Effects of the fall after redemption

[rasbat]

simple question please pardon my ignorance of such a basic point, but I have heard other Catholics talking about some weird possibly heretical ideas. Question:
are man and creation still in a fallen state even after the redeption achieved in Christ? I have always believed we are fallen creatures that is why we have evil and destruction and sickness and misery everywhere. We can turn to Christ and have our sins washed away and our nature corrected and cleansed, and seek eternal life, but we are still experiencing the effects of the fall in this life and the consequences of people exercising their free will giving in to corruption right? is it safe to refer to us as fallen creatures and creation still fallen even in the light of Christ’s redemption? This is how I have always seen it as a just punishment for all of historical time for our fall and Christ as a light in the darkness of this world.
here is the potential heresy: I hear so much talk lately about our nature being fixed and transformed here on earth, and people saying things along the lines that Jesus being fully human and fully God in and of itsself is where our redemption was achieved regardless of the cross just by touching and sanctifying human nature in this way. are these things I have been hearing heresy? They seem to state that the fall is completely undone even in its after effects and that we are all just intrinsicly good from birth now since the redemption. How do they explain the obvious presence of great evil in the world now?

Short version: what effects of the fall were undone by the redemption of Christ? which still remain? is there some wacky new heresy making the rounds these days?

 

[PRmerger]

simple question please pardon my ignorance of such a basic point, but I have heard other Catholics talking about some weird possibly heretical ideas. Question:
are man and creation still in a fallen state even after the redeption achieved in Christ? I have always believed we are fallen creatures that is why we have evil and destruction and sickness and misery everywhere. We can turn to Christ and have our sins washed away and our nature corrected and cleansed, and seek eternal life, but we are still experiencing the effects of the fall in this life and the consequences of people exercising their free will giving in to corruption right? is it safe to refer to us as fallen creatures and creation still fallen even in the light of Christ’s redemption? This is how I have always seen it as a just punishment for all of historical time for our fall and Christ as a light in the darkness of this world.

This is correct.

here is the potential heresy: I hear so much talk lately about our nature being fixed and transformed here on earth,

This is incorrect. Grace transforms us, but we are not “fixed” in our transformation.

and people saying things along the lines that Jesus being fully human and fully God in and of itsself is where our redemption was achieved regardless of the cross just by touching and sanctifying human nature in this way. are these things I have been hearing heresy?

This does not sound like Catholic teaching.

As far as it being heresy, well, I leave it to the Church to define whether it is or isn’t.

And AFAIK, it has not been declared a heresy.

Short version: what effects of the fall were undone by the redemption of Christ? which still remain? is there some wacky new heresy making the rounds these days?

What was undone was that the gates of heaven were opened due to the atoning death of Christ.

 

[Neofight]

Man was created innocent and pure; that was his nature at creation.

The fall changed that. Man’s nature was to, and forever more (as long as alive), changed to having a propensity to sin.

Yes, Christ has both human and divine nature, but it is important to note that because of his divinity, his human nature does not include our propensity to sin…his human nature is that of man’s at creation, that being without sin.

Church teaching tells us that Baptism cleanses us of sin, but because of our propensity to sin, that cleansing is usually relatively short lived, before we sin again. Then, we must confession those sins with a contrite heart and do penance to wipe the slate of sin clean again.

Likewise, the death of Christ cleansed all the world of their sins, but again, unfortunately because of this unalterable human nature, new sins were committed from the time of our Lord’s passion that need absolution (hence the gift of the Sacraments of Healing).

The good news is, we will not be human forever…we will shed these bodies and if we died in a state of grace, and upon the return of Christ , we will assume a more divine nature, free from sin, forever.

Peace and all good!

 

[fred_conty]

The after effects of sin is concupisness, which means a propensity for sin…it is easier for us to sin than to do good in a lot of ways. And…our intellect became clouded about right and wrong. Now it seems that the right seems wrong and the wrong seems right in many cases.

Now Christ is the light, that is, he is now showing us the way that is right, and giving strength to our weak impaired wills thru prayer and his sacraments and the Holy Spirit. And even tho it is difficult to do the right thing, he reinforces us to do it thru his grace to make up for the impediment of concupisness from which we still suffer. For the senses want to over indulge themselves. “The spirit is willing but the flesh is weak.” So Jesus’ prescription for this is to pray, of which there are many forms of this.

Now as a Christian cooperates with the grace of God and establishes his life more and more in that of oneness with Jesus, then the attraction of sin becomes less, and its hold on us is weakened. Our intellect at the same time sees more and more by his light and grows in the knowledge of right and wrong.

May God bless and keep you. May God’s face shine on you. May God be kind to you and give you peace.

 

[Vico]

… what effects of the fall were undone by the redemption of Christ? which still remain?..

Q. What effects of the fall were undone by the redemption of Christ?
A. Superabundant satisfaction for human guilt and the consequent debt of punishment occurred, which is available for any that will receive sanctifying grace.

Q. What effects of the fall still remain.
A. *We are born without santifying grace at birth. * Also, we still have death and suffering and we do not have the clear knowledge, quick perception, and retentive memory that Adam had before his fall from grace. There is concupiscence.