Ecclesiastical Divorce and the Orthodox

[ConstantineTG]

Interesting! What I think I am hearing is that the EO interpret Jesus words as being a Hebrew hyperbole, similar to “call no man your father” rather than a straight up moral teaching. I’m not convinced, but it IS something to hand your hat on, at least. I appreciate the elaborations, thanks.

Speaking of hyperoble, there’s this:

My formal catholic education stopped in 8th grade. I’ve never EVER had a theology or philosophy class. The ignorance that is out there in today’s laity is a result of apathy and lack of faith, not any particularly grueling academic demands in understanding the doctrines. And yes, I do believe that when people are guilty of negligent ignorance, they suffer consequences for it. Do I agree that it’s 99%? No. But it’s a much larger number than it should be.

The only reason we’re handing out too many annulments is the fact that the Sacrament of Matrimony has suffered legalization and we let lawyers argue about it. It is not the lack of understanding of the married couple on what marriage is, it is the skill of the lawyer to undermine canon law and the Sacrament itself. And the Church has agreed to play along.

 

[Marc_Anthony]

Here is an absolutely perfect example of the problem with the Latin Church’s marriage theology:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=693980

So, the answer is yes, but no. Yes, a Priest can get married after he’s divorced, but only if he’s not actually divorced and the marriage was invalid to begin with.

I mean, there’s the problem with Latin marriage theology in a nutshell.

 

[ComeHome2Rome]

It’s more penitential in nature. Also I’ve read, although I do not know if it is done in practice, but the clergy CANNOT attend your wedding party/banquet on your second marriage.

Is this true if it is the 1st marriage for one of the wedding party & the 2nd marriage for the other? Or only if it is the 2nd marriage for both the bride & groom?

 

[5Loaves]

Here is an absolutely perfect example of the problem with the Latin Church’s marriage theology:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=693980

So, the answer is yes, but no. Yes, a Priest can get married after he’s divorced, but only if he’s not actually divorced and the marriage was invalid to begin with.

I mean, there’s the problem with Latin marriage theology in a nutshell.

Re: Is it possible for a divorced Catholic to become a priest? It is possible, however it is not probable…

Interesting. I’m aware of several local Latin priests who received a decree of nullity before entering seminary, and another who was a divorced Anglican priest and then became a Latin Catholic priest, after receiving a decree of nullity.

I doubt it’s taken lightly. These days the amount of vetting that goes on before a man can enter preparation for the priesthood in the Latin Church is very extensive.

 

[dvdjs]

The matter of ecclesiastical divorce is one that predates the schism, so for any who might claim that the Catholic church never had such a thing they are not correct.

And the filioque was widley used in the West prior to the schism.

Further, of all the horrible things and even silly claims Cardinal Humbert and Cardinal Frederic made against the Greek Catholics in 1054AD, this very real practice (sure ammunition for the attack) did not even come up as an issue.

The rhetoric may have been hyperbolic, particularly in poisoning current practices by association with older heretic groups, but the claims were not without foundation, however horrible they might have been. The only silly things are the common misrepresentations of what was written.

The fact that practices of divorces - and by then - the relatively recent innovation of remarriage in the church - is not mentioned? What do you wish - a fallacious argument from silence. How many divorces were there per year in Constantiople? In the Eastern Empire? Were there enough to be on the radar? Were there as many divorces as eunuchs?

Forgiving the contrite and helping them start over, plugged in to the church and her sacraments, can help turn this situation around, and more of these people could be at Mass or divine liturgy listening to much needed homilies and receiving spiritual strength in the sacraments. There must be a good reason for bishops to be able to bind and loose, and this is not a new (read: liberal) practice in the east, but very old and time tested.

I suspect that the liberalization - the high frequency - of divorce in the East parallels the liberalization of annulment in the West. The fact that ecclesiastical divorce is very old does not mean that it is time tested in its current liberal application anymore that the fact that annulments are very old rationalizes current practice in the West.

You may think that the best advice, the best teaching that a church can give is these difficult situations is: end the marriage, it’s OK. I don’t think so.

 

[ConstantineTG]

Here is an absolutely perfect example of the problem with the Latin Church’s marriage theology:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=693980

So, the answer is yes, but no. Yes, a Priest can get married after he’s divorced, but only if he’s not actually divorced and the marriage was invalid to begin with.

I mean, there’s the problem with Latin marriage theology in a nutshell.

Well, there are actually invalid marriages out there. The real problem is that many marriages that are valid are argued to be invalid by lawyers.

Is this true if it is the 1st marriage for one of the wedding party & the 2nd marriage for the other? Or only if it is the 2nd marriage for both the bride & groom?

I could be wrong, but it would still be penitential in nature because someone is getting a second marriage.

 

[Marc_Anthony]

Well, there are actually invalid marriages out there. The real problem is that many marriages that are valid are argued to be invalid by lawyers.

But notice the wording: “Sure, theoretically you could be a divorced Priest. You just have to not have been married in the first place.”

 

[ComeHome2Rome]

After reading this thread now I’d like to know the % of marriages in the Orthodox Church are done after one or more parties had an Eclesiastical Divorce & the % of marriages in the Catholic Church are done after one or more parties received an Annulment. Does anyone know?

Do the Eastern Catholics allow Eclesiastical Divorces or do they use Annulments?

Side Bar: Mark Anthony I noticed you switched from Orthodox to Catholic, were you received into the Catholic Church today? If so, that was fast & Congratulations!

 

[5Loaves]

But notice the wording: “Sure, theoretically you could be a divorced Priest. You just have to not have been married in the first place.”

The Catholic Church does not say you were not married in the first place when giving a decree of nullity. One cannot begin an application for a decree of nullity until a civil divorce has been granted so that the civil marriage has been dissolved. Proof of the civil divorce must be provided as part of the application.

The decree of nullity finds that one or more components necessary for a sacramental marriage did not exist at the time vows were exchanged on the day of the wedding.

 

[ConstantineTG]

Do the Eastern Catholics allow Eclesiastical Divorces or do they use Annulments?

Annulments. Some even share the same tribunal with the local RC diocese. Do you think Rome will let us have ecclesiastical divorce?

 

[Marc_Anthony]

The Catholic Church does not say you were not married in the first place when giving a decree of nullity. One cannot begin an application for a decree of nullity until a civil divorce has been granted so that the civil marriage has been dissolved. Proof of the civil divorce must be provided as part of the application.

The decree of nullity finds that one or more components necessary for a sacramental marriage did not exist at the time vows were exchanged on the day of the wedding.

Well, now I’m learning something new

I sincerely did not realize that. I mean, I knew a civil divorce was necessary, but I didn’t know it was only declaring a marriage non-sacramental.

I’ll have to file that one away to remember later, thanks.