E-bay transaction for dirt cheap! Ok or sinful?

[The_Otaku]

I am going to buy the art program Corel Painter X. If I were to buy it directly from Corel, it would cost $419.00 USD.

I’m finding the same item on e-bay for as low as 99 cents in some cases.These e-bay ones could be bootlegs, copies, or burns of an official cd. The problem is, there’s no way for me to know that, and what makes it concerning is that none of these sellers are providing the cd with the box, just the cd in it’s envelope (the user manuel is on the cd). This could be legitimate in itself too, since they may be trying to increase inventory space, or reduce the cost of shipping by weight, size, etc.

Some of the sellers haven’t done much business, and others seem reputable and have done thousands of transactions with perfect buyer feedback. I’m not sure how to feel about this. I don’t know whether or not I’m committing a sin by purchasing something so expensive for next to nothing. This is made worse by not knowing whether they’re legal copies either, and there are ways to make it look legitimate, such as printing a pre-generated activation codes gained through crack programs like keygen and such, on the envelope, to give the buyer a sense of peace and security.

I don’t how anyone is going to make any money selling this program for a buck, or 10 in an auction, or “buy it now” for 35 or so. Even at 35, you feel guilty paying such a cheap price, and it’s the cheap price that makes it suspicious. On the other hand, however, it could be completely legitimate with some of these sellers.

You just don’t know and it’s an act of blind faith. My concern is whether I’m committing a sin by buying something for so cheap and not knowing if it’s a legal, official copy. It’s their right to sell such an expensive program for as little or as much as they like. But they don’t have to be honest about how they have the program and where they got it from and how they’re offering to me.

I know I wouldn’t be committing a mortal sin, since I’m completely ignorant as a buyer here, but it being really cheap is sort of making me go back and forth. If I’m committing a venial sin, I’d imagine it’s only one time, since the ignorance to the fact it’s an illegal copy is perpetuated and not repeated.

I expect to get mixed reactions over this given a past e-bay thread that was posted, but this is for a specific product, and it’s not a hypothetical question. It’s an actual choice I have right in front of me.

 

[The_Otaku]

Another thing I thought of is what does it matter if it’s cheap or expensive? A higher price makes it seem more legitimate, but if they’re dishonest people providing an illegal copy, then they’re lying, preying on your conscience, AND making money, and it’s still an illegal copy either way.

Which would be the lesser of two evils in this case? Buying a cheaper illegal copy or a more expensive one? If you buy the more expensive one thinking it’s legitimate, you’re making his racketeering more profitable. If you pay the cheap price, he’s not really getting anywhere and you’re not helping him as much, but it’s still wrong what he’s doing and you’re ignorant to the facts.

Does the fact I cannot know if it’s legal or illegal completely mitigate all sin for me period? Is that the bottom line? What if I think it’s illegal but I cannot possibly KNOW that it is?

 

[Gamera]

The .99 cent bid must just be an opening bid — there’s probably a reserve below which the item won’t be sold. Reserves on e-bay drive me nuts.

When in doubt about the item’s legitimacy, bid only on the listings which include a photograph of the item. Then you can see if it’s a legit version or a bootleg.

But there’s nothing wrong with getting a great deal.

Wholesalers got the item dirt cheap, and there’s any number of legitimate reasons for them to unload it cheap.

Private sellers might be in a situation where quick cash has more “value” to them than anything else. The private seller, not you, is in the best position to decide how badly he needs quick cash. If he considered the price unfair, he would’t offer it.

 

[The_Otaku]

Wholesalers got the item dirt cheap, and there’s any number of legitimate reasons for them to unload it cheap.

I read your whole post, of course, but it’s this specific part that makes me feel a whole heck of a lot better! The fact there are legitimate reasons for them to be selling cheap makes me feel better. I just wish I knew what those reasons were and that they were, in fact, a legitimate business DOING legitimate business.

That’s all well and good, assuming of course you’re buying from an e-bay business, and not from an individual with no business. There’s obviously a greater sense of security when you buy from a company, but not from an individual, since you have reasonable scruples and doubts about them.

Another thing is the feedback system. Thousands of positive feedbacks looks good, but it could just mean people don’t care if they got a bootleg, they cared about the price which is why they went through with it to begin with. Sort of an under the table, you scratch my back I scratch yours sort of arrangement. There’s no reason for them to report such an individual if he gave them what they needed and wanted at a price they had no right to argue with and would rather praise him for. The thing is, this is software, which really just comes down to files on a cd, which are all the same all the time from one disk to another. If something is defective, it either is or is not, but it’s quality does not go up or down and the files will work the same way. It’s worth is intangible in that sense and therefore easily negotiated in terms of price where the item is sold.

That might make us feel better, but it gives the deceitful person more wiggle room.

 

[AHapka]

It’s a hard one, to be perfectly honest. And unfortunately it’s a risk you take with buying on e-bay.

I have some software sitting down in my basement that I never use anymore. If I put it on e-bay and got $5.00 for it, my attitude would be “that’s five bucks I didn’t have before.” So it is entirely plausible that a private seller could just be offloading his old software.

I could also see it being sold without a box, as I know many people who aren’t very organized and who could have easily lost/destroyed the box.

