EC / EO in AA?

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Miserissima

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Based on this thread: forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=10363409&postcount=36 and a few more around, how does an Eastern receive the Precious Blood? (…and no, I don’t mean “with a spoon!” 😉 )

Obviously, there are cultural attitudes toward alcohol that may come in to play, as well as each recovering alcoholic having a different “relationship” with alcohol.

I can see in other rites receiving under one species only, but that isn’t possible in Divine Liturgy. So, how does a recovering alcoholic reconcile teetotaling with reception?
 
Miserissima said:
Based on this thread: forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=10363409&postcount=36 and a few more around, how does an Eastern receive the Precious Blood? (…and no, I don’t mean “with a spoon!” 😉 )

Obviously, there are cultural attitudes toward alcohol that may come in to play, as well as each recovering alcoholic having a different “relationship” with alcohol.

I can see in other rites receiving under one species only, but that isn’t possible in Divine Liturgy. So, how does a recovering alcoholic reconcile teetotaling with reception?
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This should be discussed on an individual basis with one’s priest. Allowances can be made. You know, oikonomia…👍 I know recovering addicts/alcoholics who do receive the Precious Blood with no problem whatsoever.
 
I know at least one Orthodox teetotaler who went through AA. He receives like everyone else without any ill effect.

Can’t speak for others though. Probably something they should discuss with their priest if it is an issue.
 
During the blessing of the Eucharistic meal(When “Lamb of God” is sung)
the priest takes a piece of the host and drops it in the Chalice. So one
DOESN’T need to partake of the “blood of Christ” since there is a mixing
of the host with the wine.
 
GLam8833 said:
During the blessing of the Eucharistic meal(When “Lamb of God” is sung)
the priest takes a piece of the host and drops it in the Chalice. So one
DOESN’T need to partake of the “blood of Christ” since there is a mixing
of the host with the wine.
Click to expand...
This is true in the Roman (Latin) Rite, but not in the Eastern practices, at least the Eastern Orthodox and Bzyantine Catholic churches, where the prosphora (bread) is divided up into many pieces during the proskomedia and later put into the chalice with the wine.

In Christ,
MinM
 
GLam8833 said:
During the blessing of the Eucharistic meal(When “Lamb of God” is sung)
the priest takes a piece of the host and drops it in the Chalice. So one
DOESN’T need to partake of the “blood of Christ” since there is a mixing
of the host with the wine.
Click to expand...
I’m talking about Divine Liturgy, not Mass.
 
GLam8833 said:
During the blessing of the Eucharistic meal(When “Lamb of God” is sung)
the priest takes a piece of the host and drops it in the Chalice. So one
DOESN’T need to partake of the “blood of Christ” since there is a mixing
of the host with the wine.
Click to expand...
First, it’s no longer wine.

Second, this is not the reason that the Eucharist is whole and entire under either species. Even if the priest forgets or neglects the commingling of the host in the chalice, the True Presence consists of the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Christ in both species.
 
Miserissima said:
:banghead:
😉
Click to expand...
:confused:

What are you banging your head for? The issue, I think, is not black and white, with a “one answer fits all”.

I can just repeat that this is an issue that needs to be dealt with on a case by case basis with the individual and his/her priest. If the priest isn’t sure what to do, then he should consult his bishop.

As an exercise of “oikonomia”, I believe it IS possible to receive, in the Eastern Churches, under one species. And, if I’m wrong about it, I look forward to someone more knowledgeable than I to correct me. 😉

In Christ,
MinM
 
I’m banging my head wondering why I can write about the Divine Liturgy in the Eastern Catholic forum (I said, " I can see in other rites receiving under one species only, but that isn’t possible in Divine Liturgy.") and get two responses regarding the Latin Rite.

The last time I posted a question here about hyperbolic language regarding the Theotokos, I also received non sequitur replies that implied I struggled with the Communion of Saints.

In both cases, I wonder where I am not being clear and am losing patience with myself.

I didn’t mean to direct my “head bang” at anyone in particular.

As far as what you said, that was clear, and thank you. But the next practical question would be how to reconcile sponsor’s direction with the direction of the priest?
 
Miserissima said:
I’m banging my head wondering why I can write about the Divine Liturgy in the Eastern Catholic forum (I said, " I can see in other rites receiving under one species only, but that isn’t possible in Divine Liturgy.") and get two responses regarding the Latin Rite.

The last time I posted a question here about hyperbolic language regarding the Theotokos, I also received non sequitur replies that implied I struggled with the Communion of Saints.

In both cases, I wonder where I am not being clear and am losing patience with myself.

I didn’t mean to direct my “head bang” at anyone in particular.

