Eastern Orthodox

[GaryTaylor]

I think you are a bit hard on the QB. Most teams would give anything for a QB like Sanchez. He has been to two Championship games in his first two years!

Oh thats my team, but man, this quy for the first quarter of every game you sit there waiting for him to calm down.

He immediatly starts overthrowing which is just anxiousness with his set-up on his front foot, then once he’s shaken he’s all the field. By then its no secret you have to Run the Ball. He’s scary. Maybe your right though. He’s probly the type of guy they’ll get sick of and trade, then he’ll play unreal with the next team.

When he comes out an connects a couple easy pass’s, hes’ fine. Which is why I couldn’t understand why they didn’t run that Niner or Giant offense with all quick outs, roll outs, play-action. Seems to me the Drop Back just adds to his anxiety.

I guess its easy to be a monday morning QB

 

[Mickey]

Getting the discussion back to the topic of Orthodoxy, I contacted the parish near me and the priest invited me out to attend either a Sunday service or he said I could go tonight to a shorter service called Vespers. What’s that like? How is it different and similar to a liturgy? He also said he would be happy to answer my questions afterward.

Vespers is beautiful. I recommend that you experience Vespers and the Divine Liturgy (and Orthros/Matins if they have it). In fact–all the services are otherworldly.

In the Orthodox Church the liturgical day begins in the evening with the setting of the sun. This practice follows the Biblical account of creation: “And there was evening and there was morning, one day” (Gen 1:5).

The Vesper service in the Church always begins with the chanting of the evening psalm: “…the sun knows it’s time for setting, Thou makest darkness and it is night…” (Psalm 104: 19-20) This psalm, which glorifies God’s creation of the world, is man’s very first act of worship, for man first of all meets God as Creator.
Bless the Lord, oh my soul, 0 Lord my God, Thou art very great …

O Lord, how manifold are Thy works! In wisdom hast Thou made them all. The earth is full of Thy creatures (Ps 104:24).Following the psalm, the Great Litany, the opening petition of all liturgical services of the Church is intoned. In it we pray to the Lord for everyone and everything.

Following this litany a number of psalms are chanted, a different group each evening. These psalms normally are omitted in parish churches though they are done in monasteries. On the eve of Sunday, however, sections of the first psalm and the other psalms which are chanted to begin the week are usually sung even in parish churches.

Psalm 141 is always sung at Vespers. During this psalm the evening incense is offered:
Lord, I call upon Thee, hear me. Hear me, O Lord.
Let my prayer arise in Thy sight as incense.
And let the lifting up of my hands be an evening sacrifice. Hear me, O Lord.
(Psalm 141:1-2).At this point special hymns are sung for the particular day. If it be a Church feast: songs in honor of the celebration are sung. On Saturday evenings, the eve of the Lord’s Day, these hymns always praise Christ’s resurrection from the dead.

The special hymns normally end with a song called a Theotokion which honors Mary, the Mother of Christ. Following this, the vesperal hymn is sung. If it be a special feast or the eve of Sunday, the celebrant will come to the center or the church building with lighted candles and incense. This hymn belongs to every Vesper service.
O Gladsome Light of the holy glory of the Immortal Father, heavenly, holy, blessed Jesus Christ. Now we have come to the setting of the sun and behold the light of evening. We praise God: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. For it is right at all times to worship Thee with voices of praise, O Son of God and Giver of Life, therefore all the world glorifies Thee. Christ is praised as the Light which illumines man’s darkness, the Light of the world and of the Kingdom of God which shall have no evening (Isa 60:20, Rev 21:25).

A verse from the Psalms, the prokeimenon, follows – a different one for each day, announcing the day’s spiritual theme. If it be a special day, three readings from the Old Testament are included. Then more evening prayers and petitions follow with additional hymns for the particular day, all of which end with the chanting of the Song of St Simeon:
Lord, now lettest Thou Thy servant depart in peace according to Thy word, for mine eyes have seen Thy salvation: which Thou hast prepared before the face of all people. A light for revelation to the Gentiles, and to be the glory of Thy people Israel (Lk 1:29-32).After proclaiming our own vision of Christ, the Light and Salvation of the world, we say the prayers of the Thrice-Holy (trisagion) through to the Our Father. We sing the main theme song of the day, called the Troparion, and we are dismissed with the usual benediction.

