Drinking in moderation?

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Delphinus85

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I have a question about this phrase.

As I understand it, drinking alcohol is totally fine by the Catholic church but “in moderation” in a little foggy to me.

Does this mean that you may have some alcohol and never get drunk, or is it okay to get a little tipsy once in a while.

For example: My husband really like to, maybe once every 6 months, get a case of beer, put on a good comedy and drink the night away in our own house between just us to. We also like to go out with friends once in a great while and have a few drinks. Sometimes we’ll have a little much (getting tipsy) but usually just get buzzed (and we NEVER drive when we have anything more than ONE drink). We do have rules, we never drink alone (one of us drinking, the other is gone), we never drink to escape any emotion, and we never use alcohol to kill any physical pain (more for me since I have medical issues involving pain), and we never drink to get to sleep.

So, is getting drunk (or on the heavy buzzed side) sinful or is drinking so much that you become an alcoholic the sinful action?
 
Delphinus85 said:
I have a question about this phrase.

As I understand it, drinking alcohol is totally fine by the Catholic church but “in moderation” in a little foggy to me.

Does this mean that you may have some alcohol and never get drunk, or is it okay to get a little tipsy once in a while.

For example: My husband really like to, maybe once every 6 months, get a case of beer, put on a good comedy and drink the night away in our own house between just us to. We also like to go out with friends once in a great while and have a few drinks. Sometimes we’ll have a little much (getting tipsy) but usually just get buzzed (and we NEVER drive when we have anything more than ONE drink). We do have rules, we never drink alone (one of us drinking, the other is gone), we never drink to escape any emotion, and we never use alcohol to kill any physical pain (more for me since I have medical issues involving pain), and we never drink to get to sleep.

So, is getting drunk (or on the heavy buzzed side) sinful or is drinking so much that you become an alcoholic the sinful action?
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The body has alcohol dehydrogenase and acetaldehyde dehydrogenase (metabolized in the liver) to deal with alcohol. A small amount is unlikely to affect your body. It might be “immoral” to drink alcohol at all in a religious system that strictly prohibits it.
 
When a person drinks to the point of intoxication there are two things that take place that I feel place this in the ‘sin’ category…
  1. A person is no longer fully capable of controlling their behavior, they have disrupted their faculties to the point of not functioining properly as God intended them to. Slurred speech, giggly, aggressive, diminished physical functions, etc.
It is a fact that many domestic situations that require police attention would have been avoided if alcohol consumption was moderated or not in use.

How many people refer to a person’s behavior as ‘odd’ when they were drunk? ‘Oh, you were so funny last night, you were dancing on the table and making everyone laugh’ (fool), or ‘You were very rude to Martha last night, do you remember what you said to her? That was uncalled for’ (belligerent)

Also, when you and your husband go out for a few drinks to get ‘tipsy’, what is your mode of transportation to return home? If either of you are driving, you are breaking the law as well as putting your lives and the lives of others in jeapordy…another sin.
  1. Also, the health factor. Alcohol is toxic and causes many health issues. ONE glass of wine a day is considered healthy for the circulatory system, if you consume more than that, you are placing your body (or temple) at risk for health problems.
I’m not trying to come off as a prude. I am a recovering alcoholic and drug abuser, so I’m certainly not one to ‘judge’ a person’s actions regarding this topic. However, I can tell you, that I have sinned many times through this method, and both injured myself and others as a result of my drunken behavior…and, injured my health and family’s security by putting my health at risk.

There are times I still have an urge to drink…but, I have to get to the root of why I’m having that urge. What is it I’m seeking? Why do I want to catch a buzz? Is it pure?
 
Delphinus85 said:
I have a question about this phrase.

As I understand it, drinking alcohol is totally fine by the Catholic church but “in moderation” in a little foggy to me.

Does this mean that you may have some alcohol and never get drunk, or is it okay to get a little tipsy once in a while.

