Eastern Beliefs

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adstrinity

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  1. Why leavened bread in the Eucharist?
  2. Is it even called the, “Eucharist,” in the East.
  3. What other Eastern terminology do I need to know to make this a viable discussion?
  4. Please explain HOW the Holy Spirit can proceed from The Father but not The Son. WHAT is the relation between The Later Two, then? It makes it sound like The Son was just…not involved with The Spirit.
  5. Toll-House doctrine. Really, what is it? I’ll accept that it’s a theory, but, do you have to pay to proceed to the next Toll House?
  6. (Just in case this wasn’t answered in another post). Why say, “Eternal Memory”? What does it do/what is the purpose of saying it?
I’m not looking for one post to answer all of the questions posed. I’m not saying to or not to, but, for now, these are the questions I have and would appreciate legitimate answers.

Thank you kindly.
 
Your questions are very worded in provcative fashion. Perhaps a Greko Catolic can help you to understand - that is what you want.
Remember Christianity began in Greek speaking world - Eucharist is a Greek word, of course it is used in East. Leavening bread makes it have life and not be a dead sacrifice. Read Evangile of St. John 15:26. In order to have our deceased beloved Orthodox christian’s always remembered in mind of God. I never heard of such houses.
 
Your questions are very worded in provcative fashion.
I assure you, they are not intended as such. Very much not.
Perhaps a Greko Catolic can help you to understand - that is what you want.
I want to understand how the Eastern Church sees things. I have been exposed to the East, but, I understand things through the West’s filter.
Remember Christianity began in Greek speaking world - Eucharist is a Greek word, of course it is used in East.
Oh. Heh.
Leavening bread makes it have life and not be a dead sacrifice.
thinks Oh. Well, that makes sense. That is logically thought out and theologically significant.
Read Evangile of St. John 15:26.
Thank you for giving me this verse to read. In the NAB Bible, it reads, "“When the Advocate comes whom I will send 12 you from the Father, the Spirit of truth that proceeds from the Father, he will testify to me.” and comes with the footnote: “12 [26] Whom I will send: in John 14:16, 26 the Paraclete is to be sent by the Father, at the request of Jesus. Here the Spirit comes from both Jesus and the Father in mission; there is no reference here to the eternal procession of the Spirit.”
nccbuscc.org/nab/bible/john/john15.htm#foot12

…I take it that the Eastern interpretation is not the same. BUT, I asked and you answered and I thank you for your answer. WHICH brings me to my next question. Can somebody who uses an Orthodox Bible online please link me up to a reliable English translation?
In order to have our deceased beloved Orthodox christian’s always remembered in mind of God.
Thank you.
I never heard of such houses.
Alright. Thank you very much for being the first and helping me out here.
 
  1. Why leavened bread in the Eucharist?
Why not? Leavened bread has been used since the earliest times, as has unleavened bread. It’s used because it’s bread, and bread is the matter of the Eucharist.
  1. Is it even called the, “Eucharist,” in the East.
Yes, “eucharist” is a Greek term.
  1. What other Eastern terminology do I need to know to make this a viable discussion?
No so far as I can tell.
  1. Please explain HOW the Holy Spirit can proceed from The Father but not The Son. WHAT is the relation between The Later Two, then? It makes it sound like The Son was just…not involved with The Spirit.
As an Easterm Catholic I don’t agree with the stance of some Eastern Orthodox that the Son has no role in the procession of the Holy Spirit.

The only thing I believe the Son can’t be “a part of” is in being the Source of the Holy Spirit, since only the Father is the Source of deity. Only the Father is Divine without receiving the Divine Nature from another, so only the Father is the Source of the Son and Holy Spirit, but the procession of the Holy Spirit is through the Son.
  1. Toll-House doctrine. Really, what is it? I’ll accept that it’s a theory, but, do you have to pay to proceed to the next Toll House?
So far as I know it’s a specifically Russian tradition, not something common to all Eastern Orthodox. I don’t really know much about it.
  1. (Just in case this wasn’t answered in another post). Why say, “Eternal Memory”? What does it do/what is the purpose of saying it?
Interesting question. I don’t know the historical reasons, nor the traditional reason for its use. I know that in my personal understanding it is a request that the person dwell in God’s eternal intentions and Glory. Since the Glorified share in the eternal presence of God, “memory eternal” means that they will have Eternal Life as they will be held there by God.
This is what I can offer. God bless!
 
I need to understand the difference here with the explaination of levened bread signifying life.

My thought was, isnt it a sacrifice that is offered? I guess its a mingling of the dead God Man, with the risen Christ, to have leavend bread then?

Which is confusing. Its a sacrifice that is being signifgant here, which would mean death in order for it to truly be a sacrifice.

