Dutch government plans to regulate ritual slaughter (no more Kosher meat)

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mercytruth said:
It is my perception that all humble people of each of the montheistic faiths will face increasing discrimination and persecution in a secular world that is increasingly becoming antagonistic toward the Creator of all. It is my hope that we could unite around our commonality and support one another during such times as this.
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Exactly.
 
Bezant said:
ChosenPeople is telling the selective truth, and moreover, he reaches the absurd conclusion that European Jews are in danger. He essentially parallels the current situation of European antisemitism to antisemitism in Nazi Germany, one major difference being, today European Jews have rights! Clearly antisemitism exists in many examples he gives, but he ignores that difference completely. How do you attack a problem if the view of it is incomplete?

I really don’t see what that has to do with anything.
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And those rights are being challenged left and right. If the European Jewry doesn’t stand up now and loud, and if we don’t support them, Nazi Germany isn’t far away. Tough times like these are exactly what breed radical regimes. Remember that no one even knew that Castro was a communist; they only knew he offered solutions.

In Christ,
Iggy
 
Inego_de_Loyola said:
And those rights are being challenged left and right. If the European Jewry doesn’t stand up now and loud, and if we don’t support them, Nazi Germany isn’t far away. Tough times like these are exactly what breed radical regimes. Remember that no one even knew that Castro was a communist; they only knew he offered solutions.

In Christ,
Iggy
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Don’t you think this is missing a critical point here? Bans on circumcision, obvious religious symbols or ritually killed meat aren’t going to affect JUST Jews but Muslims too, along with Christians and pretty much ANY religious person to an extent, because it coulf just as easily be that the Gov is planning to ban any sort of religious practice, and I doubt that they will limit themselves to targeting one religion only.

You mention the Nazis…you might want to remember that the Nazis didn’t kill just Jews but other minorities too, including Christians of all denominations. They didn’t discriminate and neither has any other regime you care to mention. ANY religious or minority group could be in the spotlights.
 
Kouyate42 said:
You mention the Nazis…you might want to remember that the Nazis didn’t kill just Jews but other minorities too, including Christians of all denominations. They didn’t discriminate and neither has any other regime you care to mention. ANY religious or minority group could be in the spotlights.
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Hm, the Nazis killed Jews, Gypsies and they’d have gone on to do away with the Slavs as well. Christians were killed when they were part of some ‘inferior’ race (like Poles) or part of some of some oppositional grouping, or supposed oppositional grouping.

The Nazis were very very good at discrimination, they turned it into a ‘science’.

They liked Muslims an awful lot, of course, and Muslims seemed to get on well with them.
 
Kaninchen said:
Hm, the Nazis killed Jews, Gypsies and they’d have gone on to do away with the Slavs as well. Christians were killed when they were part of some ‘inferior’ race (like Poles) or part of some of some oppositional grouping, or supposed oppositional grouping.

The Nazis were very very good at discrimination, they turned it into a ‘science’.

They liked Muslims an awful lot, of course, and Muslims seemed to get on well with them.
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I’ve never come across any link between Islam and the Nazis. And if it were the case, in any way it would and hasn’t stopped other despotic regimes from targeting Muslims. This isn’t an issue of any one specific religion, which was the point of what I wrote in the post you quoted, or indeed any one specific group you care to name.
 
Kouyate42 said:
I’ve never come across any link between Islam and the Nazis. And if it were the case, in any way it would and hasn’t stopped other despotic regimes from targeting Muslims. This isn’t an issue of any one specific religion, which was the point of what I wrote in the post you quoted, or indeed any one specific group you care to name.
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I only know of Haj Amin al-Husseini, Mufti of Jerusalem and leader of the Arabs in the land of Israel. He was very close to Hitler and the other Nazi leadership, actively recruited Bosnian Muslims for them, and wanted to set up death camps here like they had in Europe.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammad_Amin_al-Husayni#Pre-war

commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Mohammad_Amin_al-Husayni

Not that it has anything to do with this conversation.
 
Kouyate42 said:
I’ve never come across any link between Islam and the Nazis. And if it were the case, in any way it would and hasn’t stopped other despotic regimes from targeting Muslims. This isn’t an issue of any one specific religion, which was the point of what I wrote in the post you quoted, or indeed any one specific group you care to name.
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Always a good idea to avoid offering hostages to fortune when posting. 😉
 
YKohen said:
I only know of Haj Amin al-Husseini, Mufti of Jerusalem and leader of the Arabs in the land of Israel. He was very close to Hitler and the other Nazi leadership, actively recruited Bosnian Muslims for them, and wanted to set up death camps here like they had in Europe.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammad_Amin_al-Husayni#Pre-war

commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Mohammad_Amin_al-Husayni

Not that it has anything to do with this conversation.
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Himmler had quite a thing about Muslims. The SS also recruited from Muslims in occupied parts of the Soviet Union as well as the Bosnians.
 
Inego_de_Loyola said:
And those rights are being challenged left and right. If the European Jewry doesn’t stand up now and loud, and if we don’t support them, Nazi Germany isn’t far away. Tough times like these are exactly what breed radical regimes. Remember that no one even knew that Castro was a communist; they only knew he offered solutions.