For example: My husband really like to, maybe once every 6 months, get a case of beer, put on a good comedy and drink the night away in our own house between just us to. We also like to go out with friends once in a great while and have a few drinks. Sometimes we’ll have a little much (getting tipsy) but usually just get buzzed (and we NEVER drive when we have anything more than ONE drink). We do have rules, we never drink alone (one of us drinking, the other is gone), we never drink to escape any emotion, and we never use alcohol to kill any physical pain (more for me since I have medical issues involving pain), and we never drink to get to sleep.

So, is getting drunk (or on the heavy buzzed side) sinful or is drinking so much that you become an alcoholic the sinful action?
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I see nothing sinful here at all.
 
rboo124 said:
When a person drinks to the point of intoxication there are two things that take place that I feel place this in the ‘sin’ category…
  1. A person is no longer fully capable of controlling their behavior, they have disrupted their faculties to the point of not functioining properly as God intended them to. Slurred speech, giggly, aggressive, diminished physical functions, etc.
It is a fact that many domestic situations that require police attention would have been avoided if alcohol consumption was moderated or not in use.

How many people refer to a person’s behavior as ‘odd’ when they were drunk? ‘Oh, you were so funny last night, you were dancing on the table and making everyone laugh’ (fool), or ‘You were very rude to Martha last night, do you remember what you said to her? That was uncalled for’ (belligerent)

Also, when you and your husband go out for a few drinks to get ‘tipsy’, what is your mode of transportation to return home? If either of you are driving, you are breaking the law as well as putting your lives and the lives of others in jeapordy…another sin.
  1. Also, the health factor. Alcohol is toxic and causes many health issues. ONE glass of wine a day is considered healthy for the circulatory system, if you consume more than that, you are placing your body (or temple) at risk for health problems.
I’m not trying to come off as a prude. I am a recovering alcoholic and drug abuser, so I’m certainly not one to ‘judge’ a person’s actions regarding this topic. However, I can tell you, that I have sinned many times through this method, and both injured myself and others as a result of my drunken behavior…and, injured my health and family’s security by putting my health at risk.

There are times I still have an urge to drink…but, I have to get to the root of why I’m having that urge. What is it I’m seeking? Why do I want to catch a buzz? Is it pure?
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Understandable. My mother was an alcoholic, and drug addict. Obviously I’ve gotten over it though LOL

At any rate, what I said before is that we NEVER drive if we have anything more than ONE drink. We are both cautious about that, and we are careful to never bei n that situation. We either have a designated driver, catch a cab, or drink on a cruise ship where there is no cars to tempt us 😉 it’s back to that who mom thing. She used to drive drunk all the time.

I understand about the inhibition thing, and I find it to be a good thing, especially if I am around new people. I am naturally an outgong fun person, but because of some rather nasty events I have become REALLY painfully shy. My friends admit that when I’ve had even a smidgen of alcohol they can see that I relax and it makes them cheer up a little. Secondly. my husband generally have an unspoken rule that when we drink we are together. We figure there isn’t much we will do wrong with the other there! 🙂

And I hear the health factor thing, but is have 2-3 drinks every few months going to do that? (bear in mind I’ve only been REALLY drunk once, and I hated it. so I usually only get mildly buzzed to the point where my speech is hardly even effected)
 
Yes I’m only kidding, sorry if it didn’t come across as such.
 
Delphinus85,
Have you seriously thought about the statement: All things in moderation? What is meant by this is that all things can be bad for you if not in moderation… I submit… eating as my first example… we can’t tell people not to eat because they have to partake to live… but if we eat too much it is gluttony right? And it isn’t good for us right? But let’s take a harder example… what about prayer… can you ever pray too much? Well, some would say no, but I would say yes… you could pray so much that you don’t do anything else…eat, sleep, exercise, work… then praying would be too much right? What about sexual relations… we get alot of questions about that here… say you are married, can you have sex too much… yeah… when it prevents you from living…eating, drinking, praying, working, or functioning in society… etc… So, eating, drinking, praying, having sex are all good things in moderation.