The service of Vespers takes us through creation, sin, and salvation in Christ. It leads us to the meditation of God’s word and the glorification of his love for men. It instructs us and allows us to praise God for the particular events or persons whose memory is celebrated and made present to us in the Church. It prepares us for the sleep of the night and the dawn of the new day to come. On the eves of the Divine Liturgy, it begins our movement into the most perfect communion with God in the sacramental mysteries.
oca.org/OCchapter.asp?SID=2&ID=61

 

[JohnnyReb]

Thanks for the post and the link Mickey.

 

[tomarin]

It was a joke. Kasparov’s mother was Armenian, his father was Jewish. I guess that makes him an Orthodox Jew.

…thank you, folks…don’t forget to tip your waitress…

Okay, I get it now.

If you’ll be doing more chess-themed standup, I’ll definitely be coming back to this cabaret.

 

[dzheremi]

Hahaha…well, no, unfortunately (?), I wasn’t planning on it…just trying out new material on the road to Damascus, you could say…

 

[JohnnyReb]

Where I live it’s pretty weird and divided. It’s kind of an ethnic thing that all the Mexicans pull for the Raiders and Lakers. Some pull for the Giants but many pull for the evil Dodgers! The white folks pull for the 49ers and most for the Lakers and a ton for the Giants. Then there are those teams in California that don’t do Jack Q. Squat. I will list them! LOL

1. The Clippers
2. The Warriors
3. The Sacramento Kings
4. The San Diego Chargers

The Lakers are our constantly winning team despite getting swept this year. When I was a kid I met Jerry West and Michael Cooper at a Lakers gig here in town. I got fizzled out on the Lakers when Kobe and Shaq came…puke.

The Raiders are a team of thugs and scum. Their stadium is violent, nasty, and looks like a scene from the Road Warrior or Thunderdome. “Two men enter…one man leaves!” At Dodgers Stadium they will fillet you or pummel you to death if you’re a Giants fan. They will dump sodas on Giants fans’ heads, throw their food at you, tons of beligerent drunks.

The Giants games are awesome, Sharks in San Diego, 49ers fans are clean cut, etc.

The Angels are a proud franchise but up and down. The Warriors…shoot they’re sad. I want to pull for 'em but dang that’s rough stuff!

I won’t drive into the city of Oakland on a dare! Oaktown has an insane murder rate per capita.

IMO Massuchasetts has the best sports stuff. Sox, Celtics, Patriots, good times in the last decade in that town!

I’m still mighty proud of my Giants. Last year was heaven on earth for me, heaven on earth. And we’re a respectable team this year. We’re losing tonight but we’re still top of NL West…

Virginia is diverse, very diverse because we have a lot of government workers and a large military presence, all who remain loyal to their teams when they come here. Go to most sporting apparel stores and you can get stuff from almost any team, pro or college. The DC/local teams by far do have the largest presence though.

I always wanted to go to the Black Hole in Oakland just to see what it is like to watch a football game with Darth Vader and his Stormtroopers. Oakland sounds like Richmond. Certain parts I would not go into day or night.

The Raiders stadium sounds like LSU Tiger Stadium. One football player said of being an opposing football player in Tiger Stadium “This is what it must have felt like to be a Christian in the Roman Colleseum…in here LSU are like the Romans and we are the Christians” One time I went to see Alabama play LSU in OUR stadium. We were right next to the visitors section with about 10,000 LSU fans present. It was a bad day. The game went to overtime and LSU won in OT. We got called all sorts of obsenties by their fans and had beer flung at us. In our stadium. Plus it ruin an undefeated season for us.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

Have you ever seen the Road Warrior, the 1981 movie with the wasteland, mohawked maniacs wearing football pads, hockey masks, feathers, tattoos, buffed, fighting over gasoline and beating each other to a pulp? That’s the Black Hole.

