Early church

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Interesting article; bad facts.
At the time of Christ the most ancient Law and the Prophet in existent were in Greek
housed in The Alexandria Library. Christ quoted the Aramaic paraphrases when
teaching, not the Hebrew. I have read the Ecumenical Counsels and the is nothing of
a cannon of old or new testament until the Counsel of Trent that I could find. But for
some reason the Orthodox and Catholic Bibles have the same books in them. They
grew up in different traditions and languages ( the Orthodox claim superiority of the
original Greek and there probably right) I know for fact that the canon of scripture was
not discuss in the first seven counsel before the schism. Why the same canon by
East and West; no one knows. Not until Luther was the Bible modified.
Estranged East and West agreeded but never discussed it; Holy Spirit???
The Politically Incorrect Fact is, Protestantism is Just a Heresy.
 
DanWelshiMac said:
Interesting article; bad facts.
At the time of Christ the most ancient Law and the Prophet in existent were in Greek
housed in The Alexandria Library…
Click to expand...
Just wondering, how can you know the most ancient manuscripts of the OT in Christ’s time were in Greek?
DanWelshiMac said:
I have read the Ecumenical Counsels and the is nothing of
a cannon of old or new testament until the Counsel of Trent that I could find. But for
some reason the Orthodox and Catholic Bibles have the same books in them. They
grew up in different traditions and languages ( the Orthodox claim superiority of the
original Greek and there probably right) I know for fact that the canon of scripture was
not discuss in the first seven counsel before the schism. Why the same canon by
East and West; no one knows. Not until Luther was the Bible modified.
Estranged East and West agreeded but never discussed it; Holy Spirit???
The Politically Incorrect Fact is, Protestantism is Just a Heresy.
Click to expand...
This is not strictly true, the Eastern Orthodox also accept several books not accepted by the Roman Catholic church
 
Jonni said:
Hi, hope your all well.

Could someone who has some spare time please read what I have found and maybe answer some of it from a catholic point of view.

Thanks in advance.

greatsite.com/timeline-english-bible-history/pre-reformation.html
Click to expand...
I will respond to this part of the article:

[Pope Leo the Tenth established a practice called the “selling of indulgences” as a way to extort money from the people. He offered forgiveness of sins for a fairly small amount of money. For a little bit more money, you would be allowed to indulge in a continuous lifestyle of sin, such as keeping a mistress. Also, through the invention of “Purgatory”, you could purchase the salvation of your loved-one’s souls. The church taught the ignorant masses, “As soon as the coin in the coffer rings, the troubled soul from Purgatory springs!” Pope Leo the Tenth showed his true feelings when he said, “The fable of Christ has been quite profitable to us!”

Editorial Note: Let us state at this point, that it is not our intent to offend or “bash” Roman Catholics. It is unavoidable that every historical account has its “good guys” and its “bad guys”. Just as it is impossible to accurately tell the story of World War Two without offending the Germans and the Italians who were undeniably the enemies of world peace at that time… **it is equally impossible to accurately tell the story of the English Bible without unintentionally offending those who continue to revere the Roman Catholic and Anglican Churches. Where was the true church of God during these Dark Ages?]

First of all, your reading an article with obvious anti-Catholic undertones. Is the author of the article implying what I highlighted that we shouldn’t continue to revere the Roman Catholic Church because the sinful behavior of Her (the Catholic Church) members?

Jesus never said that all of the members of His Church would be perfect, otherwise He never would have died for any of us because we are all sinners! Jesus came to rescue the sinner - Praise God - we can’t overcome sin without Him.

And just a thought, scandal is nothing new in the Church. How bout Judas Iscariot for starters? Jesus’ One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church is made up of members who are both good and bad and some of those members won’t perservere and make it to heaven.

Jesus is what makes the Church holy and His Church itself is holy because it is the source or vehicle or means by which we receive His grace thru the Sacraments which help us to become holy. It is by far the best path I know to take as I journey home to Heaven.
 
DanWelshiMac said:
Interesting article; bad facts.
At the time of Christ the most ancient Law and the Prophet in existent were in Greek
housed in The Alexandria Library. Christ quoted the Aramaic paraphrases when
teaching, not the Hebrew. I have read the Ecumenical Counsels and the is nothing of
a cannon of old or new testament until the Counsel of Trent that I could find. But for
some reason the Orthodox and Catholic Bibles have the same books in them. They
grew up in different traditions and languages ( the Orthodox claim superiority of the
original Greek and there probably right) I know for fact that the canon of scripture was
not discuss in the first seven counsel before the schism. Why the same canon by
East and West; no one knows. Not until Luther was the Bible modified.
Estranged East and West agreeded but never discussed it; Holy Spirit???
The Politically Incorrect Fact is, Protestantism is Just a Heresy.
Click to expand...
Quick minor correction: the Orthodox Old Testament Canon is larger than the Catholic Old Testament (& Catholic is larger than Protestant).
 
DanWelshiMac said:
Interesting article; bad facts.
At the time of Christ the most ancient Law and the Prophet in existent were in Greek
housed in The Alexandria Library. Christ quoted the Aramaic paraphrases when
teaching, not the Hebrew. I have read the Ecumenical Counsels and the is nothing of
a cannon of old or new testament until the Counsel of Trent that I could find. But for
some reason the Orthodox and Catholic Bibles have the same books in them. They
grew up in different traditions and languages ( the Orthodox claim superiority of the
original Greek and there probably right) I know for fact that the canon of scripture was
not discuss in the first seven counsel before the schism. Why the same canon by
East and West; no one knows. Not until Luther was the Bible modified.
Estranged East and West agreeded but never discussed it; Holy Spirit???
Click to expand...
Not until Luther was the Bible modified? Really? Do you have a source that indicates that no modifications ever happened to the Bible until Luther placed the deuterocanon, including the Prayer of Manasseh, in a section between the OT and NT?
The Politically Incorrect Fact is, Protestantism is Just a Heresy.
Click to expand...
Define protestantism.