Isnt the mixing of the risen to heaven Christ a seperate event that happened days later?

I am just asking because I am confused about the ritual signifigance of why christians do what they do, and what importance it means by how they do it.
 
  1. Why leavened bread in the Eucharist?
Living Sacrifice, Sacred Tradition.
  1. Is it even called the, “Eucharist,” in the East.
Yup.
  1. What other Eastern terminology do I need to know to make this a viable discussion?
More important: learn to use the forum search tools. Do some reading of older threads on the issues.

A few terms that are used without much thought around here for the potential confusion:

Eparch: Bishop
Metropolitan: Think Roman Archbishop; Almost all Roman Archbishops are Metropolitans.
Archbishop: not all Eastern Archbishops are metropolitans.
Patriarch: Patriarch is to Archbishops as Archbishops are to Bishops. The exact nature varies by church.
Primatial Bishop: The head bishop of a given synod. May be a Metropolitan, Major Archbishop, or Patriarch depending on church.

Church: a particular group of one Tradition having a distinct hierarchy.
Sui Iuris: Self Governing. Catholic only.
Autonomous: Self-governing, but still attached to their parent church. Orthodox Only.
Autocephalous: Self-heading. Orthodox Only. No longer part of their parent church.
SCOBA: Society of Canonical Orthodox Bishops of America. Inter-church coordinating body for the Eastern Orthodox in America. (US, Canada, Mexico, IIRC)

Rite: particular form of worship deriving from one of 6 sources: Rome, Antioch, Constantinople, Alexandria, Syria, Armenia.
Tradition: A regionalized expression of a given rite, or a Sacred tradition, context dependent.
Sacred Tradition: part of the Deposit of Faith.

orthodox: having correct faith/belief/teaching. Note the lowercase ‘o’
heterodox: having incorrect faith/belief/teaching
orthopraxis: having correct practice (of the rituals)
heteropraxis: having incorrect practice (of the rituals)
Orthodox: if not prefaced, referring to the Canonical Eastern Orthodox Churches as a communion. note the Uppercase ‘O’
Oriental Orthodox: Those churches in union with the Coptic Pope of Alexandria
Eastern Orthodox: Those churches in communion with the Ecumenical Patriarch and the Muscovite Patriarch. Canonical Orthodox is a near synonym, but excludes a few bodies.
Catholic: In union with the Pope of Rome.
  1. Please explain HOW the Holy Spirit can proceed from The Father but not The Son. WHAT is the relation between The Later Two, then? It makes it sound like The Son was just…not involved with The Spirit.
Several recent threads on that alone.
  1. Toll-House doctrine. Really, what is it? I’ll accept that it’s a theory, but, do you have to pay to proceed to the next Toll House?
It’s a parallel theory to purgatory. It’s the journey after death, and at various points, the soul is supposedly put through trials. It’s not mainstream in Orthodoxy, per se, but it is generally not considered heterodoxy, either.
  1. (Just in case this wasn’t answered in another post). Why say, “Eternal Memory”? What does it do/what is the purpose of saying it?
It’s the Byzantine way of remembering the dead

the Ruthenian pewbook has this version:
Cleric: “In blessed repose, grant, O Lord, eternal rest to your departed servant (Name/s) and remember (him-her-them) forever.”
People: “Eternal memory! Eternal memory! Blessed Repose and eternal memory!”

the shorthand is “Eternal Memory…” which for most byzantines will immediately trigger a mental recitation of the prayer.

There are a number of variations.
 
I can recommend a good place to go to get your questions answered.

Go to the Q&A page for the Orthodox Church of America. They have a similar forum to this (not quite as interactive) and they will answer your question very honestly and directly.

With regard to a good translation of the Orthodox Bible - Thomas Nelson just published an excellent Orthodox Study Bible. It’s actually based on the NKJV, but the Old Testament is a new translation based on the Septuagint (sp?)

Many Orthodox (Like myself) use Catholic Bibles - i.e. RSV.

Toll Houses are/is a much debated topic in the East. IMO - it’s just a different interpretation of Purgatory (I’m sure I’ll get someone steamed about that comment 😃 )

Hope this helps
 
From what I know of the Toll Houses (I have never been there ;)), they are “toll houses” where demons test the soul on its ascent to Heaven. I know it is a heated topics among many Orthodox scholars as to the orthodoxy of it (many claim it to be neo-gnostic), but not so much among Byzantine Catholics (I have seen few mentions of it and heard none).

If you want enough information on Toll houses to earn your Doctorate (just kidding), search the links on this orthodoxwiki article. There are a ton of articles at the bottom both in support of and opposed to the Toll House Theory. It will give you a good idea of what each side thinks.

orthodoxwiki.org/Aerial_Toll-Houses

Prayers and petitions,
Alexius:cool:
 
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