In Christ,
Iggy
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We’re not living in the 1920s. The economic and political situation in Europe isn’t nearly as desperate as the situations after World War I that helped breed Mussolini and Hitler. Racism is no longer supposed to be acceptable and European Jews can be reasonably assured of their rights, or at least the ability to defend them. In contrast, Iranian Jews and Yemeni Jews don’t have the same rights and security.
 
Bezant said:
We’re not living in the 1920s. The economic and political situation in Europe isn’t nearly as desperate as the situations after World War I that helped breed Mussolini and Hitler. Racism is no longer supposed to be acceptable and European Jews can be reasonably assured of their rights, or at least the ability to defend them. In contrast, Iranian Jews and Yemeni Jews don’t have the same rights and security.
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It seems inevitable that eventually the situation for all Jews in Europe will resemble the current situation of the Jews living in Malmo Sweden. There is a growing exodus of Jews already going on in Europe.
 
Kaninchen said:
Hm, the Nazis killed Jews, Gypsies and they’d have gone on to do away with the Slavs as well. Christians were killed when they were part of some ‘inferior’ race (like Poles) or part of some of some oppositional grouping, or supposed oppositional grouping.

The Nazis were very very good at discrimination, they turned it into a ‘science’.

They liked Muslims an awful lot, of course, and Muslims seemed to get on well with them.
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Sad but true. And I’m very weary of anyone who tries to downplay the current trials that the Jews are facing -as if things aren’t ‘bad enough’ to even say anything about it…:rolleyes:

…as if we’re supposed to keep quiet until things get ‘really’ bad…:rolleyes: yeah, no I don’t think so. :cool:
 
We have a police car at our synagogue and two policemen 24 / 7, and before you can enter the building you’re going through (we students don’t of course) some security door thingy like the ones that they have at airports.
 
504Katrin said:
We have a police car at our synagogue and two policemen 24 / 7, and before you can enter the building you’re going through (we students don’t of course) some security door thingy like the ones that they have at airports.
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Unfortunately, that’s what it is in Europe. When I was in Paris there were policemen with machine guns outside the synogogues, and when I was in Rome, there was the same- including bulletproof police booths too, metal detectors and very strict checks- including passport checks, to get in.

Quite frankly, I don’t understand how the Jews there can remain under those circumstances.

The following has a very harsh title, but is worth a read:

Op-Ed: Jews, Leave Eurauschwitz Now!, by Giulio Meotti

*As comfortable as life can be in the arrondissements of Paris or in Berlin’s cafes, the situation for the Jews will only worsen in Europe.

Not only European taxes are used in several ways to fund anti-Semitism of an intensity unseen since Nazi Germany, but the democratic Western countries are surprisingly the ones, primarily France and England, which registered the highest numbers of attacks in 2012.

If 90 incidents of anti-Semitic nature were recorded in Berlin since January, in the first eight months of 2012 UK registered 299 attacks deemed anti-Semitic so far…*
 
YKohen said:
Unfortunately, that’s what it is in Europe. When I was in Paris there were policemen with machine guns outside the synogogues, and when I was in Rome, there was the same- including bulletproof police booths too, metal detectors and very strict checks- including passport checks, to get in.

Quite frankly, I don’t understand how the Jews there can remain under those circumstances.

The following has a very harsh title, but is worth a read:

Op-Ed: Jews, Leave Eurauschwitz Now!, by Giulio Meotti

*As comfortable as life can be in the arrondissements of Paris or in Berlin’s cafes, the situation for the Jews will only worsen in Europe.

Not only European taxes are used in several ways to fund anti-Semitism of an intensity unseen since Nazi Germany, but the democratic Western countries are surprisingly the ones, primarily France and England, which registered the highest numbers of attacks in 2012.

If 90 incidents of anti-Semitic nature were recorded in Berlin since January, in the first eight months of 2012 UK registered 299 attacks deemed anti-Semitic so far…*
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From the article you shared…
On the anniversary of the Holocaust Museum in Berlin, historian Eberhard Jackel said: ‘Nations envy us this memorial.’
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Leaves me speechless…
 
User124 said:
As for the unborn, it’s totally two different subjects, but the matter of fact that most of aborted unborn are not yet sentient, they’re just a group of cells with no sentiments, no conscience, no ability for experiences and feelings.
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Your post loses credibility at the point I’ve highlighted. Even an atheist scientist would disagree with you. Even if I were not a Catholic I would disagree with you. As a scientist I can assure you an unborn child is more that just “a group of cells”.
 
Kouyate42 said:
before gently slitting the throat of the animal …
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Personally, I don’t want to comment on the topic of this post. I eat meat so I know animals have died to feed me. I don’t think killing animals to feed humans is in itself wrong. So I don’t side with the vegetarians and vegans. There is undoubtedly many problems with the whole area of farming animals for food. The crux of this thread is whether the ritual methods of slaughter utilised by Islam and Judaism are cruel compared with other methods. As I don’t know enough about these ritual slaughters and methods used in abbatoirs I don’t want to comment. However, I’m not sure that slitting the throat of any animal can be described as gentle.

On a side note, why do Jews and Muslims believe animals should be killed by this method?
 
504Katrin said:
We have a police car at our synagogue and two policemen 24 / 7, and before you can enter the building you’re going through (we students don’t of course) some security door thingy like the ones that they have at airports.
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Is that here in NOLA?
 
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