a few others became vegetarian when they were novices, initially as it was a way to feed more and for the environment and later because of the cruelty. I will try to find the link and post it.
Peta is not evil. One of its founders, I think, came up with “we must let all dogs and cats free into jungles and forests.” Really rubbish. Some of its members may be a bit extreme but you find that in any group. They dont shun publicity but seek it for their cause. Some people dont like that like their “I’d rather go naked than wear fur” campaign. Well while I am against the use of fur, both animals and humans will be better off not seeing me naked.
I think that if you believe in anything strongly, you should go all out to support and promote it (short of violence).
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severus68
Guest
The civility of most of the posters is appreciated. I have to disagree about Peta, please see my response to Marfan.
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KEVIN_WILCOX
Guest
In my private life I am a vegetarian. Rather than offend the other person (and sin against charity) if someone presents me with a meal of meat I accept it with gratitude toward the other’s kindness toward me. Usually I find myself living on leftovers, so the meat is not bought specifically for me and would be thrown away if I had not eaten it.
(Or should I give it a decent burial in the garden? But then Iwould risk cutting through other animals. Should I feed it to the wildlife?
Mad cow disease was partially caused by feeding cattle on infected sheep.
(Or should I give it a decent burial in the garden? But then Iwould risk cutting through other animals. Should I feed it to the wildlife?
Mad cow disease was partially caused by feeding cattle on infected sheep.
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Newbie2
Guest
Baloney.This is such a horrific subject. In China they also skin cats and dogs ALIVE and use their fur.
It is a crime in the U.S. to kill a dog or a cat. Why do you think? These animals are our domesticated friends and companions. They are family members. They are not raised to be eaten. Why do people have to eat everything in sight? If you say hunger, there are alternatives to dogs and cats for heaven’s sake. I can’t believe I’m actually responding to this post; but I love animals and I can’t stand it when people don’t see how they are beloved creations of Our Lord.
I can NOT subscribe to this thread, by the way. Also, personally, I eat poultry and fish sometimes but the other critters I love too much.
p.s. Don’t forget to bring your pets to the blessing of the animals at your parish.
Let me tell you from 20+ years of experience, if a cat doesn’t want to be vaccinated, it’s darn near impossible to do it without sedation or anesthesia. Skin them alive? I don’t think so. Same with dogs.
Think about it. Get the grey matter working. Why would anyone attempt to skin an animal alive and risk life and limb when they could skin it when it’s dead?
And, it’s not a crime to kill a dog or cat in the USA. It is a crime if it’s someone else’s pet, in the sense of destroying someone else’s property, but as it stands now, pets are considered property.
But, let me ask this…can a person have a chicken as a pet? Of course. I have a client who tube-fed her sick pet chicken for TWO YEARS under my care. Extremely dedicated client.
People keep pet goats, sheep, cows and horses as pets too.
So the arbitrary nature of choosing which animals we keep as pets, IMHO, has nothing to do with the morality of whether or not we should eat them as food.
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Marfran
Guest
Well then, you are performing a very important ecological function!!! You are like the turkey vulture!!! Turkey vultures greatly contribute to sanitation by cleaning up the remains of dead animals, which might otherwise cause disease in other animals. Vultures are able to digest virulent strains of bacteria without apparent harmful effects.
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Zundrah
Guest
I’m sure that dog and pork are unclean animals and God said that we are not to eat them?
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severus68
Guest
Aren’t you being rather harsh? I don’t think they really care whether the animal is dead before they start the process. I know about cats and dogs but if more than half dead, don’t think they can put up much of a fight.Baloney.
Let me tell you from 20+ years of experience, if a cat doesn’t want to be vaccinated, it’s darn near impossible to do it without sedation or anesthesia. Skin them alive? I don’t think so. Same with dogs.
Think about it. Get the grey matter working. Why would anyone attempt to skin an animal alive and risk life and limb when they could skin it when it’s dead?
And, it’s not a crime to kill a dog or cat in the USA. It is a crime if it’s someone else’s pet, in the sense of destroying someone else’s property, but as it stands now, pets are considered property.
But, let me ask this…can a person have a chicken as a pet? Of course. I have a client who tube-fed her sick pet chicken for TWO YEARS under my care. Extremely dedicated client.
People keep pet goats, sheep, cows and horses as pets too.
So the arbitrary nature of choosing which animals we keep as pets, IMHO, has nothing to do with the morality of whether or not we should eat them as food.
Agreed, the morality is not in which animal we eat. However people are more emotional about animals they keep as pets. That’s a fact.
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Zundrah
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But we can’t go around eating up little poochies! 
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Marfran
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PETA is savvy about drawing attention to topics that would otherwise not get substantive press coverage.
Is it a Catholic distinction that we are allowed to benefit from animals*** at all costs***??? We are also given the responsibility of stewardship, which means that we must carefully weigh and consider the benefits and detriments to both the animals and to humans, and we must also consider how our utilization of resources (both animal and non-animal) affects the planet as a whole, and affects resources for future generations.
