Easy-osey catholics and their status?

[zaida]

Hi everyone - As Ive been exploring this Faith, Ive been talking to Catholic friends and acquaintances. My question is this: it seems there is a hard core minority who really attempt to follow the Church teachings, and live as the Church intends. Then it seems there are many (mostly having been raised catholic) who still identify as Catholic but dont feel the need to be 100 percent…for example

1)a few friends who go to mass every so often but certainly not every week
2) a friend who doesnt go to confession because he doesnt believe in it but does take the eucharist…
3)a friend who lives with his male partner (been a couple for 10 years) and goes to mass every week
4)more than one a catholic friend (many actually) who had pre marital sex…

How does the Church see this kind of practice? It does seem to me to be life long catholics, not converts, who have the easy-osey approach…

 

[FAB]

Hi everyone - As Ive been exploring this Faith, Ive been talking to Catholic friends and acquaintances. My question is this: it seems there is a hard core minority who really attempt to follow the Church teachings, and live as the Church intends. Then it seems there are many (mostly having been raised catholic) who still identify as Catholic but dont feel the need to be 100 percent…for example

1)a few friends who go to mass every so often but certainly not every week
2) a friend who doesnt go to confession because he doesnt believe in it but does take the eucharist…
3)a friend who lives with his male partner (been a couple for 10 years) and goes to mass every week
4)more than one a catholic friend (many actually) who had pre marital sex…

How does the Church see this kind of practice? It does seem to me to be life long catholics, not converts, who have the easy-osey approach…

It is not possible to have everyone follow all of the rules of the Church or God 100% of the time. Not even when there were only two Adam and Eve. It is true for every demonination and evry part of culture.
It is true as you indicated that there are people who are committing sins and engaging in practices against Church’s teaches. The Church also instructs that each Catholic is to have a fully developmed conscience base on prayer and church teaching. The people you are speaking of have a faulty conscience. They are in error, not the Church.
We continue to pray for them so that will see the error of thier ways, a good Catholic will also work to gently lead them to the truth of which they lack.
Perhaps in your conversion, you can be that Catholic.
Peace,
Dcn. Frank

 

[couponfit]

Hi everyone - As Ive been exploring this Faith, Ive been talking to Catholic friends and acquaintances. My question is this: it seems there is a hard core minority who really attempt to follow the Church teachings, and live as the Church intends. Then it seems there are many (mostly having been raised catholic) who still identify as Catholic but dont feel the need to be 100 percent…for example

1)a few friends who go to mass every so often but certainly not every week
2) a friend who doesnt go to confession because he doesnt believe in it but does take the eucharist…
3)a friend who lives with his male partner (been a couple for 10 years) and goes to mass every week
4)more than one a catholic friend (many actually) who had pre marital sex…

How does the Church see this kind of practice? It does seem to me to be life long catholics, not converts, who have the easy-osey approach…

During mass we admit we are sinners, several times. There’s even a part where we strike our breasts. In essence, church is for the sinners if you think about it.

As for spirituality and expression, yes, each from his own cup rejoices, and to each persons cup the grace of God is poured. You cannot understand what you deny yourself, and each person must explore their spirituality and God’s message on their own terms, and with their own will.

Church is there for our spiritual growth, to help lay foundation, and provide discernment to the faithful.

 

[Sirach2]

How does the Church see this kind of practice?

The same way your church would see it, don’t you think? Sin is sin, no matter the name of the religion one professes to belong to. The standard is God’s commandments, and whether someone is Catholic, Episcopalian, Jewish, etc., there will be found within that denomination a number of people who disregard them.

We always hope and pray that the person will repent, and we know God’s mercy will forgive. There will be much rejoicing over one such soul, than over the 99 who have no need of repentence.

 

[zab]

Hi everyone - As Ive been exploring this Faith, Ive been talking to Catholic friends and acquaintances. My question is this: it seems there is a hard core minority who really attempt to follow the Church teachings, and live as the Church intends. Then it seems there are many (mostly having been raised catholic) who still identify as Catholic but dont feel the need to be 100 percent…for example

1)a few friends who go to mass every so often but certainly not every week
2) a friend who doesnt go to confession because he doesnt believe in it but does take the eucharist…
3)a friend who lives with his male partner (been a couple for 10 years) and goes to mass every week
4)more than one a catholic friend (many actually) who had pre marital sex…

How does the Church see this kind of practice? It does seem to me to be life long catholics, not converts, who have the easy-osey approach…

Jesus came to call sinners, not the self-righteous. Regarding your examples, it is as FAB posted:
*“They are in error, not the Church.
We continue to pray for them so that will see the error of thier ways, a good Catholic will also work to gently lead them to the truth of which they lack.”
*
I will say also that there are life long Catholics who do follow the teachings of the Church.