Each individual has to examine his or her conscience about what the right balance is. Do I eat to sustain life, or do I eat because I love food? Loving food isn’t bad… overindulging is. Do I work too many hours and neglect my children? Do I drink too much? Do I pray totally to the exclusion of helping others? Life is a balance… when one thing is out of balance… many things are out of balance… If I am spending all my time doing things for others, I might be ignoring my work or my children…kwim?

This is not to say that at different times in your life this balance will stay the same… No, it has to shift… for the good of everyone. For example, I work on average 50 hours a week. My kids have to fend for themselves after school because I am not there, but if I don’t work so many hours, first… I won’t have a job… second, my company won’t get off the ground… and my product helps all of mankind. Next month I predict, I will be working 70+ hours a week as we get closer to production start-up. But 6 months from now, I will be able to take the whole month off and then work 30 hours a week… We do the same thing with everything we do…I don’t drink alcohol on a daily basis, and never at company functions… but maybe I want to have a few on SuperBowl Sunday…That beer might go great with my chilli and the chips make me thirsty so I might drink more than normal… as long as I can still get my kids off to school the next day and me off to work sober, what is the harm? Or maybe I will eat a light lunch because I am going to an all you can eat buffet that I love… I don’t want to be over stuffed and get a stomach ache, so I eat a light lunch.

The problem comes when we aren’t doing things in moderation… drinking, eating, praying, having sex, working…any one of these are commonly overindulged in right? When this happens, other parts of our lives are affected negatively. One of the most successful people I know is a man who works like a maniac when he is at work… very intense… but then he takes time off to go to every one of his son’s sporting events, takes a month off at Christmas, on the personal side… he made enough money that he donated millions to a new Catholic HS … and he has a well used chapel built into his house… I know because he lets me pray there when I need time away just to pray. I would say that he lives a pretty balanced life… but it wouldn’t work for me… that isn’t my balance. You have to find what works best for you…and your family.
 
I think the bible takes care of this one rather nicely. Read the gospel accounts of the wedding at Cana. Then think about:
  1. Clearly we are talking about alcoholic wine here since the steward is surprised that they are serving good wine after using up all the cheaper stuff. Grape juice doesn’t degrade your ability to discern quality.
  2. Where did all the reference cheap wine go? Down the hatch!
  3. Note that such a feast probably included overnight lodging in tight quarters. Unlikely to be much resulting debauchery.
IMO, a bit of a buzz in a social setting at non-habitual frequencies is what God invented the stuff for! 👍 👍
 
Thank you ManualMan and BlestOne for your responses!

In al honesty I have no problem with staying at home with my husband and getting blind drunk and watching comedy movies. We don’t do this though, since we don’t like being THAT drunk, chances are we have about 3 beers a piece, get a little giggly and put on some Jim Carrey.

I also think that going out with friends and getting tipsy is a good stress reliever and is quite fun, especially for people like me who are so naturally uptight anyway! hehehe

as to BlestOne’s comment, I agree with you COMPLETELY this is why I wonder if having a beer or two with friends to loosen up and imagine that we can dance once in a great while is okay, since it is once in a GREAT while.And obviously it isn’t interfereing with work, or family.

I guess the question i really have is what is the church’s stance on “in moderation” does that mean NEVER get drunk or tipsy AT ALL, or only do it occasionally for the right reasons. Using your example BlestOne, it’s like you eat to live, and occasionally eat a little more than you should on special occasions like christmas and thanksgiving. Is this moderation?
 
The Church does not define “in moderation” you do… because each person is different… Can a 100 lb person drink as much as a 250 lb person? Maybe, maybe not… too many variables… including ethnic background (Indians don’t process alcohol as efficiently as other ethnic groups for example). I see absolutely nothing wrong with your examples, but it isn’t my decision, it is yours.

