Eastern vs Western priest formation

[Casilda]

Are they educated differently? I have all my hopes and prayers on this meeting tomorrow with an EC priest. I will only have one RC priest to compare, because only one has ever kept his appointment with me, the others I couldn’t even make an appointment with and the one I met in a confessional that refused my confession I will not even count.

I hope they are educated differently. I pray he is in tuned to the spiritual needs of his flock. If not I will truly be lost, my only shepherd will be Jesus and I will give up looking for a church home.

 

[Basilian]

Are they educated differently? I have all my hopes and prayers on this meeting tomorrow with an EC priest. I will only have one RC priest to compare, because only one has ever kept his appointment with me, the others I couldn’t even make an appointment with and the one I met in a confessional that refused my confession I will not even count.

I hope they are educated differently. I pray he is in tuned to the spiritual needs of his flock. If not I will truly be lost, my only shepherd will be Jesus and I will give up looking for a church home.

Casilda, in the 1960s & 1970s, many Western seminaries went downhill in terms of practice and fidelity to the Gospel. Eastern seminaries tend to be strongly linked to a strong orthodox Christian identity. Priests and seminarians in those rites often come from highly-persecuted cultures, such as Ukrainian (under USSR) or Egyptian (under Islam). They are, thus, much more likely to have a strong identity and love for Christ in comparison with those raised in the West, where life is easy and free.

This is my own highly prejudiced opinion. I’ve met many, many good Western priests. They’re just not usually as well-formed, spiritually in their own rite as Eastern priests are in their respective rite. It helps the Easterners that they are only 1, 3, or 4 million strong at most, and can focus on their tradition very sincerely, as opposed to having 900 million widely-diverse Roman-rite Catholics.

 

[MichaelinMD]

Are they educated differently? I have all my hopes and prayers on this meeting tomorrow with an EC priest. I will only have one RC priest to compare, because only one has ever kept his appointment with me, the others I couldn’t even make an appointment with and the one I met in a confessional that refused my confession I will not even count.

I hope they are educated differently. I pray he is in tuned to the spiritual needs of his flock. If not I will truly be lost, my only shepherd will be Jesus and I will give up looking for a church home.

I can’t really answer your question about the differences in priestly formation/education between West and East. Sorry 'bout that!

But I have a question or two of my own that your post prompted. First of all, how can a priest “refuse” your confession, unless you are not Catholic or unless you are unwilling to repent of the sins you have confessed?

Secondly, why will you be “truly lost” if this EC priest doesn’t somehow live up to your hopes or expectations of him?

Just for a little perspective, not all RC priests are as inconsiderate or uncaring as your post might lead one to believe. Many are absolutely wonderful! And, not every EC priest is a paragon of virtue or an exemplar of what a priest “should” be. There are good and bad priests (and bishops!) both in the East and in the West.

From Psalm 146:

Praise ye the LORD. Praise the LORD, O my soul.

2 While I live will I praise the LORD: I will sing praises unto my God while I have any being.

3Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help.

4 His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; in that very day his thoughts perish.

5 Happy is he that hath the God of Jacob for his help, whose hope is in the LORD his God:

 

[Basilian]

Michael in MD raises a good question too, Casilda. Why would you be “lost” if two or three fallible, ordinary men cannot meet with you, or if the meetings do not go well? The Lord is good, the Lord founded a Church, and the Lord has kept His Church alive in love. He would not just abandon His own Bride. If He Himself forbids us to divorce, why would He commit divorce with holy spouse He has gained for His Father?

I do not want to be too harsh, but please do not put God to the test. By giving up so easily when things are not obvious, you are telling God He isn’t doing enough to save you. Please be patient, pray, and wait for Him to reveal the truth to you. You have us to talk to, and to pray for you, if you need any help!

 

[malphono]

What I will say for the moment is that what is described in the OP seems to me to have nothing to do with priestly “formation” or even education. It has to do with simple good manners and upbringing. One unfortunate thing is that I personally know a fairly sizable number of OC & EC priests (not necessarily Western-born, either) who lack both of the latter. IOW, it’s not something unique to the Latin Church nor is it unique to Western culture.

 

[Xantippe]

Casilda said:

“I will only have one RC priest to compare, because only one has ever kept his appointment with me, the others I couldn’t even make an appointment with and the one I met in a confessional that refused my confession I will not even count.”

I don’t know the theology of confession, but it occurs to me that if you are in an invalid marriage and have no intention of abstaining from relations with your husband, that the priest might feel unable to hear your confessions or give you absolution. In that case, the priest knows that you have do not intend “to do penance, to sin no more and to avoid whatever leads [you] to sin.” It’s no good confessing while fully intending to continue in the very same sins. It’s too bad the priest didn’t explain that to you adequately.

