Electronic Votive Candles?

[tafan]

Question: Is it the glow of the candle that raises our prayers to heaven, the wisp of smoke and rising warmth or the fact the candle is in the church building that raises them? If it’s the glow I’ll simply say a prayer every time I turn on a light at home! Other than being a very old custom, what is the purpose of the votive candles?

Also, the fact that it is a very old custom in the Church, should be an indication there is a serious reason for it. Even if we don’t understand something, when we know it is a very old tradition, we should grant it our respect. Doing otherwise is an insult to our ancestors.

 

[agw123]

I am not buying the insurance excuse. I happen to know what our parish’s yearly insurance bill and how much we bring in from votive candles each year. If I was to guess, the votive candle take would be cut in half ( at least ) if they were fake. If my guess is correct about the reduction, the insurance bill would have to drop by a third to make up for the reduced revenue. We bring in quite a bit on votive candles and I actually think it would drop to almost nothing with fake ones, so the savings would have to be much greater still on the insurance.

Of course, insurance varies a lot state to state, but parishes who do it around here have to have other motives, as all parishes use the same insurance negotiated by the diocese.

But the FIRE CODE may be different from area to area. Here in NYC, unattended fire in a public accomodation is generally prohibited. If you can afford to have someone watch it 24x7, then you can have it, but most Churches cannot.

 

[tafan]

But the FIRE CODE may be different from area to area. Here in NYC, unattended fire in a public accomodation is generally prohibited. If you can afford to have someone watch it 24x7, then you can have it, but most Churches cannot.

Yes, I could believe this might happen in some areas,

 

[RonThePilgrim]

While one can not beat the authenticity of lighting a real votive prayer candle, there are many practical reasons for replacing them with electric candles – fire risk, insurance costs, labor cost of maintaining the real candles and quite frankly the cost of the real candles have “gone through the roof.” In the past, a person could put a $1 or $2 (depending on the size) and it would cover the cost of the candle and the parish would generate a little extra revenue. With the rising cost of real candles, it would be almost impossible for the parish to break even.
For those who say that electric votive are “tacky” or inappropriate, consider that for many centuries the organ was banned from Catholic churches for being “tacky” and inappropriate – actually, I believe it was even labelled “the instrument of the devil.”
With all the traditions that we have lost or almost lost over the years, I would rather keep the tradition of lighting votive candles for prayer – even if it is electric – than lose the tradition or practice altogether.

 

[tafan]

While one can not beat the authenticity of lighting a real votive prayer candle, there are many practical reasons for replacing them with electric candles – fire risk, insurance costs, labor cost of maintaining the real candles and quite frankly the cost of the real candles have “gone through the roof.” In the past, a person could put a $1 or $2 (depending on the size) and it would cover the cost of the candle and the parish would generate a little extra revenue. With the rising cost of real candles, it would be almost impossible for the parish to break even.
For those who say that electric votive are “tacky” or inappropriate, consider that for many centuries the organ was banned from Catholic churches for being “tacky” and inappropriate – actually, I believe it was even labelled “the instrument of the devil.”
With all the traditions that we have lost or almost lost over the years, I would rather keep the tradition of lighting votive candles for prayer – even if it is electric – than lose the tradition or practice altogether.

I believe the costs associated with our candles are about 1/4 the average donation. We use small tea cup 4 hour candles. Labor: our parishes I know of rely on two or three people who attend daily mass to take care of it each morning before mass. Can’t imagine a paid staff person doing this anywhere. I have already addressed the insurance cost. Your post seems rather uninformed.

 

[RonThePilgrim]

I can assure you that my original post was not uninformed. We had four racks of large 7 day votives candles (real) and replaced them a few years ago with 2 racks of electric votive candles. At the time that the decision was made the 7 day votives had risen in cost and the various suppliers required a fairly large minimum order. We are a small parish and we no longer had the storage space for the boxes of candles and YES the time of a parish staff person to maintain the candle racks was an issue.
There is an insurance issue and cost --whether you wish to believe it or not. As far as usage of the votive lamps, it has not gone down since they were electrified. It had actually dropped considerably BEFORE we made the change. That was one of the reasons that the large minimum order requirements from our suppliers was a problem.
We were able to keep the tradition and there is nothing evil or tacky about the electric votive candles.

 

[agw123]

Also, the fact that it is a very old custom in the Church, should be an indication there is a serious reason for it. Even if we don’t understand something, when we know it is a very old tradition, we should grant it our respect. Doing otherwise is an insult to our ancestors.

It was an old tradition that the priest have our back to us during Mass and speak only Latin… It doesnt make the mass now any less holy that we are using English or other languages and the priest faces us.

 

[johnmann]

I definitely see the need for it to be electric but I do think it’s tacky. I’m not sure there’s any way to make an electric solution not tacky. Since these are private devotions and not liturgical, there’s no reason why a parish wouldn’t be able to do something completely different.

https://imageshack.us/a/img98/5062/n1515360128303552441697pl7.jpg

 

[TimothyH]

Kind of yuck, but understandable. Fake candles will never replace the smoky scent and soft crackles of burning beeswax, wicks and matches!

Matches? No, no, no… People flick those things, think they are out and throw them on the floor, or worse, in the garbage. Go ahead and try to find matches nowadays anyway. Good luck. Sulphur is not fashionable these days and leaving packs of matches laying around the narthex is a non-starter (pardon the pun). Those long lighters are what we use.

Candles should never crackle. If they do then they are not manufactured properly, probably contaminated with water or something else altogether foul. A well made candle in still air will burn very clean and produce almost no smoke.