When I am discerning moderation in anything, the first thing I look at is my family… do my actions negatively affect my kids? or my husband? Does it affect my health or ability to do my job? Generally, a once in a while action will not affect them. Take eating or indulging at holidays as an example… am I taking food out of their mouths? Will my overeating stop me from my obligation to my family? If I eat so much I am vomiting sick… yes… so I shouldn’t do that. If I am talking about an extra piece of pie at dessert… and there is plenty to go around… then why not?

If drinking occasionally bothers you… then maybe there is a problem. But if it doesn’t, you aren’t acting immorally, you aren’t breaking any laws, you aren’t neglecting your kids…etc… then there is no problem is there?

The Church is not made up with a whole bunch of rules about living for a reason… things change… what would happen if they had such exact rules that applied to everyone?
you can drink 1 liter of water and .5 liters of wine a day… you may substitute 1 beer for each quarter liter… just wouldn’t work would it? When it is hot out… we require more fluids to keep us hydrated, when we are younger or smaller, we don’t require the same… too many variables… Besides, if everything were regulated how would we learn self restraint or delayed gratification? Ultimately, God wants us to love and worship him. He doesn’t want to control us and neither does the Church.
 
Delphinus85 said:
… chances are we have about 3 beers a piece, get a little giggly and put on some Jim Carrey.
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Oh now you’ve lost me! I have no problem with the beers, but if they are making you find Jim Carrey amusing you are clearly abusing the stuff! 😉
 
manualman said:
Oh now you’ve lost me! I have no problem with the beers, but if they are making you find Jim Carrey amusing you are clearly abusing the stuff! 😉
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HAHAHA!! Uh oh, I’m in trouble, I found him funny before I ever TOUCHED alcohol!!
 
Uh oh. I guess I can’t help then. The mods frown on professional medical advice being given on the forums. 😉
 
I discussed this with my priest, because I am in sales and drinking is pretty common. If I drink too much, it can certainly be an occasion for sin - gossip, improper jokes, betraying confidence. I asked if I should just not drink at all in business settings, but my priest said keeping it to 1-2 drinks is okay.

At home, there is less occasion for sin when I share a bottle of wine or Belgian beer with my wife. (In our case, sharing often means I am drinking 2/3 to 3/4 of the 750ml bottle 😛 )

I think understanding your personal thresholds for alcohol, the setting and your propensity toward sin while “buzzed” are all things to consider when determining what “moderation” means.

Just my :twocents:
 
rlg94086 said:
I discussed this with my priest, because I am in sales and drinking is pretty common. If I drink too much, it can certainly be an occasion for sin - gossip, improper jokes, betraying confidence. I asked if I should just not drink at all in business settings, but my priest said keeping it to 1-2 drinks is okay.

At home, there is less occasion for sin when I share a bottle of wine or Belgian beer with my wife. (In our case, sharing often means I am drinking 2/3 to 3/4 of the 750ml bottle 😛 )

I think understanding your personal thresholds for alcohol, the setting and your propensity toward sin while “buzzed” are all things to consider when determining what “moderation” means.

Just my :twocents:
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The thing I have found for my drinking habits, is that even if I am really really trashed (which has only happened once) I just get really outgoing. I don’t act any different than normal. It’s weird. I actually remember one time I was out with friends a few months ago, and I had a conversation with a girl at the bar about why waiting until you’re married to have sex is the ONLY way to go because it’s SO Much better! LOL
 
Delphinus85 said:
The thing I have found for my drinking habits, is that even if I am really really trashed (which has only happened once) I just get really outgoing. I don’t act any different than normal. It’s weird. I actually remember one time I was out with friends a few months ago, and I had a conversation with a girl at the bar about why waiting until you’re married to have sex is the ONLY way to go because it’s SO Much better! LOL
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Then, to be honest, you weren’t really trashed…trust me.
 
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