I suspect that Eastern priests would be operating under very similar strictures.

I hope you are able to clear this all up soon.

 

[Casilda]

Casilda said:

“I will only have one RC priest to compare, because only one has ever kept his appointment with me, the others I couldn’t even make an appointment with and the one I met in a confessional that refused my confession I will not even count.”

I don’t know the theology of confession, but it occurs to me that if you are in an invalid marriage and have no intention of abstaining from relations with your husband, that the priest might feel unable to hear your confessions or give you absolution. In that case, the priest knows that you have do not intend “to do penance, to sin no more and to avoid whatever leads [you] to sin.” It’s no good confessing while fully intending to continue in the very same sins. It’s too bad the priest didn’t explain that to you adequately.

I suspect that Eastern priests would be operating under very similar strictures.

I hope you are able to clear this all up soon.

I did bring that up, that I was willing to separate from my husband, just to be able to be absolved and deal with the convalidation later and my husband’s rcia in the fall. The priest did not want to talk about this at that time. The hour for confession, no one else showed up. I did not take up anyone else’s confession time. I was the only sheep there. I sat alone in the back of the church, looking up at Christ on the cross and talking to Mary.

 

[Xantippe]

I would put it down to a misunderstanding, then.

Or, alternately, deafness, senility or language issues. Or a really absorbing game of Angry Birds.

I’ve never had that sort of series of misadventures trying to get an appointment with a priest–I have to say that your experience is very unusual.

Good luck!

 

[Casilda]

Michael in MD raises a good question too, Casilda. Why would you be “lost” if two or three fallible, ordinary men cannot meet with you, or if the meetings do not go well? The Lord is good, the Lord founded a Church, and the Lord has kept His Church alive in love. He would not just abandon His own Bride. If He Himself forbids us to divorce, why would He commit divorce with holy spouse He has gained for His Father?

I do not want to be too harsh, but please do not put God to the test. By giving up so easily when things are not obvious, you are telling God He isn’t doing enough to save you. Please be patient, pray, and wait for Him to reveal the truth to you. You have us to talk to, and to pray for you, if you need any help!

My parents left the church when I was little, I have tried to get back before when a teenager, I was ignored. I ended up where I was not ignored, a Baptist church. I had the Bible, the Holy Spirit teaching me, and Jesus. Now that my husband wants to be Catholic, well, it just seems harder and harder. I have been on this journey for 35yrs, I dont give up easily. I just can no longer take the spiritual emptiness. I do not get fed, I am dying spiritually. I pray, I give alms, I give of my time, I volunteer, I fellowship, but it is an empty shell that does all that. I want to be fed. I did not leave the church. I never gave up believing in God. Is there a church?

There are a lot of people with millstones on their necks.

http://cashie.s3.amazonaws.com/catalog/5687fcdc015a7a23351f86e4e6919a87/images/cst02.jpg

 

[MichaelinMD]

My parents left the church when I was little, I have tried to get back before when a teenager, I was ignored. I ended up where I was not ignored, a Baptist church. I had the Bible, the Holy Spirit teaching me, and Jesus. Now that my husband wants to be Catholic, well, it just seems harder and harder. I have been on this journey for 35yrs, I dont give up easily. I just can no longer take the spiritual emptiness. I do not get fed, I am dying spiritually. I pray, I give alms, I give of my time, I volunteer, I fellowship, but it is an empty shell that does all that. I want to be fed. I did not leave the church. I never gave up believing in God. Is there a church?

There are a lot of people with millstones on their necks.

http://cashie.s3.amazonaws.com/catalog/5687fcdc015a7a23351f86e4e6919a87/images/cst02.jpg

Dearest Casilda,

Unless I’ve missed it (entirely possible!), it still isn’t clear to me exactly WHY the priest refused to hear your confession. I seriously doubt it’s simply because he is a bad priest, though that too is possible.

You say you “did not leave the church”. I take it you mean the Catholic Church, right? Please forgive my denseness, but I’m just trying to get clear about your situation. Without such clarity it is nearly impossible to discuss it with you with any kind of rationality .

What do you mean that you are “dying spiritually”?

What do you mean when you say you are “not being fed”? What is the food you are being somehow deprived of?

What do you mean by “There are a lot of people with millstones on their necks.”?

God never promised us that being Catholic would be easy. Carrying our crosses is indeed very hard work!

In Christ,
MinM

 

[Casilda]

Dearest Casilda,

Unless I’ve missed it (entirely possible!), it still isn’t clear to me exactly WHY the priest refused to hear your confession. I seriously doubt it’s simply because he is a bad priest, though that too is possible.

I do not know either, he seemed rushed, and I don’t know why, there was only one other person in the church and she was putting out bulletins? Lighting candles? The prayer service, not even a mass was 45 min away.