Jon
 
Protestant + Protesting against the Catholic church. ML, JW, King Henry VIII, and so on.
 
peace2u2 said:
I will respond to this part of the article:

[Pope Leo the Tenth established a practice called the “selling of indulgences” as a way to extort money from the people. He offered forgiveness of sins for a fairly small amount of money. For a little bit more money, you would be allowed to indulge in a continuous lifestyle of sin, such as keeping a mistress. Also, through the invention of “Purgatory”, you could purchase the salvation of your loved-one’s souls. The church taught the ignorant masses, “As soon as the coin in the coffer rings, the troubled soul from Purgatory springs!” Pope Leo the Tenth showed his true feelings when he said, “The fable of Christ has been quite profitable to us!”

Editorial Note: Let us state at this point, that it is not our intent to offend or “bash” Roman Catholics. It is unavoidable that every historical account has its “good guys” and its “bad guys”. Just as it is impossible to accurately tell the story of World War Two without offending the Germans and the Italians who were undeniably the enemies of world peace at that time… **it is equally impossible to accurately tell the story of the English Bible without unintentionally offending those who continue to revere the Roman Catholic and Anglican Churches.
Click to expand...
Where was the true church of God during these Dark Ages?]

First of all, your reading an article with obvious anti-Catholic undertones. Is the author of the article implying what I highlighted that we shouldn’t continue to revere the Roman Catholic Church because the sinful behavior of Her (the Catholic Church) members?

Jesus never said that all of the members of His Church would be perfect, otherwise He never would have died for any of us because we are all sinners! Jesus came to rescue the sinner - Praise God - we can’t overcome sin without Him.

And just a thought, scandal is nothing new in the Church. How bout Judas Iscariot for starters? Jesus’ One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church is made up of members who are both good and bad and some of those members won’t perservere and make it to heaven.

Jesus is what makes the Church holy and His Church itself is holy because it is the source or vehicle or means by which we receive His grace thru the Sacraments which help us to become holy. It is by far the best path I know to take as I journey home to Heaven.

Many thanks for your reply.
I know I am reading what you call anti catholic undertones but i need to ask as I am converting to catholic and need your help to overcome things. Also it’s good to come from people who have a good understanding of the bible and history and also from people who have strong faith.

You have given me a good answer and I thank you as we’ll as other members for your time and effort.
 
I thought it was “interesting” to learn that St Columba founded a “bible college” on Iona to preach evangelical doctrine 16 centuries before evangelcelism and "bible colleges had even been invented.
 
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Jonni:
Hi, hope your all well.

Could someone who has some spare time please read what I have found and maybe answer some of it from a catholic point of view.

Thanks in advance.

greatsite.com/timeline-en…formation.html
Click to expand...
The authors advances the aged old argument that the catholic church kept the bible in Latin to have ultimate power. In fact, in 600 AD about only 5% of the population could read. And if you could read…guess what language it was…LATIN. The church took great steps to preserve the written word from error. The church burned heretical copies of the bible too.

And as far as bad popes…well we all are human. Popes are not guaranteed to be impeccable. In fact, some of them have been scoundrels. But who cares. Look at it this way…if the Holy Spirit wasn’t active in the Catholic Church, it"s members would have tore apart this church many times.

So, next time you read such anti catholic garbage, dissect what the author is saying and it becomes clear very quickly it is just rhetoric.

Posted from Catholic.com App for Android
 
Jonni said:
Many thanks for your reply.
I know I am reading what you call anti catholic undertones but i need to ask as I am converting to catholic and need your help to overcome things. Also it’s good to come from people who have a good understanding of the bible and history and also from people who have strong faith.

You have given me a good answer and I thank you as we’ll as other members for your time and effort.
Click to expand...
Jonni, I would like to give you a list of really good books to read but the list would be very long. So for starters, this book is a wonderful companion to reading Sacred Scripture:

The Catechism of the Catholic Church
usccb.org/beliefs-and-teachings/what-we-believe/catechism/catechism-of-the-catholic-church/epub/index.cfm

On the left side of the page you will see a contents page and if you scroll down to the title that says Prologue-1. The Life of Man-To Know and Love God and read and contemplate each section, what you will find that the Catholic Chuch has revealed by the power of the Holy Spirit, the fullness of God’s truth and grace.

Also, this was a very good book which you can probably borrow from your local library:
Search and Rescue: How to Bring Your Family and Friends Into or Back Into the Catholic Church by Patrick Madrid. He has a list of books that are the same books that I would recommend to you to read.

As God calls you to learn more about Him, He will lead you to everything that He would like you to know about Him and He will reveal Himself to you in a way that is unique and special just as you are unique and special.

God Bless you on your spiritual journey.
Peace.
 
That site gave me the best laugh of the day:thumbsup:

There were copies of the Bible in many languages other than Latin well before John Wycliffe’s day. This site has a good overview of the development of the canon.

Www.scripturehistory.com.

It uses Adobie Flash so can’t be viewed on IPads or IPhones
 
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