Dropping/Spilling the Blessed Sacrament

[Pariah_Pirana]

My parish uses a large number of EMsHC at each Mass – 3-4 times as many as necessary. It gets so complicated and congested that special “Mass captains” or super-EMcHC are appointed to keep everyone organized.

Last Sunday the captains were distributing the Blessed Sacraments amongs different vessels (yes, in defiance of RS) when one of the captains slipped, allowing two consecrated hosts to roll across and off the altar. I don’t think I have ever been this upset at Mass!

In the past, I asked our pastor if the the altar server (me) could prepare the gifts at the creedence table after they had been processed up. He agreed and it worked well except the captains were nuts because they saw the end coming. (They also went nuts when altar servers were placed in charge of setting-up everything for Mass.)

So what to do? Until we get a pastor with a spine, it looks like this sorta garbage is going to continue and it rips my guts out. The bishop is of no help (we have written him in the past) and this abuse does not raise of the level of Vatican intervention. What can we do in addition to praying?

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Pariah Pirana:

My parish uses a large number of EMsHC at each Mass – 3-4 times as many as necessary. It gets so complicated and congested that special “Mass captains” or super-EMcHC are appointed to keep everyone organized.

Last Sunday the captains were distributing the Blessed Sacraments amongs different vessels (yes, in defiance of RS) when one of the captains slipped, allowing two consecrated hosts to roll across and off the altar. I don’t think I have ever been this upset at Mass!

In the past, I asked our pastor if the the altar server (me) could prepare the gifts at the creedence table after they had been processed up. He agreed and it worked well except the captains were nuts because they saw the end coming. (They also went nuts when altar servers were placed in charge of setting-up everything for Mass.)

So what to do? Until we get a pastor with a spine, it looks like this sorta garbage is going to continue and it rips my guts out. The bishop is of no help (we have written him in the past) and this abuse does not raise of the level of Vatican intervention. What can we do in addition to praying?

Since the Pastor said that the Altar Servers were to set up everything before Mass and prepare the ciboriums at the credence table after the presentation of the gifts. That is what I would suggest that you do. These extra ciboriums of hosts to be consecrated can be prepared before Mass and left on the credence table. Nothing requires that all the bread and wine used at that Mass needs to be processed up at the offertory.

 

[Pariah_Pirana]

Br. Rich SFO:

Since the Pastor said that the Altar Servers were to set up everything before Mass and prepare the ciboriums at the credence table after the presentation of the gifts. That is what I would suggest that you do. These extra ciboriums of hosts to be consecrated can be prepared before Mass and left on the credence table. Nothing requires that all the bread and wine used at that Mass needs to be processed up at the offertory.

He reversed his decision when the “captains” complained – as they had become obsolete.

BTW, nothing need be processed-up at all…

 

[chicago]

I suppose that you need to have a talk with the pastor about these problems yourself. If there is really a big problem, then maybe he just needs to explain this to the EMs and decide what is in the best interests of the Blessed Sacrament. Afterall, he should explain to them, they certainly want what is most fitting for reverence to the Sacrament, no?

 

[Ben_G]

I do not understand why these people are doing the portioning of the Blessed Sacrament into the vessels in the first place. I thought that it was the duty of the presiding minister or deacon to do this. Based on my experience, the role of Extraordinary Minister of the Eucharist is limited to exactly what the title implies – being a minister of the Eucharist for the Congregation. Obviously they are not allowed to self-communicate (as this is reserved only to priests and bishops), and likewise they should wait to be handed the already filled vessel, whether it be a ciborium or a cup, by the presiding minister or deacon. If there is such a large number of vessels to be filled, I would deffinitely suggest pre-filling the vessels and placing them on the credence table as Br. Rich SFO suggested.