You say you “did not leave the church”. I take it you mean the Catholic Church, right? Please forgive my denseness, but I’m just trying to get clear about your situation. Without such clarity it is nearly impossible to discuss it with you with any kind of rationality .

yes, I was baptized Catholic and received my first holy communion, which an EO priest told me was the last time I have ever had communion even though I received it in the protestant churches I have been to as if it was

What do you mean that you are “dying spiritually”?

I can not receive communion, I can not even have my confession heard.

What do you mean when you say you are “not being fed”? What is the food you are being somehow deprived of?

almost daily on Catholic radio or at mass during the homily I am reminded that we need this spiritual nourishment. I know. If only the priests weren’t too busy, I could be communing this Easter.

What do you mean by “There are a lot of people with millstones on their necks.”?

my parents tore us away from the church. I remember begging them to let us go with our cousins. I am being kept away. I go to mass and leave emptier than when I went in, it is so hard to see others go up for communion and not be able to. I was told I had to be confirmed to go back to being Catholic, that is not true. I was told to go to confession, that was a dead end, there are forms and affidavits to have notarized. My protestant friends are not going to go into a Catholic church for that. So that leaves me outside forever unless I leave my husband and find a priest who will hear my confession. But where will that leave my husband? I am to the point that I no longer care what happens to him, he was anti-Catholic, now wants to be Catholic but is traumatized by all this red tape and serious lack of priests and pastoral care.

God never promised us that being Catholic would be easy. Carrying our crosses is indeed very hard work!

yes, this has been a heavy cross for me, been carrying it for too long. I was reading St.Faustinas diary and stopped at The Trial of Trials-complete abandonment --despair, and have not been able to read any further, afraid of something worse befalling me. I can not imagine anything worse with nothing to sustain me, horrified that it is that there is no church and I have to wander the rest of my days with only the Holy Spirit, my Bible and praying to the saints. So that is what I mean this is my last attempt, meeting with an EC priest.I pray he listens and can help me. I no longer feel I have the strength or even desire to continue seeking someone to help me get back into the church. I give up on the church, but not on God. He has sustained me up to now with substitute Eucharists, I will go to my desert if that is my trial of trials.
In Christ,
MinM

 

[MichaelinMD]

Dearest Casilda,

Did you actually ASK the priest why he wouldn’t hear your confession? If so, what did he say? If not, why didn’t you?

“Communion” in Protestant churches is NOT the Body and Blood of Christ. So…the Orthodox priest you spoke with may have been correct if you’ve never communed in a Catholic church since your First Holy Communion.

There are many, many priests. If there is some impediment to one hearing your confession the impediment would likely apply to all of them. You need, I think, to be ***crystal clear ***about the reason your confession hasn’t been heard. Vague answers won’t really suffice, I’m sorry to say. Forgive me for being blunt.

If one priest is supposedly “too busy” to hear your confession, find another one who will, assuming, of course, they are able to do so canonically. I’ve never, ever heard of a priest being “too busy” to hear someone’s confession.

Sounds to me like it would be highly advisable for you to make an appointment with a priest (I guess you’ve already done that with an EC priest??), have a good long talk with him about what’s going on with you, and then, if you are willing to repent of your sins (you know, those places where you’ve broken your relationship with Christ), if there are no canonical impediments to him hearing your confession, then ask him to do so.

You wrote: “yes, this has been a heavy cross for me, been carrying it for too long.” So, tell me…how long is too long? Who are we to determine how long we shall carry our crosses? What about, say, someone born with cerebral palsy? Now, how’s that for a cross?? How long are they to carry it for? Christ bore His Cross (physically speaking, on this earth, anyway) for a relatively short time. Then ***He climbed up on it and died for you, for me, for all of humanity! He did this for us!! ***

There is no “substitute Eucharist”. The Eucharist is Christ’s Body and Blood. Nothing else.

Again, please forgive my bluntness.

In Christ,
MinM

 

[Casilda]

I have known Jesus all my life, I have been drawn back to the Catholic church by the Blessed Virgin, His mother and now on St. Joseph’s feast day I receive my first glimmer of hope since I was a child. Thank you, JMJ. The Holy Family has answered my prayers and finally led me to a priest who listens with his head AND heart. Enough said.

Thanking everyone here for their intercession.

 

[MichaelinMD]

I have known Jesus all my life, I have been drawn back to the Catholic church by the Blessed Virgin, His mother and now on St. Joseph’s feast day I receive my first glimmer of hope since I was a child. Thank you, JMJ. The Holy Family has answered my prayers and finally led me to a priest who listens with his head AND heart. Enough said.

Thanking everyone here for their intercession.

Glad to hear it!!! I was pretty sure you’d find one–there really are quite a few of them out there. .