The ladies in our parish purchased 90 cases of votive candles from Ikea. It took three SUV’s to bring them to the Church and they are stacked everywhere imaginable. I wouldn’t like the electric ones myself but the votive offerings don’t pay for the candles, that’s for sure.

-Tim-

 

[TimothyH]

Also, the fact that it is a very old custom in the Church, should be an indication there is a serious reason for it. Even if we don’t understand something, when we know it is a very old tradition, we should grant it our respect. Doing otherwise is an insult to our ancestors.

What about bells?

Bells used at Mass were always a single bell, rang three times… ding… ding… ding… It was a very old custom and you would never hear multi-bell “ring-a-ling” chimes. Do multi-bell chimes insult our ancestors?

-Tim-

 

[RonThePilgrim]

I really don’t see where electric candles are"tacky." Yes, they are a newer invention than candles that burned with a real flame but new doesn’t make it “tacky.” Now if they were like lava lamps or their light was reflecting off of a disco ball that with strobe lights blinking that would be tacky.

I repeat my earlier statement – For a number of centuries, the pipe organ was banned from Catholic churches and they were even labeled the “instrument of the devil.” Today - almost every Catholic church has a pipe organ or some type of organ and organ music is considered “traditional Catholic music.” The reality is that new inventions do come along and eventually they do get incorporated into our lives — including the life of the Catholic church.
I am trying to remain respectful of those with different opinions but at some point I just want to scream – “change happens … new things come along … get over it.” Pope Francis made a good point shortly before he was elected that often times we (Catholics) get caught up in trivial matters and call them huge problems – but the sad fact is that there are tens of millions of our fellow humans are facing REAL PROBLEMS – like starving to death, living in poverty, not have access to clean drinking water or basic health care, not having access to even basic education, living under oppression and constant fear for their lives — basically not having any hope for today let alone for a better tomorrow. If your biggest worry is that the electric votive candles might look tacky than you should get on your knees and thank God – and move on to an issue that really matters.

 

[Aran_Houlihan]

But the FIRE CODE may be different from area to area. Here in NYC, unattended fire in a public accomodation is generally prohibited. If you can afford to have someone watch it 24x7, then you can have it, but most Churches cannot./QUOTE

That is over reacting this is why i dot like heal and safety in my parish we have real candles I think electric voted candles are tacky and Fake candles will never replace the smoky scent and soft crackles of burning beeswax, wicks and matches!

 

[RonThePilgrim]

Quite honestly, a number of churches and shrines have had electric votive candles for atleast the past 20 years. Few churches have the real candles with flames anymore – so I think one can safely say that electric votive lights HAVE replaced real candles with flames. Just like pipe organs were once banned but eventually became the “king” of liturgical instruments - change happens. Sorry – that is just reality. Change happens and in the case of organs and, now, of votive prayer candles – it is not a bad thing.

 

[VivienneJ]

I was just talking with a friend of mine about this yesterday. Her husband is very ill and I went to light a candle for him. We have the electrical ones too. I struggled with what to say to her “I lit a candle for your husband or rather, I pressed a button for your husband.” We had a good laugh over it.

We ended up agreeing that I pressed God’s buttons for her husband.

I understand the reason why we no longer have real votive candles, but there’s nothing like a real flame. This was somewhat silly to my kids. “What do you mean mom, press a button for Jesus?”

We do still have real candles, we use the tea-light ones; but the place where they are is outside and on the rare days when it is windy, you light your candle from one of the others already burning and as you place it the wind blows it out! That ‘freaks’ me a little.

 

[agw123]

agw123;10349981:

But the FIRE CODE may be different from area to area. Here in NYC, unattended fire in a public accomodation is generally prohibited. If you can afford to have someone watch it 24x7, then you can have it, but most Churches cannot.

The Church I grew up had electric candles all the way back in the 70s. What is over reacting about FIRE CODE?? Old churches made of wood plus unattended fire is a burned down Church waiting to happen.

 

[johnmann]

It’s not the newness that makes it tacky. It’s that it screams “I’m an imitation!” I’m prefer the use of incense sticks if that would solve the problems inherent with candles.

 

[Cavaille-Coll]

Or the explosion of glass when the candles burn all the way down and the glass gets too hot. I think I counted 6 candle holder explosions during low Mass a few days ago.

My parish has a couple of racks of candles with the traditional 10-hour glass candleholders, which formerly burned standard votive candles. We switched to a type which comes in a small plastic cup that fits inside the glass holder. They last about five hours and since they have their own cup, the glasses never break or turn black. When the candle is burned up, we just throw away the plastic cups and drop in new ones. They cost a bit more than the regular ones, but we make up for it in not buying new glasses every month.

 

[aspirant]

I’m prefer the use of incense sticks if that would solve the problems inherent with candles.

I’d be down with that, but I think too many people would complain about the smoke and/or aroma. Some people protest the use of incense during Mass-- can’t imagine how bad they might hate this.

 

[RonThePilgrim]

I imagine when they made the transition from burning lamps of olive oil (which they did in the first few centuries of Church history) to burning candles made from beeswax that there was quite an outcry – “oh, the humanity … it is tacky.” Apparently, they got over it and the Church survived that crisis. It may take a few years but the church will survive this current crisis generated by using electric votive lamps to replace real flame votive candles.

 

[gspmcc1]

I also despise the phony electric votive candles! I visited Rome last year and stopped in quite a few churches, hoping to light a candle for a sick friend back home. They were ALL electric! How very sad.