 

[Splagchnizomai]

We all need to repent through praying, fasting and almsgiving by the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Perhaps you can make a point to find other Catholics who strive a little bit harder to live out their faith?

 

[zaida]

Hi everyone - I didnt mean for my post to sound judgmental, sorry if it did! …I do know people who were born and raised Catholic and are strongly living out their faith…and certainly, I dont blame the Church for anyones failings, we are all responsible for ourselves…I just seem to have a lot of friends (haven grown up in new york city, with all my friends either catholic or jewish), who kind of admit they take and leave Church teaching at will…

I think I was just wondering - would the Church rather have people stay in the Church - identify themselvs as Catholics - while also making the choice not to believe or follow to the best of their abilitities? Or would the Church rather people say “hands up, I dont believe/behave/follwow, etc, I do my own thing, so I should probably leave the Church”…would the Church rather that as an honest declaration of someones intentions…

I suppose the former…the Church would rather people stay to their Catholic faith as far as they are able at that time, and work to improve the practice…

 

[Sirach2]

To repeat myself, what would your Episcopal Church say to them? Leave? Stay?

The Body of Christ gathered at mass, where they hear the scripture readings and a homily, besides participating in the liturgy, is the best place for God to touch a heart. We just never know when one of those readings will speak to their conscience, or when God will pour out the grace of repentence. What if they had never come?

I received my own conversion precisely in Church – very unexpectedly. I did not want to be there, but came because a neighbor was insistent that I needed to bring my children, even if I did not want it for myself. It was in the liturgy that I received the most powerful grace ever, and I have never turned back - not once!

 

[1ke]

Hi everyone - I didnt mean for my post to sound judgmental, sorry if it did! …I do know people who were born and raised Catholic and are strongly living out their faith…and certainly, I dont blame the Church for anyones failings, we are all responsible for ourselves…I just seem to have a lot of friends (haven grown up in new york city, with all my friends either catholic or jewish), who kind of admit they take and leave Church teaching at will…

I think I was just wondering - would the Church rather have people stay in the Church - identify themselvs as Catholics - while also making the choice not to believe or follow to the best of their abilitities? Or would the Church rather people say “hands up, I dont believe/behave/follwow, etc, I do my own thing, so I should probably leave the Church”…would the Church rather that as an honest declaration of someones intentions…

I suppose the former…the Church would rather people stay to their Catholic faith as far as they are able at that time, and work to improve the practice…

Catholics are always Catholic by virtue of their baptism (or if a baptized convert by profession of faith). There is no “leaving the Church”. A Catholic who stops practicing the faith is still a Catholic.

What the Church wants is for all people to come to the salvation that Jesus offers. The Churh professes and teaches the Truth, offers the sacraments and grace, and is there for people until their dieing breath. The Church wants them to be Saints.

If people choose sin, then the Church will always be there calling them back. If they remain obstinent and unrepentent, then they will have to face judgment with that on their souls.

 

[zab]

Hi everyone - I didnt mean for my post to sound judgmental, sorry if it did! …I do know people who were born and raised Catholic and are strongly living out their faith…and certainly, I dont blame the Church for anyones failings, we are all responsible for ourselves…I just seem to have a lot of friends (haven grown up in new york city, with all my friends either catholic or jewish), who kind of admit they take and leave Church teaching at will…

I think I was just wondering - would the Church rather have people stay in the Church - identify themselvs as Catholics - while also making the choice not to believe or follow to the best of their abilitities? Or would the Church rather people say “hands up, I dont believe/behave/follwow, etc, I do my own thing, so I should probably leave the Church”…would the Church rather that as an honest declaration of someones intentions…

I suppose the former…the Church would rather people stay to their Catholic faith as far as they are able at that time, and work to improve the practice…

That is kind of like asking a mother of some delinquent young adults if would she rather have them living in her house while also making the choice not to believe or follow the house rules to the best of their ability even to abuse drinking, smoking and using drugs maybe possessing pornography and watching R-rated movies in her house, or would she rather they leave her home than to disregard these most serious rules especially when they are showing bad example to others in the home or even relatives and even neighbors and friends. But whether they stay or leave, or whether she puts them out for serious violations, they will always be her children.
The Church is our mother. She loves us and cares for us. It is usually our decision to stay or leave but the door is always open. However, there are times, when it is necessary for the Church to speak out against the behaviour and/or words of certain public figures who disregard, or misrepresent church teaching.