Wanting to go there makes me question, Brad, if the nursing program hasn’t affected your mind!

I always wanted to go to the Black Hole in Oakland just to see what it is like to watch a football game with Darth Vader and his Stormtroopers. Oakland sounds like Richmond. Certain parts I would not go into day or night.

 

[JohnnyReb]

Have you ever seen the Road Warrior, the 1981 movie with the wasteland, mohawked maniacs wearing football pads, hockey masks, feathers, tattoos, buffed, fighting over gasoline and beating each other to a pulp? That’s the Black Hole.

Wanting to go there makes me question, Brad, if the nursing program hasn’t affected your mind!

No I have not but I have seen broadcasts of Oakland games on TV. That sounds about right. I always have been a loose cannon, but school probably has doubled or tripled my abnormalities.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

A kid in my class went to a Raiders game a few years back; she and her parents wore Niners jerseys. They had their tired slashed, car keyed, harrassed, etc. I know some Raiders fans who are actually scared to go to the stadium and will only watch them on TV! buncha thugs

No I have not but I have seen broadcasts of Oakland games on TV. That sounds about right. I always have been a loose cannon, but school probably has doubled or tripled my abnormalities.

 

[dzheremi]

Sorry there, Gurn, I agree with your general premise (Oakland can get pretty dicey), but apparently 49ers fans are also animals…I am willing to bet that there’s more than a little alcohol involved in all of these types of incidents (probably the same with the Giants fan who was beaten at an LA Dodgers game recently), and that the type of person that would beat or intimidate someone over a professional sports game probably can’t keep it together through a game of Scrabble with their own family and friends, either (though that might also be because of trouble with all those fancy whatchamacallums…words). It’s sad. That type of behavior, combined with the fact that I can get my own giant pretzels and beer at 1/4 the stadium price, is the reason I haven’t been to a game in about 20 years.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

Beer at a Giants game is $9.00 for one bottle LOL! Good thing I’m not a beer-drinker. I only drink a few San Miguels when we go to the Philippines. That’s good beer. Bud for nine bucks? LOL

You’re right that all NFL games have rowdy loons. The Chargers have some real pips, too. But the Raiders are absolutely off-the-hook. They’re like something out of Blood Diamond

Sorry there, Gurn, I agree with your general premise (Oakland can get pretty dicey), but apparently 49ers fans are also animals…I am willing to bet that there’s more than a little alcohol involved in all of these types of incidents (probably the same with the Giants fan who was beaten at an LA Dodgers game recently), and that the type of person that would beat or intimidate someone over a professional sports game probably can’t keep it together through a game of Scrabble with their own family and friends, either (though that might also be because of trouble with all those fancy whatchamacallums…words). It’s sad. That type of behavior, combined with the fact that I can get my own giant pretzels and beer at 1/4 the stadium price, is the reason I haven’t been to a game in about 20 years.

 

[GaryTaylor]

Ya they’ve lost their minds. Thats what I was saying about Boston/Yankees.

I’ve seen the fans at Yankee Staduim take players right out of their game. Hey remember Jose Casanco? I was there watching the Yanks play Oakland and the entrie stadium eruped with “Madona is Good”. {he was fooling with madona at the time.}

He lost his mind ran up into the stands assaulted a fan and was arrested.

Same thing with Ricky Henderson, they harrassed the guy the entire night finally he drops two routine flys and flips out and runs up into the stands.

And today? Its turned really ugly. Now I’m even skeptical about going down to the Sox/Yanks

I don’t think it so bad at the outdoor Football stadiums in Cold Weather though. You know theres only so much Beer Chugging going on at below freezing temps. And thats really what gets them gassed up is the heat and the Beer.

 

[JesusforMadrid]

Vespers is beautiful. I recommend that you experience Vespers and the Divine Liturgy (and Orthros/Matins if they have it). In fact–all the services are otherworldly.

In the Orthodox Church the liturgical day begins in the evening with the setting of the sun. This practice follows the Biblical account of creation: “And there was evening and there was morning, one day” (Gen 1:5).