Regardless, the apparent rivalry between the altar servers and “Mass captains” is disheartening. It might help to talk to the pastor about reducing competition for jobs by clearly explaining that it is the duty of the servers to set up for Mass. In my parish, for example, it is the job of the servers to put the Lectionary on the ambo. However, in order to actually give them something useful to do, the “Mass captains” could be assigned the job of double-checking to see that everything is in place before Mass begins, just as the lector would check to make sure that the Lectionary is where it needs to be. Then, if a captain notices that something is not in the right place, he or she could see to it that the servers take care of the matter. Hopefully this would foster team-work rather than turf warfare among all of the lay people involved in ministry at the parish in question.

 

[chicago]

Make the EM’s (at least the male ones) acolytes. Then they can serve, administer communion, and prepare the cups and ciboriums at an appropriate time.

 

[Pariah_Pirana]

Ben_G:

I do not understand why these people are doing the portioning of the Blessed Sacrament into the vessels in the first place. I thought that it was the duty of the presiding minister or deacon to do this. Based on my experience, the role of Extraordinary Minister of the Eucharist is limited to exactly what the title implies – being a minister of the Eucharist for the Congregation. Obviously they are not allowed to self-communicate (as this is reserved only to priests and bishops), and likewise they should wait to be handed the already filled vessel, whether it be a ciborium or a cup, by the presiding minister or deacon. If there is such a large number of vessels to be filled, I would deffinitely suggest pre-filling the vessels and placing them on the credence table as Br. Rich SFO suggested.

Regardless, the apparent rivalry between the altar servers and “Mass captains” is disheartening. It might help to talk to the pastor about reducing competition for jobs by clearly explaining that it is the duty of the servers to set up for Mass. In my parish, for example, it is the job of the servers to put the Lectionary on the ambo. However, in order to actually give them something useful to do, the “Mass captains” could be assigned the job of double-checking to see that everything is in place before Mass begins, just as the lector would check to make sure that the Lectionary is where it needs to be. Then, if a captain notices that something is not in the right place, he or she could see to it that the servers take care of the matter. Hopefully this would foster team-work rather than turf warfare among all of the lay people involved in ministry at the parish in question.

There is no rivalry. The “Mass captains” are out for themselves. The last thing that needs to happen is to retain the “Mass captains” with superfulous functions. Like most parishes, we don’t have “lectors.” We have readers.

 

[Ben_G]

Pariah Pirana:

There is no rivalry. The “Mass captains” are out for themselves. The last thing that needs to happen is to retain the “Mass captains” with superfulous functions.

Oh, I completely agree that keeping the captains for just for the sake of keeping them is a silly idea. I just thought that if the priest wanted to delegate some responsibility that would be a good way to do it. I think that most parishes have a person – whether it be the priest ex officio, or a sacristan or a “Mass captain” who makes sure that all of the lay ministers (servers, readers, cantors, extraodinary ministers of the Eucharist, etc.) are present to perform their functions and that everything is set up and ready to go smoothly. By the way, most altar servers around here are of grade school age (with the exception of most pontifical liturgies at the cathedral when they are typically college age seminarians who know what they are doing and can double-check each other).

I also did not mean to imply that the servers participated in a rivalry, but it seems from the way the history of the situation was characterized …
Pariah Pirana:

In the past, I asked our pastor if the the altar server (me) could prepare the gifts at the creedence table after they had been processed up. He agreed and it worked well except the captains were nuts because they saw the end coming. (They also went nuts when altar servers were placed in charge of setting-up everything for Mass.)

… that there was some back and forth between the captains with the pastor caught in the middle. Sorry if my previous post sounded critical of the servers … it was not meant to be in the least! Again, Br. Rich SFO’s suggestion makes the most sense to me if there are too many vessels for the priest to deal with himself.

 

[Pariah_Pirana]

Ben_G:

I also did not mean to imply that the servers participated in a rivalry, but it seems from the way the history of the situation was characterized … that there was some back and forth between the captains with the pastor caught in the middle. Sorry if my previous post sounded critical of the servers … it was not meant to be in the least! Again, Br. Rich SFO’s suggestion makes the most sense to me if there are too many vessels for the priest to deal with himself.