In reading your statement above I glean your meaning as the Catholic distinction allows people to use animals, period. Maybe that is not what you intended to convey, and maybe I am putting a period where you did not intend. In light of the current usage of animals in society TODAY, I think much re-evaluation is needed. I think our stewardship has gone amuck, and that we may retire many animals, as their services are no longer needed. This is a concept that you will find in the book ***Dominion ***by Matthew Scully.
Your statement here indicates to me that you feel that PETA does not acknowledge the special relationship that we humans have with God. Understandably, it is a secular organization. That is why I recommend that we Catholics, and other Christians do look to Catholic/Christian organizations and writings–and there*** are ***plenty of those.
And what specifically flies in the face of Catholic teaching???
***Animals are not ours to eat: ***I would agree that we should consider whether in this day and age we need to continue to do this, as there are plenty of healthier alternatives to animal protein for modern, civilized man.
***Animals Are Not Ours to Wear: In this day and age there is almost NO reason for us to wear animals. Leather is abundant because it is a slaughterhouse by-product. Absent leather, we have many non-animal alternatives. NO ONE NEEDS to wear fur. Many countries in Europe have outlawed fur farms. England has recently outlawed the importation of seal skin. Seal skin is used to make those pouches for kilts. The kilt manufacturers are choosing alternative materials in the countries where this is banned. Some people are crying because it just won’t feel the same as seal skin. *** Good enough reason to keep on clubbing seals??? And fur coats–are they really necessary??? A fur coat is a symbol of wealth and status. Doesn’t that fly in the face of Catholic teaching??? Flaunting one’s wealth???
***Animals Are Not Ours to Experiment On: ***This is one area that is highly misunderstood and misrepresented. Perhaps this would make a good topic for another thread. The vast majority of animal testing is not only cruel but is unnecessary. I think that a lot of people have a misconception of the ***actual ***benefits derived from animal testing. Before arguing ***for animal testing ***I highly suggest that one researches this situation. (Again, a response to this would be quite lengthy, and may be off topic here.)
That would be great. I have often heard his name mentioned (Fr. John Dear) but am unfamiliar with him. I believe he has an association with the PETA group.
Dogs and cats are not wild animals, and were bred, and are domesticated to live with humans. All dogs are descendants of wolves, who are wild animals, and do belong in the wild. The Dalmation, the Scottish Terrier, the Labrador, etc., are “man-made” genetic tinkerings who have no wild populations. So I agree this comment is ill-thought and misguided (rubbish).
I agree with you. And there is no reason to go naked because there are many alternatives to fur!!! The ***“I’d rather go naked than wear fur” *** campaign draws attention to the issue, and PETA is good at drawing attention to issues that would othewrwise not get a lot of press. Some of their tactics can be offensive however, and again, that’s why I prefer the numerous Catholic and Christian organizations. I also think that Catholic and Christian organizations bring something to the table that a secular organization can not. I agree, PETA does not seem to be “evil,” but does leave something to be desired. The absence of God in the equation is what is missing. And again, if you look to the works of Rev. Andrew Linzey, Matthew Scully (Catholic), and Deborah Jones (Catholic) you will also add that missing Christian perspective.
I did order the PETA starter kit, and would like to read over their literature, as this organization always seems to find it’s way into these discussions, and I sometimes do not know how to reply, because I am not affiliated with them and haven’t been paying that much attention to that specific group.
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Marfran
Guest
It is abhorrent (to many of us) what other cultures do to our beloved dogs and cats, but is that any different than what ***we ***do to cows, pigs, and chickens???But we can’t go around eating up little poochies!
I once had the privilege of spending time with a pet duck. She was so funny. She would peck at people’s shoes for “treats” and she learned to walk on a leash (with a harness, not a collar). And she loved to take “baths” and enjoyed having her head and neck stroked.
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Zundrah
Guest
I’ve never stroked a duck before but when I was in Africa I did stroke a crocodile!
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severus68
Guest
Just wanted to give you the link to Father John Dear’s website
fatherjohndear.org/
He wrote a phamphlet with Andrew Linzey on Christianity and Vegetarianism. Very very anti violence.
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choy
Guest
i don’t like PETA
while i’m an animal lover, i love cats and i have cats and i wouldn’t want anyone to hurt cats, i think PETA is a waste of money
they’re fighting for animal rights when most house pets in the US have better living standards than most human beings in third world countries. pets have wonderful instinct that if you kick them out of the house they’ll survive. most humans won’t without proper shelter and access to clean water and food. i think PETA is a prime example that most people have lost sense of the right priorities in life
while i’m an animal lover, i love cats and i have cats and i wouldn’t want anyone to hurt cats, i think PETA is a waste of money
they’re fighting for animal rights when most house pets in the US have better living standards than most human beings in third world countries. pets have wonderful instinct that if you kick them out of the house they’ll survive. most humans won’t without proper shelter and access to clean water and food. i think PETA is a prime example that most people have lost sense of the right priorities in life
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