That being said, it is also entire plausible that you could be purchasing a bootleg copy. Unfortunately, there is really no “sure” way to guarantee that it’s not.

If you ask them if they are selling a legal copy and they give some assurance of that, and you purchase it in good faith there is no sin, venial or mortal for you. It would only be after you learn that it was bootleg that any possibility of sin would exist.

In short: you can never be completely sure. That is one of the facts of life for doing business on e-bay.

 

[GemmaRose]

I agree with the above posters.

Besides, the real sin is that some software companies, whose CEOs are raking in millions of dollars hand over fist and who make far more money than they pay the people who actually write the programs, reproduce these programs for the pittance it costs to copy it onto a CD and package it up and then sell the programs for hundreds of dollars.

Because of this, it would not bother my conscience to buy something at a lower price as long as it wasn’t a bootleg copy because that would be aiding a criminal activity, which is morally and ethically objectionable.

To ease your conscience, contact the sellers who appear to be reputable and ask questions as to if the program is legal or not. A reputable buyer will answer your email. If they do answer and lie, take the matter up with ebay.

 

[Mintaka]

It’s not immoral to charge what the traffic will bear.

Now, of course the Rule of St. Benedict said “And in the prices let not the sin of avarice creep in, but let the goods always be sold a little cheaper than they can be sold by people in the world, ‘that in all things God may be glorified’.”

But of course this also undercut the pricing of local farms and businesses, which was part of why the Benedictine monasteries of the Middle Ages were almost always prosperous little industrial and agricultural centers. (Along with the labor being available for the cost of food and keep alone, without actually being slaves/serfs and thus unwilling labor.) Benedictine monks and nuns were Wal-Mart.

Today many folks argue that when Wal-Mart sells things a little cheaper than they can be sold by people in the world, it’s immoral.

So obviously, expensive software that makes a big profit must be much more moral than the cheap stuff, ne?

 

[The_Otaku]

Thank you for the responses, everyone. I feel about better about making this transaction.

Painter X is still pretty new, it was only released recently, and it is the newest version of Painter, the rival of Photoshop (which recently had it’s most recent update with CS4 if I’m not mistaken). It’s one of those high-end programs that professionals and amateurs use alike, and considering the amazing things that can be done digitally with such a program, you really are taken back by the idea such an expensive piece of software would or could be sold for as cheap as 10 dollars or less.

When I think about it, though, all that money I’d be saving is going to help in other areas, too. It’s not as if the money saved is to be spent, squandered, or wasted. That money will help me pay for college, basic expenses, etc.

 

[wjp984]

Sometimes there are massive shipping charges within the fine print. I don’t know how many times I’ve seen a great deal on Ebay turn out to be just average or acceptable based on the shipping charges in the fine print. For example, a $5 item with a $10 shipping charge.

 

[The_Otaku]

Sometimes there are massive shipping charges within the fine print. I don’t know how many times I’ve seen a great deal on Ebay turn out to be just average or acceptable based on the shipping charges in the fine print. For example, a $5 item with a $10 shipping charge.

Well, they have to nail you somehow, don’t they?

It’s funny when we realize they’re not making anything on the product. The actual profit is in shipping and handling! LOL!

 

[KJS]

I’m going to go out on a limb here and say it is possibly illegal/pirated software. No wholesaler is going to be able to sell a $419 retail software product for less than a dollar. The lack of CD case/etc. is even more dubious. Be wary that you aren’t supporting shady business practices.

 

[The_Otaku]

I’m going to go out on a limb here and say it is possibly illegal/pirated software. No wholesaler is going to be able to sell a $419 retail software product for less than a dollar. The lack of CD case/etc. is even more dubious. Be wary that you aren’t supporting shady business practices.

It comes with the original envelope the auctions say, which means the activation code is on there. What you’re not getting is the original box.

But yeah, it is suspicious.

 

[KJS]

I’d say its a toss-up as to whether that “activation code” isn’t a pirated one. Just be very careful.

 

[The_Otaku]

I’d say its a toss-up as to whether that “activation code” isn’t a pirated one. Just be very careful.

It’s a gamble, really. There’s no other way to be careful. You either buy it or you don’t, and you find out when you get it if it’s pirated. And even then, it may be such a good fake that you can’t tell the difference.

 

[Mike_Dye]

Hi, Let me reassure you, eBays policing policy is not something to be ignored,
They really do police their site.
I am a power seller on ebay, (meb00dye) and I know what I am talking about.
Just bid if you want the item.
I start my items way below what I have in them to get the auction fever going…This was before the financial crunch we are now in. Now I am giving away my invintory…live and learn.

 

[The_Otaku]

Hi, Let me reassure you, eBays policing policy is not something to be ignored,
They really do police their site.
I am a power seller on ebay, (meb00dye) and I know what I am talking about.
Just bid if you want the item.
I start my items way below what I have in them to get the auction fever going…This was before the financial crunch we are now in. Now I am giving away my invintory…live and learn.

Thank you for your (name removed by moderator)ut. It’s good to hear from someone in an experienced position on the matter. And, actually, the guy I was considering buying the program from is a power seller like yourself, so that did give me some sense of security.