The Vesper service in the Church always begins with the chanting of the evening psalm: “…the sun knows it’s time for setting, Thou makest darkness and it is night…” (Psalm 104: 19-20) This psalm, which glorifies God’s creation of the world, is man’s very first act of worship, for man first of all meets God as Creator.
Bless the Lord, oh my soul, 0 Lord my God, Thou art very great …

O Lord, how manifold are Thy works! In wisdom hast Thou made them all. The earth is full of Thy creatures (Ps 104:24).Following the psalm, the Great Litany, the opening petition of all liturgical services of the Church is intoned. In it we pray to the Lord for everyone and everything.

Following this litany a number of psalms are chanted, a different group each evening. These psalms normally are omitted in parish churches though they are done in monasteries. On the eve of Sunday, however, sections of the first psalm and the other psalms which are chanted to begin the week are usually sung even in parish churches.

Psalm 141 is always sung at Vespers. During this psalm the evening incense is offered:
Lord, I call upon Thee, hear me. Hear me, O Lord.
Let my prayer arise in Thy sight as incense.
And let the lifting up of my hands be an evening sacrifice. Hear me, O Lord.
(Psalm 141:1-2).At this point special hymns are sung for the particular day. If it be a Church feast: songs in honor of the celebration are sung. On Saturday evenings, the eve of the Lord’s Day, these hymns always praise Christ’s resurrection from the dead.

The special hymns normally end with a song called a Theotokion which honors Mary, the Mother of Christ. Following this, the vesperal hymn is sung. If it be a special feast or the eve of Sunday, the celebrant will come to the center or the church building with lighted candles and incense. This hymn belongs to every Vesper service.
O Gladsome Light of the holy glory of the Immortal Father, heavenly, holy, 'blessed Jesus Christ. Now we have come to the setting of the sun and behold the light of evening. We praise God: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. For it is right at all times to worship Thee with voices of praise, O Son of God and Giver of Life, therefore all the world glorifies Thee. Christ is praised as the Light which illumines man’s darkness, the Light of the world and of the Kingdom of God which shall have no evening (Isa 60:20, Rev 21:25).

A verse from the Psalms, the prokeimenon, follows – a different one for each day, announcing the day’s spiritual theme. If it be a special day, three readings from the Old Testament are included. Then more evening prayers and petitions follow with additional hymns for the particular day, all of which end with the chanting of the Song of St Simeon:
Lord, now lettest Thou Thy servant depart in peace according to Thy word, for mine eyes have seen Thy salvation: which Thou hast prepared before the face of all people. A light for revelation to the Gentiles, and to be the glory of Thy people Israel (Lk 1:29-32).After proclaiming our own vision of Christ, the Light and Salvation of the world, we say the prayers of the Thrice-Holy (trisagion) through to the Our Father. We sing the main theme song of the day, called the Troparion, and we are dismissed with the usual benediction.

The service of Vespers takes us through creation, sin, and salvation in Christ. It leads us to the meditation of God’s word and the glorification of his love for men. It instructs us and allows us to praise God for the particular events or persons whose memory is celebrated and made present to us in the Church. It prepares us for the sleep of the night and the dawn of the new day to come. On the eves of the Divine Liturgy, it begins our movement into the most perfect communion with God in the sacramental mysteries.
oca.org/OCchapter.asp?SID=2&ID=61

Thank you. That was incredibly beautiful.

I was at Orthodox services this evening and the priest, now a good friend of mine, asked me when I would like to be chrismated.

“Soon”, I offered.

“It will be a good day”, he replied.

Amen.

 

[JohnnyReb]

Heading to Vespers in a few minutes. I will discuss when I return this evening after I watch Modern Family. The season finale is tonight.

 

[JohnnyReb]

Anyway, I went to Vespers tonight. Interesting experience. It was very beautiful, but foreign to me. They really sang the entire service for the most part. The people crossed themselves alot. I mean alot. (This may sound sacrilegous-but I thought to myself, "drinking game, everytime they cross themselves, take a shot-then I would have to be carried out) I made it about 30 minutes before taking a seat for a couple and was back up for the rest of the time.