As far as what you said, that was clear, and thank you. But the next practical question would be how to reconcile sponsor’s direction with the direction of the priest?
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Unfortunately, there are some folks who either forget or just plain don’t notice that this sub-forum is the Eastern Catholicism forum 🤷. Or, some may think that what applies to Latin Catholics automatically and always applies to Eastern Catholics. This is unfortunate, but the best thing is to try to educate them. I’ve found head-banging to be a source of unnecessary pain :D.

RE: your last question, I would be inclined to say that if the priest is fully aware of the communicant’s situation, his direction should be followed. If doing so would obviously put the communicant in some kind of danger, then that would need to be brought to his attention and discussed further.

I fully appreciate the role of the sponsor in 12-step groups but they are not necessarily as qualified to offer spiritual direction as one’s priest. This is, after all, not solely a “practical” matter, but by definition I think, also if not primarily a spiritual one. Am I off-base in thinking that?

If there is a conflict between the sponsor and the priest, perhaps the two could be brought together to reconcile the issue for the benefit of the communicant??

In Christ,
MinM
 
Thank you, as always. 🙂 I’ll cease the banging. I’m not knocking anyone for jumping on the CAF bandwagon. Last week I followed some new posts and replied, not realizing the OP was made in 2004!

The person in conflict is a genuinely submissive person, who isn’t giving up reception but is getting a spectacular amount of grief from her sponsor to “get honest” with herself. The deacon explained to the sponsor that this is akin to “spiritual medicine” and it is up to the lady to determine if it will affect her sobriety. So far, because she looks at the Eucharist with a well formed conscience, she says it hasn’t tempted her to drink.

I just told her to get a new sponsor, preferably a Catholic, but that’s easier said than done. I told her about Calix but that hasn’t yielded much fruit. She is genuinely frustrated. All she has is AA and the Mission as support.
 
Pardon my endless ignorance, but what is “Calix”?

Your suggestion that she get a new, preferably Catholic, sponsor I think was a good one, and well worth the effort it may take. If she is receiving Holy Communion without affecting her sobriety then that is excellent! If anything, it is indeed the “spiritual medicine” the deacon called it, and is necessary for her on all levels of her being.

I appreciate the sponsor’s concerns, but if he/she isn’t familiar with what else is going on in her life, especially spiritually, and willing to take those things into account in the sponsorship, then they are not doing her any huge favors, imho.

Her job isn’t to placate the sponsor, but to do her best to become holy and sober–not just sober. But…that’s easy for me to say, as it’s not me we’re talkin’ 'bout 😃

In Christ,
MinM
 
Nine_Two said:
My understanding is that AA is overwhelmingly Protestant.
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I wouldn’t know about that. Even if she can’t find a Catholic sponsor, surely a sponsor even slightly more receptive to her struggles and her faith would be more appropriate than one with whom she struggles against now.
 
I searched online for “Calix”. Sounds like just what the doctor ordered!!!👍👍 God bless them!!

I see there’s a contact in Ellicott City, MD, which might be useful for the person we’re talking about.
 
Just a thought. In EC and EO churches the contents of the chalice are pretty much half and half.

First at the proskomedia the wine is mixed with water, and then right before Holy Communion it is diluted once more when hot water is added, generally a substantial amount. As a subdeacon serving I saw it with my own eyes.

How strong does the ‘wine’ have to be to affect alcoholics? :confused:
 
It depends on the individual. I’ve known someone with a history of alcoholism who could safely drink a glass of wine and be fine. On the other hand, I’ve heard of some who won’t dare take even a sip.
 
andrewstx said:
Just a thought. In EC and EO churches the contents of the chalice are pretty much half and half.

First at the proskomedia the wine is mixed with water, and then right before Holy Communion it is diluted once more when hot water is added, generally a substantial amount. As a subdeacon serving I saw it with my own eyes.

How strong does the ‘wine’ have to be to affect alcoholics? :confused:
Click to expand...
Depends on the alcoholic. 🙂

How much water is added, I think, depends on the priest, as I don’t think there’s a fixed amount that is precisely measured. I served as an altar server for about 4 years and have also seen this.

But, be that as it may, once the bread and wine become His Body and Blood…: and given the extremely tiny amount that can be put on the spoon by the priest…; most recovering alcoholics probably won’t have a problem with it, especially if they have a good sponsor and a good priest. That’s just my opinion–I’ve no studies or anything other than what I’ve seen and experienced upon which to base it.

In Christ,
MinM
 
Mustum can be used, in a separate chalice.

In general, however, the priest can do one of several things:
  1. commune them with the reserved body
  2. commune them under one species
  3. use Mustum rather than the usual wine.
Most AA members will, however, receive normally. I’m aware of a couple who have attended my home parish in the past.
 
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