Elijah and heaven

[Mikaele]

Before Jesus died and was resurrected, were there people in Heaven? if not, then where did Elijah go?

 

[Fidelis]

Before Jesus died and was resurrected, were there people in Heaven? if not, then where did Elijah go?

When the ancient Jews spoke of heaven, they were referring to one of three things.

**–The first was the visible sky, where the birds fly and the clouds sail through.

–Higher than that was “the firmament,” where the sun, moon, stars and other heavenly bodies were. They imagined it as kind of a revolving half-dome.

–Highest still was the Heaven in which God dwelt. St. Paul describes himself being taken up into this Third Heaven in 2 Cor 12.**

(If you have access to a New American Bible, St. Joseph Edition, it has a diagram of this on page 4 of the Old Testament.)

Which of these did Elijah go to? Probably the Bible describes Elisha watching him be taken up into the first, since that was as far as the human eye could see in the daytime.

Since the Heaven where God dwells was not open until the resurrection and ascension of Christ, he didn’t go there. The Jews believed in a shadowy place of the dead called *Sheol *(roughly equivalent to the Greek Hades or Tartarus). It was there he was taken, apparently body and soul.

 

[zarthan]

I would not disagree with Fidelis. Although it seems to be a mystery, because both Elijah and Moses were seen by Peter, James and John on the Mount of Transfiguration while Elijah and Moses were speaking to Jesus.

Then of course, we also have Enoch who was ‘translated’ or ‘caught up’ (‘harpazo’ in the Septuagint) to heaven.

 

[zarthan]

1. [In order to learn] that bodies did continue in existence for a lengthened period, as long as it was God’s good pleasure that they should flourish, let [these heretics] read the Scriptures, and they will find that our predecessors advanced beyond seven hundred, eight hundred, and nine hundred years of age; and that their bodies kept pace with the protracted length of their days, and participated in life as long as God willed that they should live. But why do I refer to these men? For Enoch, when he pleased God, was translated in the same body in which he did please Him, thus pointing out by anticipation the translation of the just. Elijah, too, was caught up [when he was yet] in the substance of the [natural] form; thus exhibiting in prophecy the assumption of those who are spiritual, and that nothing stood in the way of their body being translated and caught up. For by means of the very same hands through which they were moulded at the beginning, did they receive this translation and assumption. For in Adam the hands of God had become accustomed to set in order, to rule, and to sustain His own workmanship, and to bring it and place it where they pleased. Where, then, was the first man placed? In paradise certainly, as the Scripture declares “And God planted a garden [paradisum] eastward in Eden, and there He placed the man whom He had formed.” [4471] And then afterwards when [man] proved disobedient, he was cast out thence into this world. Wherefore also the elders who were disciples of the apostles tell us that those who were translated were transferred to that place (for paradise has been prepared for righteous men, such as have the Spirit; in which place also Paul the apostle, when he was caught up, heard words which are unspeakable as regards us in our present condition [4472] ), and that there shall they who have been translated remain until the consummation [of all things], as a prelude to immortality. (Irenaeus Against Heresies, Book V,Chap V, 1.)

 

[hoop0826]

That reminded me of the important value of the writings and teachings of the early Church Fathers on difficult understandings of the Faith and Scripture.

 

[DPMartin]

1. [In order to learn] that bodies did continue in existence for a lengthened period, as long as it was God’s good pleasure that they should flourish, let [these heretics] read the Scriptures, and they will find that our predecessors advanced beyond seven hundred, eight hundred, and nine hundred years of age; and that their bodies kept pace with the protracted length of their days, and participated in life as long as God willed that they should live. But why do I refer to these men? For Enoch, when he pleased God, was translated in the same body in which he did please Him, thus pointing out by anticipation the translation of the just. Elijah, too, was caught up [when he was yet] in the substance of the [natural] form; thus exhibiting in prophecy the assumption of those who are spiritual, and that nothing stood in the way of their body being translated and caught up. For by means of the very same hands through which they were moulded at the beginning, did they receive this translation and assumption. For in Adam the hands of God had become accustomed to set in order, to rule, and to sustain His own workmanship, and to bring it and place it where they pleased. Where, then, was the first man placed? In paradise certainly, as the Scripture declares “And God planted a garden [paradisum] eastward in Eden, and there He placed the man whom He had formed.” [4471] And then afterwards when [man] proved disobedient, he was cast out thence into this world. Wherefore also the elders who were disciples of the apostles tell us that those who were translated were transferred to that place (for paradise has been prepared for righteous men, such as have the Spirit; in which place also Paul the apostle, when he was caught up, heard words which are unspeakable as regards us in our present condition [4472] ), and that there shall they who have been translated remain until the consummation [of all things], as a prelude to immortality. (Irenaeus Against Heresies, Book V,Chap V, 1.)

Zarthan

One could say with confidences that were ever the Lord is His People are with Him, even the man on the cross was told by the Lord that he would be with the Lord in Paradise (you can’t see Him, unless you are with Him). What should be understood is as Jesus has said, God is the God of the Living, not the dead. And even in the transfiguration with Moses and Elijah, one might notice, they were with the Lord, alive, in the Lord.

 

[FaithJoy]

Remember, Heaven isn’t bound by space and time.Whether Elijah was taken there then has no meaning/understanding to us here on earth. What is important is what God knows whether or not if we or Elijah deserve the gift of Heaven in God’s knowledge of seeing any of us there in “His all knowing state”, not in a moment of time.