The parishoners that were there and priest were very welcoming and stay after to answer my questions. I appreciated that.

 

[Bluegoat]

Anyway, I went to Vespers tonight. Interesting experience. It was very beautiful, but foreign to me. They really sang the entire service for the most part. The people crossed themselves alot. I mean alot. (This may sound sacrilegous-but I thought to myself, "drinking game, everytime they cross themselves, take a shot-then I would have to be carried out) I made it about 30 minutes before taking a seat for a couple and was back up for the rest of the time.

The parishoners that were there and priest were very welcoming and stay after to answer my questions. I appreciated that.

As an Anglican have you been to a sung Evensong?

 

[JohnnyReb]

As an Anglican have you been to a sung Evensong?

No I have not. Truthfully I have never heard of such. Please enlighten me.

 

[Bluegoat]

No I have not. Truthfully I have never heard of such. Please enlighten me.

It is a form of the Evening Prayer service. I’m not sure what prayer book your Anglican community uses, but in the older prayer books the Evening Prayer service is often sung chorally, when it is called Evensong.

Here is a link to the text.

This is from Wikepedia on the musical aspect:

I

n a fully choral service of evensong, all of the service except the penitential introduction, lessons, and some the final prayers are sung or chanted by the officiating cleric (or a lay cantor) and the choir. In cathedrals, or on particularly important days in the church calendar, the canticles (Magnificat and Nunc dimittis) are performed in more elaborate settings.

There are countless settings of the canticles, but a number of composers have contributed works which are performed regularly across the Anglican Communion. These range late Renaissance composers such as Thomas Tallis, William Byrd and Orlando Gibbons, to high Victorian geniuses such as Charles Villiers Stanford, Thomas Attwood Walmisley and to later masters of the form such as Herbert Murrill, Herbert Howells and Basil Harwood. Settings from outside the core tradition of Anglican church music have also become popular, with examples by Michael Tippett, Giles Swayne and Arvo Pärt. It is also widely regarded as acceptable to perform the canticles in Latin. The earliest settings of the Magnificat alternate between polyphony and plainchant, but later devices included alternating singing between the two “sides” of the choir (the singers standing on either side of the conductor, known as Decani and Cantoris), between soloists and the full ensemble, and between singers in various parts of the building. Typically the choir is either unaccompanied or accompanied by the organ, although it is not unusual for instrumental ensembles to be engaged for very important events.

You might be able to find examples on Youtube. I’d have a look for you but my computer is not letting me listen to audio. Parishes with good choirs tend to do it, we have it one Sunday evening a month, though we have said Evening Prayer five days a week.

Edit: Actually, if you look at the external links at the bottom of the Wiki link, there are some to BBC broadcasts of Evensong. It looks like a nice selection.

 

[Mickey]

Thank you. That was incredibly beautiful.

I was at Orthodox services this evening and the priest, now a good friend of mine, asked me when I would like to be chrismated.

“Soon”, I offered.

“It will be a good day”, he replied.

Amen.

Glory be to God!

 

[Mickey]

Anyway, I went to Vespers tonight. Interesting experience. It was very beautiful, but foreign to me. They really sang the entire service for the most part. The people crossed themselves alot. I mean alot. (This may sound sacrilegous-but I thought to myself, "drinking game, everytime they cross themselves, take a shot-then I would have to be carried out) I made it about 30 minutes before taking a seat for a couple and was back up for the rest of the time.

The parishoners that were there and priest were very welcoming and stay after to answer my questions. I appreciated that.

Yes. everything is chanted (for the most part). You will get used to standing as your legs strengthen. It is okay to sit if you feel the need–the idea being that we stand to pay respect for the King (Jesus Christ). Yes–we cross ourselves often–some people more than others. We cross ourselves whenever we hear the mention of the Holy Trinity–and other times if we feel moved to do so. The act of “Placing the cross on oneself” is a request for a blessing from God.