The adult altar servers did prepare the gifts at the creedence table and it worked out well. The pastor only reversed himself when the “captains” complained.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Pariah Pirana:

The adult altar servers did prepare the gifts at the creedence table and it worked out well. The pastor only reversed himself when the “captains” complained.

It sounds to me like Mass is a bit like a show instead of a Sacred liturgy. The bread and wine necessary for for the Consecration should be prepared into the necessary sacred vessels before MAss begins. Except for a symbolic portion that is processed up during the Offeratory. A priest has or at least should have the ability to celebrate the entire Mass by himself without any assistance from Altar Servers, Readers, or Extraordinary Ministers of Holy Communion! I know of one parish where the priest celebrates Mass without any extraordinary ministers. The altar is already set up with corproal in place and the Sacramentary. The Ciborium with hosts and a Chalice with Wine already mixed with water on the credence table which he simply goes over and gets at the proper time. Holy Communion is only distributed under the form of bread only by the priest. He cleans the vessels after Holy Communion at the altar and places them back on the credence table.

 

[Pariah_Pirana]

Br. Rich SFO:

It sounds to me like Mass is a bit like a show instead of a Sacred liturgy. The bread and wine necessary for for the Consecration should be prepared into the necessary sacred vessels before MAss begins. Except for a symbolic portion that is processed up during the Offeratory.

A priest has or at least should have the ability to celebrate the entire Mass by himself without any assistance from Altar Servers, Readers, or Extraordinary Ministers of Holy Communion! I know of one parish where the priest celebrates Mass without any extraordinary ministers. The altar is already set up with corproal in place and the Sacramentary. The Ciborium with hosts and a Chalice with Wine already mixed with water on the credence table which he simply goes over and gets at the proper time. Holy Communion is only distributed under the form of bread only by the priest. He cleans the vessels after Holy Communion at the altar and places them back on the credence table.

Incorrect.

There is nothing in the GIRM to suggest that the gifts processed up during the Mass be a “symbolic portion” of their entirety – that’s merely your opinion. There is also nothing that suggests ALL of the bread and wine be processed up during the Mass – although it’s quite common, particularly at very solemn Masses. Additionally there is very strong symbolism in having all the gifts processed up…

A priest should always be served by someone if possible – if nothing more than to facilitate the lavabo and to “dress the altar.”

It also wouldn’t be right to have the corporal on the altar before the Mass began, and I’m not sure how how a priest would read the opening prayer if the Sacramentary was already on the altar – unless he did so from behind the altar and that too is problematic. Adding water to the wine before Mass also deprives the faithful from a very symbolic act.

Yeah, there is no question that one can dumb-down the Mass to look like the most utilitarian of processes. That dosen’t make it right (or desireable ) however.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Pariah Pirana:

Incorrect.

There is nothing in the GIRM to suggest that the gifts processed up during the Mass be a “symbolic portion” of their entirety – that’s merely your opinion. There is also nothing that suggests ALL of the bread and wine be processed up during the Mass – although it’s quite common, particularly at very solemn Masses. Additionally there is very strong symbolism in having all the gifts processed up…

My point is if there is a large amount of bread and wine to be prepared it can be prepared before hand and be ready on the credence table. The Blessed Sacrament should not be transfered among several vessels after consecration to avoid spilling or dropping.

A priest should always be served by someone if possible – if nothing more than to facilitate the lavabo and to “dress the altar.”

It also wouldn’t be right to have the corporal on the altar before the Mass began, and I’m not sure how how a priest would read the opening prayer if the Sacramentary was already on the altar – unless he did so from behind the altar and that too is problematic. Adding water to the wine before Mass also deprives the faithful from a very symbolic act.

Yes, but it can be done without an army of Extraordinary Ministers.

Yeah, there is no question that one can dumb-down the Mass to look like the most utilitarian of processes. That dosen’t make it right (or desireable ) however.

True but we do need to get away from the idea that there must be a “job for everyone present”. A minimum of Extraordinary Ministers should be used.