Dear brother devoutchristian,
Though we disagree about calling the suffering in Purgatory as a punishment, I’m not saying you are heterodox for it. You can believe it as you like. It will not affect our unity in the Faith. I think the issue is that non-Latins would reject an attempt by Latins to impose that particular notion on our belief system.
Blessings,
Marduk
Hi,
orthodoxinfo.com/death/stmark_purg.aspx
When giving in this answer (June 14th), Bessarion explained the difference of the Greek and Latin doctrine on this subject. The Latins, he said, allow that now, and until the day of the last judgment, departed souls are purified by fire, and are thus liberated from their sins; so that,
he who has sinned the most will be a longer time undergoing purification, whereas he whose sins are less will be absolved the sooner, with the aid of the Church; but in the future life they allow the eternal, and not the purgatorial fire. Thus the Latins receive both the temporal and the eternal fire, and call the first the purgatorial fire.
On the other hand,
the Greeks teach of one eternal fire alone, understanding that the temporal punishment of sinful souls consists in that they f
or a time depart into a place of darkness and sorrow, are punished by being deprived of the Divine light, and are purified—that is, liberated from this place of darkness and woe—by means of prayers, the Holy Eucharist, and deeds of charity, and not by fire. The Greeks also believe, that until the union of the souls to the bodies, as the souls of sinners do not suffer full punishment, so also those of the saints do not enjoy entire bliss. But the Latins, agreeing with the Greeks in the first point, do not allow the last one, affirming that the souls of saints have already received their full heavenly reward.
Would this be correct?
Luke 16:22-24 "The poor man died and was carried by the angels to Abraham’s bosom. The rich man also died and was buried;
Code:
and in Hades, being in torment, he lifted up his eyes, and saw Abraham far off and Laz'arus in his bosom.
And he called out, 'Father Abraham, have mercy upon me, and send Laz'arus to dip the end of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am in anguish in this flame.'
Hades is the Greek equivalent of the Old Testament Hebrew word Sheol?
It refers to the underworld abode of the dead and while in the early writings it is described in rather vague terms,
there are indications in some uses that the lot of the dead is not the same in the case of the righteous and the wicked.
Now when Adam and Eve were sent from the Garden of Eden, they were being denied communion presence of God, and that was the serpents intent to separate Adam and Eve from that communion?
While God’s expelling them from the Garden was an act of Mercy, it was also a painful experience, for both Adam and Eve being outside of His Presence.
The closer we come to death the closer we come to God in the next life.
there are those not quite deserving heaven, but then again not the fires of hell.
God in His Mercy prepares those not ready for heaven,
You want to Call it Sheol, Hades,
I’ve also read it as Ladder of ascent, in which satan will try to hold us back from ascending by Calling out the sin in our Life, trying to deny us the Presence of God.
(St. John Damacene? 700 a.d.)
Jhn 18:18 Now the servants and officers had made a charcoal fire, because it was cold, and they were standing and warming themselves;
Peter also was with them, standing and warming himself.
I’ve heard this Scripture described By Bishop Fulton Sheen ;
(Paraphrased)
When Peter followed Christ to the Courtyard, but stayed far enough back so that he could barely see him, and then after denying Christ that first time warmed himself by the fire, “It is cold outside the Presence of God.”
Being outside of His Presence after physical death we burn with a greater desire to be with Him all the more.
Hell/ Gehenna is knowing you’ll never be in His Presence,
Western/ Eastern/ Orthodox/ Judaism all believe in a theological state between Heaven and Hell.
Whether it is a cold dreary nothingness, a burning to be with Him, a purification by God’s eternal Light, all of the above involves a judgement of God concerning the sin committed in our lives and that hurts.
In This Life, Admitting to a wrong hurts, (secularly/ religiously/ spiritually/emotionally everybody’s sorry, when they get caught! What of the things we thought we could get away with, or the things we put off putting punishment off till later?)
but how about the hidden things we have kept to ourselves, that only the light of God can purge from our Souls in preparation of Him receiving us full. God knows our hearts and our secrets!
Either way It’s going to Hurt! However, the grand scheme of God’s plan is If your in this ‘middle ground’ There is the Grandest Joy of knowing you’ll are in His Grace Mercy and soon to Be Presence.
Kinda like Confession absolution, and then restitution. It hurts when we did sin, we overjoyed to have God’s forgiveness, but still have to painstakingly pay for it,
Like the Rich Man, After all it is not God who punishes us, it is we who are in punish ourselves (Wisdom 1:12)
God bless,
John