 

[zaida]

Sirach2 - You asked me twice what the episcopalian church would do - I imagine just whate you said, keep coming and hope that peoples are hearts are moved…

The reason I was asking particulalry about RC, is just that I dont know any episcopalians who still call themselves episcopalians after they have decided they dont really believe it, or dont want to follow it, or want their own rules…Its like they just up and left! They might say “I was raised episcopalian but no longer follow it”…But my friends who were raised RC, even when they decide they dont believe certain things, will still say “Im RC” maybe its that “once RC always RC” as a good friend told me…

Also, because the episcopalian church is SO all over the place (with issues such as sexuality) it doesnt seem to come up as often, if one is disreagrding a teaching that one piscy priest takes seriously, one leaves and finds a church where the priest doesnt take it seriously! For Catholics, the teaching is the teaching, so its different. (and I admire that)

I hope that explains my questions

 

[Hokomai]

First of all, that you for introducing me to a new word: easy-osey. A moment’s research and I find it is of Scots origin, and means ‘casual’. I have noted on CAF that traditional Catholics seem to have difficultly accepting that the people they disparage in this way, or as ‘cafeteria Catholics’ may be honest believers in their mix of traditional and non-traditional views. Posters seem to think that they are either willfully or foolishly ignorant. In my experience, such people have usually just decided that some of the church teachings should not be followed because they consider them plainly wrong, or so absurdly complex in their presentation that it is impossible to take them seriously. Of course, I’m an extreme case: a Cafeteria Catholic who only has a coffee and chat!:coffeeread:

 

[zaida]

hey hokomai - I am an american living in scotland, but even I didnt know that easy-osey was scots origin, lol!

 

[zab]

Sirach2 - You asked me twice what the episcopalian church would do - I imagine just whate you said, keep coming and hope that peoples are hearts are moved…

The reason I was asking particulalry about RC, is just that I dont know any episcopalians who still call themselves episcopalians after they have decided they dont really believe it, or dont want to follow it, or want their own rules…Its like they just up and left! They might say “I was raised episcopalian but no longer follow it”…But my friends who were raised RC, even when they decide they dont believe certain things, will still say “Im RC” maybe its that “once RC always RC” as a good friend told me…

Also, because the episcopalian church is SO all over the place (with issues such as sexuality) it doesnt seem to come up as often, if one is disreagrding a teaching that one piscy priest takes seriously, one leaves and finds a church where the priest doesnt take it seriously! For Catholics, the teaching is the teaching, so its different. (and I admire that)

I hope that explains my questions

For many, they know who their Mother is even if they don’t follow or understand all of the teachings. For others, they have lost what little faith they had, probably because they were never properly instructed nor understood their faith to begin with. Thank you for your comments

 

[Sirach2]

Zaida:

The reason I was asking particulalry about RC, is just that I dont know any episcopalians who still call themselves episcopalians after they have decided they dont really believe it, or dont want to follow it, or want their own rules…Its like they just up and left!

I can agree with what you speak. They call themselves “christians.” If they leave the episcopal denomination to join the methodists, for example, it’s not a radical decision and their orientation is still “christian.”

For a baptized Catholic, once they have been baptized, there is an indelible mark supernaturally placed in their souls that will be to their honor or disgrace in eternal life. It never leaves. Similarly, the ancient jews imposed the sign of their consecration and covenant in their foreskins with circumcision. It is never effaced - the chosen people are forever God’s children by His election, even when they were unfaithful to their covenant promises. God will always call them to repentence and renewal of their communion with Him. The book of Hosea brings this out rather well, I believe.

If we are faithless, he remains faithful— for he cannot deny himself. 2 Tim. 2:13

Maybe other faiths do not have as deep a theology about baptism and its importance, IDK. I hope this is helpful to you.

 

[vz71]

4)more than one a catholic friend (many actually) who had pre marital sex…

How does the Church see this kind of practice? It does seem to me to be life long catholics, not converts, who have the easy-osey approach…

It is never a wise idea to dwell upon a past sin of someone else.
They may have reconciled with God long ago.

What goes on in the confessional is private, and while we may know of the sin of another we may not know if it has been resolved or not.